Apathy towards national team

[Ambitious]

Jesus.

 

Lee Grant

 

John Brayford

 

Anton Ferdinand

 

Wes morgan

 

Liam Ridgewell

 

Jason Puncheon

 

Henri Lansbury

 

Shaun Wright-Phillips

 

Chris Eagles

 

Cameron Jerome

 

Grant Holt

 

 

every single one of them would walk into Scotland, Ireland, Northern Ireland and Wales squad, if not side.

 

Most people are being ridiculous - look at other international sides... we're no-where near as bad as people make out.

 

We've got a very solid national pool

[Ambitious]

We needed to field a team to beat Ukraine, Moldova, Poland, Montenegro and San Morino.

 

We could play out under 18s and they would walk over San Morino.

 

We could put out a team of decent english championship players to beat Moldova, and the same with Montenegro.

 

Poland and Ukraine have half decent sides (half decent) but 95% of the players mentioned would walk into their squads, remember Majewski got called up not long ago.

 

all in all - comparable to the teams we have to compete with, we're far, far better IMO.

[Mostyn6]

see this is where you're all looking at it backwards.

 

When the England team was it's best, it was the Grant Holts and Rickie Lamberts that were the spirit of the team. These days we are wrapped up in the supposed superstars. Muespach has just picked on a list of players and written them off when the odds are they'd have beat the England side last night.

 

Quite simply, if you're about my age, or older, you'll remember that it didn't matter whether you'd played in the champions league or not (English clubs were banned), what matter was if you could play as a team, that's where the likes of Holt and Lambert could and should be ahead of the likes of Welbeck in the pecking order.

 

I remember players from teams like Derby, Forest, QPR, Rangers, Ipswich, Norwich (then second tier), Wolves (also second tier), Southampton and other unfashionable and lowly placed teams having mainstays in the national side. Nowadays you have these little cliques developing in the squad caused by five Man United players, five Spurs players, five Liverpool players etc.

 

What we need is for players to be picked on their ability to play in 'united' side, with pride and passion.

 

What we have is a passionless manager picking players whose conduct should prevent them from ever getting near the side!

[bcnram]

1990 was the start of the BOOM following England, before that the gates were always terrible, I remember going to see them play teams like Turkey and hammering them 8-0 i think and there being a few thousand there (also remember goign to Brazil in 1986 at Wembley with 100,000 there)

The gates for the big games have dropped off, in the 90's we would never have struggled to sell out a game against Sctoland for instance.!

 

The movement of the games to a Friday is also a genius piece of innovation, ensuring that no one outside of London can go without taking a day off work. The Chumpions league and the Premiershite shouldn't be allowed to dictate to the FA when we play an international game.

 

As for missing the violence, i never said that, what i would say is that i miss the atmosphere, the spirit, the togetherness of follwing England, the violence, like i said before, was so easy to avoid if you really wanted to, and also so easy to get involved in if you wanted to.!

Nope!! Gates during the 1990's were also poor in a lot of cases (I just had a quick look at the even years). The lowest was 21,000. Gates have been much higher in recent years. I am not surprised that Scotland gate was only 80,000. The media here was full of there being potential trouble, and to be honest, the game holds little appeal these days.

 

I definitely did not say you missed the violence or anything like that!!!

[DcfcNews12]

I dont know why he didnt give the younger players a chance agianst san marino or moldova.my team would be to create the golden generation.

 

 

 

                                          Hart

 

Jenkinson         Cahill             Jones              Shaw

 

 

                 Wilshere      Barkley         Henderson

 

 

 

 Redmond                Sturridge               OX

 

 

 

I have been very impressed with henderson after all he didnt choose to be bought for 20 million but the stick he got was awful for a young lad.He captianed the u21 side very well and was the only one who performed in each game at the tournament.He alot more like gerrard than hughes.

 

 

Barkley is a tall rooney can shoot on either foot and for a big player is surprisingly quick. 

 

 

I dont have a problem with the players we produce we have alot of talented 17-19 year olds at the moment but some of them need to realise just sitting a top clubs u21 is not equivalent to championship football.Havent watched the u21s alot in the past 10 years it has massively improved before the team consisted of the players from the man u,chelsea reserves etc who to be honest even with my football knowledge i didn't know who they were.Now the team is made up of first team regualrs or some are on the bench but for a top side.Even the u19s is full of players who are loaned out to league 1/championship clubs.

 

The error is now knowing a system(a way of playing) somthing that has been missing since hoddle.Watching england recently we go from passing short to booting in the corners.

 

I watch alot of football from all round the world from youth games of foreign countries to second tier games in other divisions.

