GboroRam Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 36 minutes ago, Uptherams said: You're a terrible mod. Sorry if my requesting you show something other than a right wing unreliable blog as your "source". I'd surely be a better mod if I posted unsubstantiated attacks on the left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 20 minutes ago, FindernRam said: Difficult to criticize what doesn't exist. I'm sure "Sir" Keir will be a great advocate for the man in the street. Don't worry all you Tories, the friendly Labour party is back in charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 44 minutes ago, TramRam said: Activist An activist is a person who campaigns for some kind of social change. When you participate in a march protesting the closing of a neighborhood library, you're an activist. Someone who's actively involved in a protest or a political or social cause can be called an activist. Demonstrations, strikes, and sit-ins are all ways that an activist might work toward the change she believes in. The root word of activist is the Latin actus, "a doing, a driving force, or an impulse." Someone who acts on what she believes is an activist. Political, Enviromental, Social, Ecological. Most if not all of us in some shape or form have over our lifetimes not knowingly been an Activist, I certainly have being a Senior Union Official for many years, Getting your beliefs in the Media, Having yourself being pictured with high profile Politicians, Being a spokeperson for those unable to speak for themselves gives you a platform for your beliefs. If I was the Lady who works for the NHS and is being portrayed as a "political activist" and have great disdain for someone or something i'd be doing the exact same thing for political gain for my cause, The downside of this is getting caught doing something "immoral" in times of public Anxiety. I fought for the Miners during the strike in the early 80s, I despised Thatcher for her "beer and sandwiches" comment when inviting Union leaders to a meeting at Number 10, Infering we were of a lower class ?, Then I was a social justice warrior, I guess you could say Far Left, My beliefs changed during and after ther Iraq war. Today i'm just right of centre in the political spectrum, Politics has changed for the worse imo, It's more to do with personalities rather than political or social justice, Just like on this message board we will continue to agree/disagree with a political belief of others on political causes. You don't have to be a Council house occupant to vote Labour, You don't have to be a millionair to vote Conservative in todays world, It's what you "HOPE" a political party can do for your Country and yourselves. I really like this post. Kind of nails it for me. If folk really think that calling folk 'activists' is some sort of pejorative term, so be it. These days it's a term that tends to part and parcel of the standard lazy, ignorant and crass stereotyping of anyone whose political stance is anywhere left of centre, but it's not something that anyone being labelled in this manner is going to be unduly worried about, indeed I'd venture the opposite would be true. For the hard of learning... activist /ˈaktɪvɪst/ noun a person who campaigns to bring about political or social change Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptherams Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 5 minutes ago, GboroRam said: Sorry if my requesting you show something other than a right wing unreliable blog as your "source". I'd surely be a better mod if I posted unsubstantiated attacks on the left. 1. There is more than enough evidence within that article to prove her spreading misinformation. 2. She will now almost certainly be investigated by the frauds department of the NHS. Who will establish if the other accusations are true or false. 3. She is a real person, the account is not fake. 4. My issue is with political activists, of all persuasions, spreading misinformation for political gain 5. What is also worrying is the man who has found fake NHS staff twitter accounts. 6. This is pretty bad if true. 7. It would be far worse as it would be organised manipulation. 8. The only evidence as others have highlighted, so far, is one single screenshot. 9. The man hasn't provided any evidence for the other claims 10. He says he'll provide more information, when he can and I'll wait for this to develop. 11. The department for health and social care have asserted this is all false. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 1 hour ago, FindernRam said: Politics, Virus or Humour take your pick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rev Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 44 minutes ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said: I really like this post. Kind of nails it for me. If folk really think that calling folk 'activists' is some sort of pejorative term, so be it. These days it's a term that tends to part and parcel of the standard lazy, ignorant and crass stereotyping of anyone whose political stance is anywhere left of centre, but it's not something that anyone being labelled in this manner is going to be unduly worried about, indeed I'd venture the opposite would be true. For the hard of learning... activist /ˈaktɪvɪst/ noun a person who campaigns to bring about political or social change I agree. It's just a shame certain activists can't see themselves as such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 10 hours ago, ariotofmyown said: Read some of this. So they are saying that the government has been setting up fake twitter accounts pretending to be NHS workers? If this is true, we might as well give up. Edit: bit of debate whether it's a troll or something more official. Is it a crime in the UK to use someone's identity to spread false information? It is in direct contravention of the Data Protection Act. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 38 minutes ago, Uptherams said: 10. He says he'll provide more information, when he can and I'll wait for this to develop. 