Curtains Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 IMO with this squad and manager it's already a distant dream even with loans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joeb93 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 are you stupid? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 are you stupid? you got the first two words in the wrong order Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 your a realist Sage arnt you. I have no idea whether that's a statement, sarcasm or a question, however I am a part time Grammar Nazi, see me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Pardon me Farted again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Bloody nora Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Why every time the Rams and Clough are criticized do you go on the attack. We are Rams fans You may have just answered your own question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 5 games in. Bolton are bottom Blackpool are top Bournemouth are in the play offs Every year without fail people just refuse to ignore the league table. Even the form table doesn't tell you much at this stage. People say look after 10-15 games. I say it's still too early. Try looking after the New Year busy period. 5 games. Five!! When people who backed Nigel over the years say that they expect results this season I thought they meant this season. Not August Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I want the best for the Rams and I know you do as well but ask yourself is Clough the right man for the job. I suggest not and I honestly believe top 6 won't happen. If I'm wrong ill hold my hands up but what's your point of view on Top 6 and the Manager honestly I think he has made some mistakes, buying Tyson, not buying a top CB this summer, not picking Eustace/not playing the diamond on Saturday. However, there are many frenzied, illogical and frankly desperate attacks on NC and the club that anyone who remains calm after a single defeat sounds like a club apologist. The title and therefore thrust of this thread is ill thought out and a grotesque overreaction. Therefore, I will attack such an unnecessary criticism. I am quite happy to debate tactics, purchases and selections, but Punch and Judy threads will only get a Punch and Judy response from posters. I would be interested to see how how many FIFA13 experts would get promoted when 7/8 clubs have 2, 3 or 4 times their budget. We will need skill, luck and good judgement to finish top six and I'm sure even a successful campaign will have its Burnley moments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I think Nigel has been manager for about 250 games, not five. Anyone criticising him is not doing so after just 5 games, it's a culmination of the past 5 years and the realisation that we are following the same patterns of inconsistency again. Some people were (and maybe still are) clinging to the hope that something in Nigel's management style has changed, and as a result, Derby's ability to get good results change too. I can see where Curtains is coming from, there's NOTHING, absolutely nothing to suggest, from what we have seen in five games, that this season, under Clough will be any improvement on the previous seasons under Clough. Don't jump on Curtains' back, ask yourself why he's so despondent so early in the season! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Ram Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Curtains, pull yourself together. The manager has said this is his best squad since he's been here, I desperately want us to be successful with him as the manager because rightly or wrongly I believe Derby County means something to him personally. That said, I don't think he's going to get us in the top 6 if I'm being honest but I'm up for giving him the full season and if we fair no better than last year I think it'll be time to say thanks for your efforts but we're going to try another route. It's difficult (for me) to slate the bloke because I'm not privvy to what he's been told by the board, I am sure, however, he knows more about football than me and he will be aware we need a commanding centre back and maybe he's asked for funds and been told no dice. I'm more for giving the board a hard time than the manager at this stage of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I think he has made some mistakes, buying Tyson, not buying a top CB this summer, not picking Eustace/not playing the diamond on Saturday. However, there are many frenzied, illogical and frankly desperate attacks on NC and the club that anyone who remains calm after a single defeat sounds like a club apologist. The title and therefore thrust of this thread is ill thought out and a grotesque overreaction. Therefore, I will attack such an unnecessary criticism. I am quite happy to debate tactics, purchases and selections, but Punch and Judy threads will only get a Punch and Judy response from posters. I would be interested to see how how many FIFA13 experts would get promoted when 7/8 clubs have 2, 3 or 4 times their budget. We will need skill, luck and good judgement to finish top six and I'm sure even a successful campaign will have its Burnley moments. skill? In small doses. The manager favours hard-work luck? you make your own luck. Don't shoot, you don't score! good judgement? Hmmmm..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Martin is class imo. I think we've got a good team. Think the defence is dodgy but Keogh is out of form. He's better than he's been showing. I don't think he's great but he's better than this. Buxton is fairly standard and would benefit if Keogh found form. Forsyth hasn't done enough and he needs to pick up. Freeman has been very good but he's not too bright defensively. So Keogh needs form. Buxton needs Keogh in form. Forsyth needs a bollocking and Freeman is currently on a steep learning curve. Basically I expect them to improve with time. I don't think they'll be the tightest defence. But decent enough. The midfield... Everything you want is there. Eustace - protection Hughes - ball playing Coutts - ball retention Bryson - ball retention Hendrick - ball playing Jacobs - flair/ attacking Ward - flair/attacking I don't see what more Nigel could dream of. His biggest mistake since the closing if last season is failing to find a system that suits. Basically I'm waiting for things to click. They might not. But 5 games is too early to expect smooth sailing. This is my view though. I'd give it time. If in February we have lost as much as we've won and the Play Offs will require a remarkable run if results to reach then I'd like new manager installed for the summer. Just too early mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Thanks It takes courage to be realistic on here because we are shot down. I want Clough to do well but I'm struggling with my convictions in supporting this guy Greatly amused by your own private, personal yet at the same time massively sweeping definition of the word realistic. Now I realise that you have the copyright on realism, I shall cease any further arguments as they are clearly pointless in the face of such certainty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asanovic Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Thanks It takes courage to be realistic on here because we are shot down . But no one ever remembers what they have said in the past and if Clough fails they certainly won't remember. I want Clough to do well but I'm struggling with my convictions in supporting this guy Curtains, realism is fine. The fact that so many people are in favour of Nige and so many feel he shouldn't be here shows it's a fine line. He's done a decent job so far in unenviable circumstances, but has also made mistakes. Opinions are exactly that, are you're entitled to yours as much as a supporter of him is to theirs. No one on here will shoot you down for