I can tell you 5 players i have picked out of u21s can become big england stars if managed correctly

 

 

Luke Shaw

Nick Powell

Will hughes

Nathan redmond

Sam Byram-(pulled out with injury but would have started)

[Alph]

Any lads abroad who have spent considerable time here,

It's club before country here. It's very tribal. Wayne Rooney will never be England's Wayne Rooney. He'll alway be United's Rooney.

There's cynicism towards England internationals.

Steven Gerrard earns huge money. We are told he plays in the best league in the world for one of the biggest and best clubs in the world. He's the face of several brands. So why is Joe Bloggs who earns £20 playing in Peru giving him a game?

There's that sort of mentality from fans.

The players recognise that fans aren't 100% behind them. That they have high expectations and zero tolerance. There's massive pressure to perform and any failures will be heavily criticised.

Then the clubs pay them these ridiculous wages. At these clubs are fans that back them. Back them against a bad performance or a loss of form.

Can you see United fans backing Gerrard for England in the same way? Everton fans? Any non Liverpool fans?

And what has any player got to gain by playing for England? Pressure from their club managers? Heavy criticism from rival fans?

It's a bad relationship and it goes both ways.

My question to the lads abroad is, is this like this abroad?

Do Barca fans back Real players? Does the whole country get behind Germany even though most the country dislikes Bayern (who obviously been the first port of call for players over the years).

Or does this just exist here? In the most hyped league with the most hyped players earning the most money? Is it just here where people can't turn their loyalty to England?

I know I don't like England because of the hype and money they get paid. They're not worthy of either imo. Most over priced nationality! I guess I'm a typical fan?

[Day]

I don't like Coronation Street because its *****, I don't watch it then sit and moan about the storylines and overpaid actors, I simply don't watch it.

[Leicester Ram]

Jenkinson

 

Finland international and NOWHERE NEAR the standard of Kyle Walker, who isn't exactly ancient

[Leicester Ram]

I don't like Coronation Street because its *****, I don't watch it then sit and moan about the storylines and overpaid actors, I simply don't watch it.

 

Good joke

[Day]

Finland international and NOWHERE NEAR the standard of Kyle Walker, who isn't exactly ancient

"http://www.arsenal.com/assets/_files/scaled/696x392/feb_13/gun__1362051013_jenkinson_england1" alt="gun__1362051013_jenkinson_england1">

[Day]

Good joke

Better than your Jenkinson Finland one, need to update your Football Manager game

[Leicester Ram]

"http://www.arsenal.com/assets/_files/scaled/696x392/feb_13/gun__1362051013_jenkinson_england1" alt="gun__1362051013_jenkinson_england1">

 

Carl Daniel Jenkinson (born 8 February 1992) is a professional footballer who plays for Arsenal as a defender. Jenkinson began his career with Charlton Athletic before joining Arsenal in 2011. He represented both the English and Finnish national teams at youth level before making his debut for the England national team in 2012

 

My bad.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

FIFA actually   

[Day]

Played v Sweden recently, had to get clearance from FIFA. Google your facts before posting in future or I'll be issuing you a warning

[Ambitious]

Nothing between Jenkinson and Walker for me.

Both good premier league players, both have faults. I think walker is better going forward but Jenkinson is more switched on at the back.

[Ambitious]

Barkley however didn't impress at either Wednesday nor Leeds yet has started brilliantly for Everton.

Mental.

[Alph]

I don't like Coronation Street because its *****, I don't watch it then sit and moan about the storylines and overpaid actors, I simply don't watch it.

Good point. But as a football fan don't we all take an interest in all major football events?

Like for me sitting and watching England is like sitting and watching United or Real Madrid. I'm neutral and I just want the either the underdog or the best team to win. Last night I wanted England to win. Against Italy in the Euros I didn't want England to win because they were riding their luck and weren't playing well. Sometimes I simply want them to fail because of the hype and the money that's thrown upon them when they aren't even the best in their trade. Same goes for Chelsea

[Day]

Why are you bothered by what they earn? I don't watch football because of the money, I watch it for the football. England's performances haven't been great no but Derby have hardly been given us much to shout about. I'm not going to turn my back on club and country, I may as well stop watching football full stop.

It's all down to expectations, it's obvious who's are set to high after games last night. The more realistic fans were expecting a tough game, anyone who thought Ukraine away would be a walk in the park are the ones that need to sit and have a word with themselves.

Money has ruined the game we know, everybody knows but sitting here moaning about it will do **** all, the day it gets to me I will simply walk away from Derby and England at the same time.

[ronnieronalde]

There's a big SMACK US ALL RIGHT IN THE FACE reason why we're not competing and that's the fact not enough of our young lads are experiencing ENOUGH first team football, at top level.

It goes back to the buying behaviour of english clubs and why english talent is being massively held back.