11. The department for health and social care have asserted this is all false. He also has offered the information up to the DHSC who have declined the offer. They aren't interested in if it's true or not. I'm interested though, and I don't know many reasons why they wouldn't be. Could they know the full story already, because they were involved in it? I'm interested in the detail of the nurse offering PPE but can't see anything other than Guido Fawkes as a source. Where was the PPE from? Where was it donated? What was the agreement to donate it? Why was it donated? If it was not NHS stock, should she not still be given enough PPE for her own use? Should nurses supply their own in any scenario? Should nurses take non NHS stock that is promised to other care workers and keep it for themselves (a very selfish, almost Tory way of looking at PPE)? If it was NHS stock she gave away to those not eligible for it she needs to be disciplined and probably sacked, but too many questions are left open to justify any talk of disciplinary action. Half a story from a biased source. You don't wonder why I won't accept it without the blanks filling in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 1 hour ago, GboroRam said: Sorry if my requesting you show something other than a right wing unreliable blog as your "source". I'd surely be a better mod if I posted unsubstantiated attacks on the left. As opposed to saying 'This is what I call sourced' when its written by a far left activist and founder of the following; https://www.farrightwatch.net/ The overriding trend of this thread is that people have massive blindspots when it come to their own biases, tending to look for the littlest chink in opposing viewpoints whilst not subjecting their own to the same scutiny. Although if I'm being brutally honest, some are more guilty than others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 1 minute ago, maxjam said: Although if I've being brutally honest, some are more guilty than others. It's ok mate. We forgive you ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 4 minutes ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said: It's ok mate. We forgive you ? Well that was a typo lol but we've all got our own biases myself included. I do try to fact check as much as possible though before offering up something to be shot down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 6 minutes ago, maxjam said: As opposed to saying 'This is what I call sourced' when its written by a far left activist and founder of the following; https://www.farrightwatch.net/ The overriding trend of this thread is that people have massive blindspots when it come to their own biases, tending to look for the littlest chink in opposing viewpoints whilst not subjecting their own to the same scutiny. Although if I'm being brutally honest, some are more guilty than others. I'm not talking about the bias of the poster. A far right source with good documented backup is still believable. A far left source without documented backup is not believable. Any biased source posting something that they then don't back up has to be questionable, don't you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptherams Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 15 minutes ago, GboroRam said: He also has offered the information up to the DHSC who have declined the offer. They aren't interested in if it's true or not. I'm interested though, and I don't know many reasons why they wouldn't be. Could they know the full story already, because they were involved in it? I'm interested in the detail of the nurse offering PPE but can't see anything other than Guido Fawkes as a source. Where was the PPE from? Where was it donated? What was the agreement to donate it? Why was it donated? If it was not NHS stock, should she not still be given enough PPE for her own use? Should nurses supply their own in any scenario? Should nurses take non NHS stock that is promised to other care workers and keep it for themselves (a very selfish, almost Tory way of looking at PPE)? If it was NHS stock she gave away to those not eligible for it she needs to be disciplined and probably sacked, but too many questions are left open to justify any talk of disciplinary action. Half a story from a biased source. You don't wonder why I won't accept it without the blanks filling in? As you want to persist. Especially with regards to sources and who is and isn't trustworthy. 13. Founder and editor of far right watch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 18 minutes ago, GboroRam said: I'm not talking about the bias of the poster. A far right source with good documented backup is still believable. A far left source without documented backup is not believable. Any biased source posting something that they then don't back up has to be questionable, don't you think? In theory yes, but in today's climate of fake news and social media deplatforming fake news travels around the world significantly faster than the truth because people only believe what their own biases make them believe - most only read the headline or whatever and move on. https://www.newscientist.com/article/2163226-fake-news-travels-six-times-faster-than-the-truth-on-twitter/ I'm not even sure the bit I highlighted is true anymore, given the extemity of social media. Certain people ideologically opposed to others will never accept truths coming from sources they despise irrespective of its validity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 8 minutes ago, maxjam said: I'm not even sure the bit I highlighted is true anymore, given the extemity of social media. Certain people ideologically opposed to others will never accept truths coming from sources they despise irrespective of its validity. Maybe that's true, but @Uptherams saved me the ethical quandary by posting a source with nothing to validate it anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptherams Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 2 minutes ago, GboroRam said: Maybe that's true, but @Uptherams saved me the ethical quandary by posting a source with nothing to validate it anyway. I'm not the one with holes in their argument ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 1 minute ago, Uptherams said: I'm not the one with holes in their argument ? You're the one without an argument! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uptherams Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 3 minutes ago, GboroRam said: You're the one without an argument! That's how blinkered you are ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 6 minutes ago, GboroRam said: Maybe that's true, but @Uptherams saved me the ethical quandary by posting a source with nothing to validate it anyway. The Guido Fawkes link? Doesn't that fall under the parameters you set out yourself about far right sources with good documentation still being believable? They call out the BBC nurse being as being heavily biased and 5 mins detective work myself shows that to be the case. His description from his own blog is as follows; I’m a nurse in the Emergency Medical Unit at St Thomas Hospital. I’m an active socialist and trade unionist. I believe working people should not have to suffer brutal austerity for a crisis caused by the banks and the inhumane economic system we live under. It must be significantly harder for the BBC to find extremists than it is to find moderate nurses for opinions. Or maybe thats just not the angle they want to push. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rynny Posted April 21, 2020 Share Posted April 21, 2020 Just read through the last few pages of this thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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