Animal is a Ram Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 I was at the game tonight and I'm in no doubt that Clough's second half decisions cost us dearly, Bolton were poor, and were there for the taking if we'd been brave, I liked the look of Sammon, he held the ball up well and gave us a physical presence, he took him off, invited some Bolton pressure and unsurprisingly we lost the game, a game where we looked comfortable for at least a point. I hope he can admit he got it completely wrong tonight. Same for me. The minute we took Sammon off it was men against boys. Quite literally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ash Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 If we'd have drawn there would be no complaints but to make the changes he did with Bolton playing awful is typical Clough. I would love to come on here and congratulate him on a brilliant tactical change but it just never happens…ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davey B Posted August 21, 2012 Author Share Posted August 21, 2012 This topic should really be "is clough a good manager". He could be a tactical genius, but for his alienation of players through poor man management means that his execution will always be poor. Harry Redknapp isn't perhaps the greatest tactician but he runs rings around clough getting the best out of his players. Please can we all wake up and realise it doesn't have to be this way. We don't have to be this poor. We could possibly have a manager that inspires his players and attains some decent level of consistency. We could perhaps even thank clough for sorting out the wage bill etc as he picks up his hat and strolls the hell out the door. This post is so on point. Take it from me, Theo is not injured, been late for training or fell out with any of the team. Theo not been in the squad is Clough been Clough. You may read or hear different stories, but what I am saying is the truth. Theo came to the game tonight to support his team mates. He could have stayed at home but he that isn't his style. If you knew what the gaffa was really like with the players you would truly cringe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duracell Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Bit strange that the team has never looked so good but Clough's decision making never so poor. Could be that Clough has been making some decisions with some base behind them which are unfortunate not to have worked - but so far, the only running theme is the second half substitutions which results in disappointing 2nd halves. 3/3 second halves lost now. 3/3 unbeaten first halves. Hmmm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Theo going to watch the match shows he is committed to the cause - something that Clough will appreciate. Hope he takes on board what Clough has said and we see him back on Saturdat Any word on why Buxton was on the bench? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CumbrianRam Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 ill before the game appaerently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamAbroad Posted August 21, 2012 Share Posted August 21, 2012 Another thing that annoyed me were the substitutions made after Bolton scored, why not make those changes the minute we went 1-0 down rather than 7 or 8 minutes later, I think Bennett came on around the 85th, hard to make an impact then, granted he hit the post, but it all just seemed far too late for me. We looked terrible lumping the ball up for Tyson and ward after Sammon came off, it was meat and drink for their centre halves. It left Tyson so isolated, gave Bolton easy possession at the back and consequently invited a lot of aerial balls into our box, Bolton were so physical, it was obvious, they'd eventually get something from a set piece or cross, which they did. I just can't help feeling that this could have all easily been avoided with a bit more tactical awareness later on in the second half, essentially negative changes lost us the game, we gave them all the encouragement they needed to go on and get a goal. Bolton fans were awful by the way, out sang em all match Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davey B Posted August 21, 2012 Author Share Posted August 21, 2012 Theo going to watch the match shows he is committed to the cause - something that Clough will appreciate. Hope he takes on board what Clough has said and we see him back on Saturdat Any word on why Buxton was on the bench? You really think Clough will appreciate it? I doubt it. I've heard that Clough said that Theo needs to try harder in training, but this is just the perception he wants to create. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Over reaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 There seems tobe a huge amount of criticism and negativity about but people need to get a grip. Dropping points v sheff wed The draw with sheff wed was no different to what happened v Warnocks Qpr a couple of seasons back. Occassionally big ugly teams will pile the ball into our box and get something as a result. They deserved a point.get over it. Theo getting dropped..big deal. He's hardly a world beater and is poor at retaining possession. And that stupid penalty betrayed a cokky silly attitude that needs checking. Team selection. We are still short of depth. We have lost ball and davies and Its taken god knows how long to replace hulse. But we are still short of options up front. Many teams have 4 or 5 strikers - Forest must have about 15 - we've got 3. Tactical changes. We haven't got alot of positive options from the bench. Until we do have then we can't replace like with like when sammon comes off etc. Man management Yes he's craap at it. He struggles with flair players, slags people off in the media, and doesn't seem to learn, but whats new. Win a couple and you'll all be saying how great he is. Its still august ffs. Hardly time to hit the panic button, even when we lose at wolves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I just don't understand it.. Why does he limit