saying he's not the right man. But where you'll struggle to garner serious responses is subjects like 'is it already too late for top six'. As well as being mathematically impossible it also comes across as winding people up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I think Nigel has been manager for about 250 games, not five. Anyone criticising him is not doing so after just 5 games, it's a culmination of the past 5 years and the realisation that we are following the same patterns of inconsistency again. Some people were (and maybe still are) clinging to the hope that something in Nigel's management style has changed, and as a result, Derby's ability to get good results change too. I can see where Curtains is coming from, there's NOTHING, absolutely nothing to suggest, from what we have seen in five games, that this season, under Clough will be any improvement on the previous seasons under Clough. Don't jump on Curtains' back, ask yourself why he's so despondent so early in the season! But a lot of people have said that this season is where they won't accept excuses. People that haven't said that every season before. I think people recognise the decent players. He also appears to have money available and seems pretty happy with what he's got. That's got to be a first? If I worked for you and I was **** and I asked for one more chance then you'd have to give me a chance or get rid of me. If you gave me a chance you wouldn't pull the rug from under me straight away. There's never really been any move made against Nigel. So the majority seem to have given their consent for him to try again. A fair few seem to be calling it time to step up to the mark. A chance isn't 5 games. These threads I can understand at the end of last season. A new man for a new season. 5 games in though... I think when we all decided this year was supposed to be our biggest year under Nigel they were expecting too much right from the start. We were never going to storm the opening games. Brighton away? Leicester and Burnley? I was gutted to see those roll out in the opening month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 But a lot of people have said that this season is where they won't accept excuses. People that haven't said that every season before. I think people recognise the decent players. He also appears to have money available and seems pretty happy with what he's got. That's got to be a first? If I worked for you and I was **** and I asked for one more chance then you'd have to give me a chance or get rid of me. If you gave me a chance you wouldn't pull the rug from under me straight away. There's never really been any move made against Nigel. So the majority seem to have given their consent for him to try again. A fair few seem to be calling it time to step up to the mark. A chance isn't 5 games. These threads I can understand at the end of last season. A new man for a new season. 5 games in though... I think when we all decided this year was supposed to be our biggest year under Nigel they were expecting too much right from the start. We were never going to storm the opening games. Brighton away? Leicester and Burnley? I was gutted to see those roll out in the opening month. Alpha, If you worked for me, I'd consider your mitigating circumstances, for example, have you received the right training, are you actually qualified to do the job, have you got the tools available to do the job, if the job too much for you, are you even capable of doing what I am asking. etc etc I'd hopefully have seen enough in five years to suggest that given the right training and tools for the job, along with support, confidence and backing, you could achieve maximum potential with what you've got. Whether that be promotion, or 10th is the sticking point here. Some would say we are not good enough for promotion (player wise), others would agree but also point out that we've still under-acheived with what we do have. Clough has not been here five games, he's been here 5 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I think Nigel has been manager for about 250 games, not five. Anyone criticising him is not doing so after just 5 games, it's a culmination of the past 5 years and the realisation that we are following the same patterns of inconsistency again. Some people were (and maybe still are) clinging to the hope that something in Nigel's management style has changed, and as a result, Derby's ability to get good results change too. I can see where Curtains is coming from, there's NOTHING, absolutely nothing to suggest, from what we have seen in five games, that this season, under Clough will be any improvement on the previous seasons under Clough. Don't jump on Curtains' back, ask yourself why he's so despondent so early in the season! I've noticed you seem to have developed a twin track approach these days -berate the owners for a lack of investment and a series of broken promises,and yet at the same time berate the manager who works within the constraints you believe to be there. By the way,I was amused to see your description of BD's transfer funding in the promotion season as modest.The facts derived from the accounts are that new additions came in at £11.786m (all inclusive),fees alone £10.399m.Now it has to be said that Earnshaw almost certainly featured at the back end of the financial year,but on the other hand it's unclear as to whether the eventual £1m Mears featured,as he was only on loan in 06/07. So in one year only he got that amount of backing to produce a team that barely scraped promotion and was woefully inadequate at the next level. Perhaps you could come up with a word to describe Clough's budget,based on the modesty of £7/£8m (transfer fees only) in one season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I've noticed you seem to have developed a twin track approach these days -berate the owners for a lack of investment and a series of broken promises,and yet at the same time berate the manager who works within the constraints you believe to be there. By the way,I was amused to see your description of BD's transfer funding in the promotion season as modest.The facts derived from the accounts are that new additions came in at £11.786m (all inclusive),fees alone £10.399m.Now it has to be said that Earnshaw almost certainly featured at the back end of the financial year,but on the other hand it's unclear as to whether the eventual £1m Mears featured,as he was only on loan in 06/07. So in one year only he got that amount of backing to produce a team that barely scraped promotion and was woefully inadequate at the next level. Perhaps you could come up with a word to describe Clough's budget,based on the modesty of £7/£8m (transfer fees only) in one season? The underlined sentences - where have I said/done exactly these things. You are quite capable of debating without making things up that people have said or completely twisted their words. I have never berated the owners for lack of investment. You'll find I was suggesting that broken promises or misleading quotes are the reason why fans are staying away... massive difference. As for BD, you've been cute in how you've mis-represented the context of that debate, it was a few weeks ago, but I'm pretty sure my point was that Billy inherited a worse squad (than Clough) and his INITIAL investment (ie. the first month of the season), and he managed to be top by November! Your correct statements about the investments in 2007 are irrelevent to that particular debate and a different discussion altogether. If you're going to stalk my comments Ramblur, at least have the respect and decency to pipe up and misquote me there and then, not weeks later! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicester Ram Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 What even is this thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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