jcidaho Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 A theory I fancy is that the board consider themselves bitten by entrusting large sums of money over to a manager (pj) who flushed it down the loo... Crazy times. They probably thought they'd keep Nigel on a leash this time round until he proves he can build a winning team with a good never say die spirit and morale. Then if he does this, they would invest further in him to win promotion. A good strategy. The best time to buy is when a team is winning, especially if you want to go up. Now I think they will not trust Nigel with the money. He's proved he can waste money on players, and that he can't man-manage. I would bet they've got a plan for him to see us through this year, then sack him in the summer or whenever safety is assured. Hopefully then if there is some money it'll be given to an established manager with a track record that they have some faith in. After all, if there is a limited pot, would you trust in Nigel to spend it wisely and not to cause disillusionment in whoever he'd bring in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admira Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 He'll struggle tonight with only three defenders available and one striker on the books. They are asset stripping, pure and simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dambuster Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 He'll struggle tonight with only three defenders available and one striker on the books. They are asset stripping, pure and simple. Addison is a defender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 He'll struggle tonight with only three defenders available and one striker on the books. They are asset stripping, pure and simple. If only we had John W Henry in charge, siiiiiiiiigh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcidaho Posted February 1, 2011 Author Share Posted February 1, 2011 He'll struggle tonight with only three defenders available and one striker on the books. They are asset stripping, pure and simple. Nigel was the one thinking it made sense to sell moxey. Nigel aggravated commons and hulse so they didn't want to stay. I don't think it's as simple as you envision. They'd be stupid to drive away the fan base that would result in dcfc being a worse investment than what it is currently. They'll use the lure of a new manager with money to spend to pull back ST holders in the summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dantheram Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Nigel was the one thinking it made sense to sell moxey. Nigel aggravated commons and hulse so they didn't want to stay. I don't think it's as simple as you envision. They'd be stupid to drive away the fan base that would result in dcfc being a worse investment than what it is currently. They'll use the lure of a new manager with money to spend to pull back ST holders in the summer. Do you think the fans are collectively that stupid? We heard it all before, its gone to far now. Does Allistair Campbell work for GSE? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcidaho Posted February 1, 2011 Author Share Posted February 1, 2011 Do you think the fans are collectively that stupid? Will ST holders renew if a new manager comes with with the explicit promise of cash to spend... mostly yes. Although most fans will be dubious, they'll sign up for another year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dantheram Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Will ST holders renew if a new manager comes with with the explicit promise of cash to spend... mostly yes. Although most fans will be dubious, they'll sign up for another year. Sadly, i conceed you're right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Sadly, i conceed you're right. I concur. Due to the horrible time we endured with The 3 Amigos most fans love the 'on sound financial footing' mantra the board peddle. You'd think fooball league clubs are folding every other week the way the majority of fans sit there oblivious thinking 'Well it could be a lot worse..." I've said many time before, I'm all for keeping the club stable and I'm not wanting Abramovic/Sheik Monsour levels of frivulous spening but this penny pinching is embarressing. With the (supposed) investors we have we could easily muster up around £3/4m to bring in some proven quality to suppliment the promising youngsters and really have a go. So what if we don't make it at the first attempt, Wolves, West Brom & Reading would always have ins & outs at the end of each season but they kept a core group of players together and it eventually worked and I don't think they were even close to going into administration during that time. We have a better fanbase, facilities and turnover (at least wehen they were in the Championship) than all of these so why can't we do it that way??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
footymadme Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 you have to question ... if the red dog's are starting the odd post on here........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 if the red dog's are starting the odd post on here........ I can imagine they're too busy enjoying the double over us, their current league position and the fact their team can play an attractive attacking brand of football (with 4-4-2 no less) and sustain a realistic promotion campaign to worry about us... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asanovic Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 Complete, utter frustration. Defnitely one of the most frustrating times to be a Derby County supporter I have known. Before I start this rant, I'm not a booer, never have been, and I am behind Nigel Clough. I cannot believe that Dean Moxey has been sold, with NC saying '"He (Moxey) has not really progressed this season as much as we hoped. "We just thought it was a good offer. We have got another good left back in Gareth Roberts and we can always get cover in on loan if we need it." If there's a Derby supporter on this forum that really thinks Gareth Roberts is a good player, please speak up. Certainly no one was questioning Moxey's progress when we were sticking him up front away at Coventry (noticeably, upfront is an area that STILL is yet to be addressed). Also how frustrating to see that on the same day our only decent left back leaves, forest get Paul Konchesky in on loan. Some of the other signings really make you wonder what is going on at Derby. Keogh to Bristol City, Collins to Sheff Utd, Eddie Johnson to bottom of the league Preston. Why are we not in the mix for these players? A striker should have been absolute priority in this window, and if we had no other options than Connor Sammon it's a sad reflection either on the scouting system we have, or the lack of ambition displayed by the board. We'll continue to have Chris Porter up on his own trying to keep the ball up that end of the field with zero support. How on earth has this not been addressed ALL season? The board are unwilling to invest in the team. I don't feel that Nigel Clough helps himself at times, by way of slating players personally on the radio, playing Brayford at centre half when unnecessary etc, but there are some things that are out of his control. Ben Davies, who I thought was ok against forest, will not be an adequate replacement for Kris Commons, and we haven't managed to get in someone who even comes close, even someone who has solid Championship level exposure. I saw a post on this forum saying something along the lines of 'the board will invest when Clough develops a good side'. How can he do that? How can he develop a team that is so massively depleted? This team, through no fault of their own, are capable of nothing more than battling bravely against relegation. If we started the season with the squad we have now, it's my opinion that we'd be in the bottom three. I genuinely think we are prime relegation fodder. We now have no Commons, no Moxey, and basically no striker to partner what I would call a 75% fit Porter. Where are our goals coming from? I think that if we keep Nigel Clough we will be in the Premiership sooner than we will without him. The arguments around sacking him are lacking logic - if the board were too tight to lay down money to sign Davies before the Crawley game, what do you think the chances are of them securing a big name manager will be, on what will obviously be a big cash contract? There's no one better for the job, whether you like him or not. But he may well be managing us in League One next season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcidaho Posted February 1, 2011 Author Share Posted February 1, 2011 if the red dog's are starting the odd post on here........ Nope. Genuine fan offering an interpretation of the boards stance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcidaho Posted February 1, 2011 Author Share Posted February 1, 2011 I think that if we keep Nigel Clough we will be in the Premiership sooner than we will without him. The arguments around sacking him are lacking logic. I refer you to the points you just made in your own reply. The board could well be thinking of sacking Clough in the summer/spring. If you look dispassionately at Clough's record here, particulary in relation to his poor man-management and tactics, I think a lot of the fans would not oppose this move. There is the question of who else would we get, which is a different point to the one being made here in this thread, that is of the boards intentions. However since you raise it, who knows what the machinery is for taking on a new manager in the current football world. If the right connections are available to the board, along with susbtance to back up certain promises and sufficient sweeteners, it's possible we could get someone decent in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stive Pesley Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 So that begs a new question: Would you rather the board spent big on players and kept Clough, or replaced Clough and spent the money paying him off and throwing even more wedge at trying to entice a halfway decent new manager....leaving us with even less money to buy new players? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcidaho Posted February 1, 2011 Author Share Posted February 1, 2011 So that begs a new question: Would you rather the board spent big on players and kept Clough, or replaced Clough and spent the money paying him off and throwing even more wedge at trying to entice a halfway decent new manager....leaving us with even less money to buy new players? Depends on how much it would take to get rid of Clough. If the answer is not a great deal in the scheme of things, then it may make sense to take that option. I'm sure the board have looked at various devious plans involving wearing him down to the point he resigns. I'm sure the one the one thing they won't do is give whatever is left in the kitty over to Clough, given his record thus far (i.e. poor player motivation, 1 win in 3). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilkoRam Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 To be honest this is all just day dreaming on our part. We can't make GSE sell we can't make new investors come in. We can't get rid of Nigel or advertise for a new manager. Simply put we're a bit powerless. Yes we can protest but doesn't really mean a lot (look at Man Utd). Personally I would like a full change at Derby. Board and now I believe manager too to change. For all the plus points of Nigel I find them outweighed by the bad. The argument of 'who else?' is redundant as we don't make the choices, we dont advertise and see who's interested, what they feel they need in terms of resources, how they want the team to play, expectations etc. All we do as fans is pick out names of managers we've heard of who are out of work. We're stuck with the current declining regime that tells us to 'be patient' time and time again. What we're waiting for I do not know. Either there's money that they don't trust to give or there's no money. Either way it's no good for the club to go forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scorchedturf Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 I really don't believe what's happening. The board's strategy looks more like asset stripping, I think Nigel's doomed, Jose Mourinho couldn't win matches consistently with the squad he's got. Interesting 3 weeks ahead probably going to be heartbreaking actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asanovic Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 May I refer back to a point you made in your previous post: The board could well be thinking of sacking Clough in the summer/spring. If you look dispassionately at Clough's record here, particulary in relation to his poor man-management and tactics, I think a lot of the fans would not oppose this move. Looking dipassionately, he has had to get rid of proven Championship players. The squad, and wage bill, is dramatically lower than when he took charge, so to judge this project based purely on results probably wouldn't give a fair reflection of where we are at. I dislike the way he goes for certain players during post match interviews, but the fact is his man management skills were good enough a few weeks ago when we were fourth. I don't think he has handled the Leacock situation well at all, but he is still a young manager and will make mistakes on his way to the top. Alot of fans wouldn't oppose the move, I agree, but they'd be back on the case of the next manager who couldn't take the current squad further without investment. And they're probably the same people who ring up in a fit of rage on Radio Derby after a defeat, and are nowhere to be seen (or heard) after a win. I cannot understand how it would be sensible to get rid of Clough. People begrudge the fact that he got the job because of his surname, and I wouldn't totally disagree with that, although he also worked his way up the system. But whatever the reason he was appointed, he is here, and I really believe that any other manager that we can realistically afford wouldn't be able to bring more out of this squad than Clough can. Like it or not, if we stay up, it's something of an achievement. What I do find hard to take with Clough is some of the decisions he makes, and refusal to apologise. Ever playing Gareth Roberts (indeed, signing him in the first place), and selecting Brayford at right back have both been costly from a points perspective. But no manager will get everything right, and approach their job in a way that suits everyone. The other argument is, even if this board threw money at a new manager (which based on past performance, they definitely wouldn't), who would come to Derby? An ideal would be Chris Hughton, but do you really think he would come to a club that won't invest in players? He took Newcastle up with a Premiership squad, not one barely good enough for the Championship. He could get the next Premiership job available in the bottom half of the table - why join a club that can't compete with clubs below them for loan signings? Alot of this is down to aligning the expectations of the supporters with that of the club. For this season I've made my peace that there is a real chance we could be relegated, and survival is the aim. Some still think we should be in the top 6, but that isn't a right. We don't have the players. We are not, in the eyes of the league, and candidate attraction, a big club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CumbrianRam Posted February 1, 2011 Share Posted February 1, 2011 I really don't believe what's happening. The board's strategy looks more like asset stripping, I think Nigel's doomed, Jose Mourinho couldn't win matches consistently with the squad he's got. Interesting 3 weeks ahead probably going to be heartbreaking actually. Burley did alright under when we owned by criminals! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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