our attacking options with 20 minutes to go.. Why is he happy with a point away from home with 20 minutes to go.. His negativity and the effort over ability are the main reasons I dislike him as a manager.. Why take off a striker for a midfielder hoping to flood the midfield and settle for 0-0? Why does he do this, after 3 years of latter game feck ups does he persisit with something that doesn't work the stubborn git.. Also, when was the last time we scored a last minute equaliser? More than 2 seasons I can imagine, we didn't get one last season.. With 10 minutes to go surely it's kitchen sink time, ie. bringing on strikers for midfielders/defenders and pushing a CB up there.. So what does Clough do? Takes off an attacking player in Tyson for a younger inexperienced striker in Bennett.. Buxton is probably our best player in the air, why wasn't he brought on and pushed up top? Conceding a goal in the last minute whilst pushing for an equaliser wouldn't bother me if we at least put the opposition under pressure.. But we never do, Bolton won't have an easier last 10 minutes all season at protecting their lead. I don't claim to know better than Clough.. But his decision making and attitude late on in games is wrong.. Simply wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 2 things from last night:- NC may have taken Sammon off because he was short of match practice...only he knows that. I hope having Sammon up top does not lead to us constantly playing long ball. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 hasnt somebody already said sammon signalled to come up, if so that puts that to bed, how on earth can anyone say oh hes had a pre season. Limited options, I wasnt at the game so cant comment on what has happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DcfcMichael Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 Cloughs downfall is that he bottles match after match in around the 75th minute regardless of the scoreline. If we are winning by this point, then he will bring on defenders to hold out the lead, but in all fairness only about 50% of the time we actually hold on. If we are drawing by this point, again defenders on to hold out for a point, maybe the odd midfielder but he would just sit infront of the back four and would act as a centre half anyway. If we are losing, unlike other teams who will sub defenders for midfielders or midfielders for strikers, he would do the complete opposite and bring a striker off for a midfielder! Or in the rare occassion a striker does come on, it will be young Mason Bennett who lacks experience and only has 5 minutes to make an impact as Clough has waited too long. This has gotten so bad that whatever the score is at the 75th minute I almiost resign myself to the fact that that will be the score at full-time. How many goals do we score at 75 minutes onwards? Hardly any. This is the most frustrating thing about Clough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shake n Bake Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I'm starting to get fed up of conceding late goals every game, but you can't moan about Clough not making attacking subs last night because he did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shake n Bake Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I'm starting to get fed up of conceding late goals every game, but you can't moan about Clough not making attacking subs last night because he did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCFCfranco Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 only after sammon came off for hughes and bennett who isnt ready yet also came on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alf-Inge of Fudge Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I'm starting to get fed up of conceding late goals every game, but you can't moan about Clough not making attacking subs last night because he did. This was my point with how many you've conceded of late - is there something fundemetaly wrong with the mentality/tactics of the team to be repeatedly doing this? Bolton away's a tough game and I don't expect us to get anything there Friday either, so I wouldn't be concerned at conceding 2. Watford at home will be your big tell - a clean sheet there and you can relax, 2 or more conceded and Clough's tenure seriously needs looking at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Tibbs Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 We'll be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted August 22, 2012 Share Posted August 22, 2012 I agree with most the criticisms and they are the same things posters say, then get hammered for when we draw 1-1. I believe the term is wrist slashers or moaners. Yet if you look now those who moan a bit all the time about the way we play are not really sticking the boot in now. I think if you can recognise the faults in the team when we win you might get a bit of abuse off other posters, but when we lose there's no overreaction like some others who believed our problems were gone without any real proof. It's worth noting now that some posters, without naming names, aren't enjoying moaning. They have genuine concern even when they are supposed to be happy with a scrappy 1-0 at Watford. The problems Derby suffer just keep coming back. Which is why last night changes nothing. We were mostly happy to let Nigel lead us this season 2 weeks ago. What's happened in the first games is nothing new. Derby will probably finish midtable 10th - 15th. They'll be good patches and bad. Nothing has changed. If you were happy with Clough 2 weeks ago then 3 matches in August shouldn't change your mind. I spend loads of time moaning about the way we play and the 'if your face fits' thing. But I'm keeping the faith that it'll come good. Those who were talking about Play Offs and 'young, hungry, talented team' can at least keep faith after 1 draw and a defeat. Old problems magnified by pre season enthusiasm and a realistic start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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