Gary Teale Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Reading this you would think Martin was one of the best centre forwards in the world. Bent who has scored how many goals in his career, played for England, had 10s millions of £s spent on him yet he cant be anywhere near good as our Chrissy. Martin is a good player but people are going over the top about his play and his work rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r4derby Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Reading this you would think Martin was one of the best centre forwards in the world. Bent who has scored how many goals in his career, played for England, had 10s millions of £s spent on him yet he cant be anywhere near good as our Chrissy. Martin is a good player but people are going over the top about his play and his work rate.Its an issue of context. No one has said that Bent isn't as good as Martin. Chrissy is brilliant in our current (as of the last season and a half till March) system, the focal point who allows everyone around him time and space to play. Add to that the 20+ goals a season he scores, whats not to love. Bent isn't that type of player, he's a poacher. Quick off the mark, reacting faster than defenders, instinctive finishes.Put the two of them in a different squad and system, Bent probably starts 9 out of 10 over Martin. Our system might change, and if it does, then we can see the type of striker(s) we need. But as of right now, not even Clement knows for sure what his preferred formation will be. So lets just go with what we know - Martin works in our team, so does Bent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireRam Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 That's my opinion. Bent might score more goals, but Martin creates goals and can put in a shift defensively. We've seen several times that Martin doesn't fit in a front two.When? I can't remember many times when Martin has played with another striker when fit... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimmu Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 We could play 442, or 433, or 4231, or 532, or 343, or 4141, or 4411, or 424, or 4123, or 41212 or 3332 or 4321 we could play with wide men but then get overrun in the middle, we could play more in the middle of the park but have no width and leave our full backs exposed, we could play with one up front but then when we get he ball in the box no one is in there or the forward gets isolated, I haven't got a clue what I'm on about either, maybe I should just leave it to the manager who does it for a living. This would be my pick. South Korea were amazing with 3331 in 2002 World Cup. Just Imagine what we could achieve with one extra man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcnram Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Reading this you would think Martin was one of the best centre forwards in the world. Bent who has scored how many goals in his career, played for England, had 10s millions of £s spent on him yet he cant be anywhere near good as our Chrissy. Martin is a good player but people are going over the top about his play and his work rate.In the role that he plays, Martin is the best CF I have seen play for Derby since John O'Hare. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posh Ram Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 When? I can't remember many times when Martin has played with another striker when fit...He played in a front two under Clough, alongside Russell, and didn't do much.When we went 4-2-4 with Martin and Bent, we weren't exactly brilliant going forward. Against Forest when we played Bent at right-wing (which was effectively two up front, with one winger) they didn't look much good either.I'm very pleased that we've signed Bent, but I don't think he and Martin will form an effective strike partnership together, and if it's one or the other, I'd pick Chrissy every time. Bent can still make a lot of impact from the bench, like he did last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireRam Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 He played in a front two under Clough, alongside Russell, and didn't do much.When we went 4-2-4 with Martin and Bent, we weren't exactly brilliant going forward. Against Forest when we played Bent at right-wing (which was effectively two up front, with one winger) they didn't look much good either.I'm very pleased that we've signed Bent, but I don't think he and Martin will form an effective strike partnership together, and if it's one or the other, I'd pick Chrissy every time. Bent can still make a lot of impact from the bench, like he did last season.The team has come a long, long way since then...Whenever Martin and Bent have played together, Martin hasn't been fit.Under a new coach with new tactics and playing ideas, they may well prove to be an effective strikeforce. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posh Ram Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 The team has come a long, long way since then...Whenever Martin and Bent have played together, Martin hasn't been fit.Under a new coach with new tactics and playing ideas, they may well prove to be an effective strikeforce.Okay, fair enough. Jury's out for me personally, I just feel that we're good enough offensively with Martin as the loan striker - why sacrifice a midfielder or pace out wide to accommodate Bent, making us much more shaky defensively.It's true Clement will have new tactics and formations though, so we'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Okay, fair enough. Jury's out for me personally, I just feel that we're good enough offensively with Martin as the loan striker - why sacrifice a midfielder or pace out wide to accommodate Bent, making us much more shaky defensively.It's true Clement will have new tactics and formations though, so we'll see.Do you know if Martin needs an operation on his hamstring or is he in the clear yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Posh Ram Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Do you know if Martin needs an operation on his hamstring or is he in the clear yet. No idea, unfortunately. Although I think we'd know by now if he needed an operation, they'd have diagnosed it before the holidays, surely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 No idea, unfortunately. Although I think we'd know by now if he needed an operation, they'd have diagnosed it before the holidays, surely.I read in DET I think it was about a couple of weeks ago that they were looking at it again in a couple of weeks to see if he needed an operation. Ive heard nothing since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
needles Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 The last thing in the DET was that the injury was clearing up well without the need for surgery, but it was in the process of clearing up, not cleared up. I guess he's be one of the ones back in earlier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireRam Posted June 9, 2015 Share Posted June 9, 2015 Okay, fair enough. Jury's out for me personally, I just feel that we're good enough offensively with Martin as the loan striker - why sacrifice a midfielder or pace out wide to accommodate Bent, making us much more shaky defensively.It's true Clement will have new tactics and formations though, so we'll see.Oh I agree, it will probably be a case of trial and error initially. I just think it would be a shame to leave either Martin or Bent on the bench because they're both 2 of the best strikers in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaftesbury Street Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 A new RB and it will start to look quite good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam_DCFC_1994 Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 A new RB and it will start to look quite good! Fear for Christie in this formation. He will be exposed no end of times which wont be good for his confidence. Would really like to see him start the season well because he definitely has potential! we could do with Russell playing in front of him instead of Ince so he has some protection! Ince does not like to work back for the team, obviously he makes up for that with his qualities infront of goal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireRam Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Fear for Christie in this formation. He will be exposed no end of times which wont be good for his confidence. Would really like to see him start the season well because he definitely has potential! we could do with Russell playing in front of him instead of Ince so he has some protection! Ince does not like to work back for the team, obviously he makes up for that with his qualities infront of goal!Incorrect.At times last year, Ince worked harder than Russell in terms of tracking back and offering defensive cover.It's one of the reasons I rate him so highly! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam_DCFC_1994 Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 Incorrect.At times last year, Ince worked harder than Russell in terms of tracking back and offering defensive cover.It's one of the reasons I rate him so highly!shut up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derbyram1 Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 shut up.I'm sorry but you're wrong, Ince tracked back far more than I ever thought he would.Numerous matches he was tracking back, its just a shame he had to as he is wasted in our own half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam_DCFC_1994 Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 I'm sorry but you're wrong, Ince tracked back far more than I ever thought he would. Numerous matches he was tracking back, its just a shame he had to as he is wasted in our own half. lol it wasn't a serious post, that's fair enough! For the matches i watched i didn't think Ince worked as hard defensively as JR, but thats just my opinion. In all honesty i hadn't paid that much attention to Ince's work rate during match days so your probably right. The only player i ever really watched closely was Keogh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derbyram1 Posted June 10, 2015 Share Posted June 10, 2015 lol it wasn't a serious post, that's fair enough! For the matches i watched i didn't think Ince worked as hard defensively as JR, but thats just my opinion. In all honesty i hadn't paid that much attention to Ince's work rate during match days so your probably right. The only player i ever really watched closely was Keogh. TBH I expected Ince to sit on the halfway line and not give a damn about helping back, I (in my opinion) was proven wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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