I won't post the whole article cos it's bloody long, evven longer than this post, but for those who are interested there's a great breakdown of the spending in each window in this article on the bbc

When ENGLISH Premier League Clubs are spending 340m pounds to buy SPANISH based talent to play in their ENGLISH first teams, what are the english lads supposed to do?

They spent 210m pounds with clubs in France and 190m pounds in Italy, none of those players are eligible to play for England. Holland got 135m of English clubs money, German clubs got 125m of English clubs money, even Portugal got 100m.

On players currently based in England, they spend 140m.

You know what I think is happening? We're funding the development of other countries youngsters, we buy them for fortunes so they can go and produce other little wizards to sell us in a few years, all the time our own talent is being held back because of Juan or Xavier the next world superstar with dodgy teeth and curiously nice greasy hair comes strolling into our game, bringing his incredible technique with him, which we all love watching so much on Sky.

Premier League squads packed with foreign players, foreign owners and foregin manager and we might never get the chance to see if we don't have some incredible potential English talent coming through.

it's really sickening how we've sold the english top flight game in it's entirity to television and to foreign investors.

Buy british? What for?

Play British players when I've just shpunted 50m quid on this superstar from Spain? Not on your nelly.

We've got it spot on I think, I mean Derby as club, (which is irnoic cosindering we've got foreign owner) produce the odd talented youngster, get him in the first team early and wait until the Premier Leagues equivalent of "the kiddie catcher" comes into town with bags full of cash.

"Lolipops Children?" - The evil b'stards are killing our game for cash.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/23913033

[Alph]

Why are you bothered by what they earn? I don't watch football because of the money, I watch it for the football. England's performances haven't been great no but Derby have hardly been given us much to shout about. I'm not going to turn my back on club and country, I may as well stop watching football full stop.

It's all down to expectations, it's obvious who's are set to high after games last night. The more realistic fans were expecting a tough game, anyone who thought Ukraine away would be a walk in the park are the ones that need to sit and have a word with themselves.

Money has ruined the game we know, everybody knows but sitting here moaning about it will do **** all, the day it gets to me I will simply walk away from Derby and England at the same time.

To be honest mate I don't take it very serious. I'm all about Derby. England win/lose/draw doesn't bother me. I just watch them like you would watch Newcastle or Spurs etc. England are easy to take cheap shots at because they are so hyped. Like Leeds being called a massive club. I just sit here and I'll look at the wages/hype/fees of Lampard, Gerrard, Beckham and J Cole as they struggle to beat Greece or whoever. Same as you'd do with say Leicester or someone with hype/money.

I don't moan about England. I just don't feel any attachment because I don't really like many of them (in the football world).

I know your a fan so I know it gets on your nerves. It would me if I had to listen to the same ***** about Derby.

I've never been drawn to the national side. Not sure why. I think Derby are the only team I constantly support in anything. I don't even root for Brits in boxing, F1, tennis etc. I happen to like Lewis Hamilton for his racing style though. I dislike Murray, I like Tyson Fury, I like Roger Federer and Nadal, I dislike Djokovic, I dislike Button, I like Cahill, I dislike Gerrard...

That's how I look at it. Only Derby. Dunno why.

[LeedsCityRam]

 

What we need is for players to be picked on their ability to play in 'united' side, with pride and passion.

 

What we have is a passionless manager picking players whose conduct should prevent them from ever getting near the side!

 

With all due respect, those type of comments drive me up the wall. Don't worry - it isn't just you, I hear this from folk in the street all the way up to "expert" pundits on the telly.

 

I have absolutely no doubt that our strongest XI do have "passion" to play for England - Lampard, Cole & Gerrard to name 3 of our best players (all playing with top club sides) all have 100 caps or more. If they didn't care, why haven't they long since retired? They don't need the money, they don't need the hassle. Also players are picked on ability - I can't think of one obvious candidate from a so called unfashionable club who warrants instant inclusion in the first XI - can you?

 

The reason for poor performances by the national side are;

• ridiculous pressure put on the team by a demanding media. Look at the "outrage" after a very decent away result this week. Frankly its a joke & is borne out of self-interested sports tabloid journos wanting to stir up some interest in buying their rags after a pretty boring week football-wise
• comparative lack of technique compared to continental players
• comparative lack of footballing intelligence compared to continental players. English players are not encouraged to think of "solutions" for themselves. They are conditioned to play a certain way (4-4-2, hit the big man blah blah blah)  - how many times do we see English players taking the wrong option when passing/shooting/positioning themselves? How many English players are playmakers for Premiership sides? To my mind there is one - Jack Wilshere. And even he wasn't good on Tues.

Re the apathy - I think poor performances, the total dominance of the Premiership & the scarcity of top quality English players are all factors. I remember 20 years ago friendlies being a big deal - now even qualifying seems a chore. And for the first time last summer, I wasn't gutted when we managed our usual quarter final exit on penalties..