Van der MoodHoover Posted July 16, 2016 Share Posted July 16, 2016 Sam spent plenty at Bolton I suspect. Jay Jay okocha etc They've now got debts of 170m which didn't materialise from nowhere. Agree Bruce is also worth an interview by the fa. Similar recent achievement to Sam so why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
r4derby Posted July 16, 2016 Share Posted July 16, 2016 Big Sam, despite the idea that he plays negative, defensive, long ball tactics, is surprisingly open to modern ideas and thinking. I also like the idea that he has a mentality of getting the job done, whether it's survival in Prem or getting out of a group at an international tournament. On the downside, although several years ago now, he failed pretty miserably at Newcastle who were a big club with ambition. I would argue that despite West Ham and Sunderland being big clubs with ambition, he was bought in at both to steady the ship and retain Prem football, which he did. I wouldn't mind Sam as England boss. Out of that list, I like the idea of Guus, not sure how that would work though, seeing as he is a mercenary caretaker these days Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted July 16, 2016 Share Posted July 16, 2016 3 hours ago, HantsRam said: Sam spent plenty at Bolton I suspect. Jay Jay okocha etc They've now got debts of 170m which didn't materialise from nowhere. Agree Bruce is also worth an interview by the fa. Similar recent achievement to Sam so why not? Jay Jay Okocha was a free transfer, as we're most of his big signings, I think £8m on Anelka was the most he spent (could be wrong there though), think what sort of player teams above him were buying for £8m! I'm sure wages were a factor but while they were in The Premier League I doubt they were that much of a worry. Agree that Bruce should also be interviewed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted July 16, 2016 Share Posted July 16, 2016 47 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: Jay Jay Okocha was a free transfer, as we're most of his big signings, I think £8m on Anelka was the most he spent (could be wrong there though), think what sort of player teams above him were buying for £8m! I'm sure wages were a factor but while they were in The Premier League I doubt they were that much of a worry. Agree that Bruce should also be interviewed. Was thinking more the wages with some of sams signings - didn't he have a period of getting ageing galactico types? Eg fernando hierro (or am I mistaken here)? Was thinking just that he must have used cash to tempt them to Bolton. Ah well. It's quite a long time ago now. Let's see what our panel of experts come up with and then let joy/derision commence! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted July 16, 2016 Share Posted July 16, 2016 19 hours ago, G STAR RAM said: You haven't mentioned last managers, you said we should hire a 'proven winner' and I gave you examples of 2 proven previous winners that England hired. If you think Allardyce only had a one off decent run I can only suggest you do a bit of research into his managerial career and try and use a bit of context against of what he was up against. How are Bolton doing now? I think he should be considered for employment by England because he has attributed which I think the national team needs:- 1 - A good man motivator 2 - Plays to his players strengths Minimum requirement. How are West Ham doing now, how are Newcastle doing now, all have been touched by Big Sam. Its the past, counts for nothing after he has gone, what did he do when he was there? Very little, go read David's post regarding the head to head vs Eddie Howe. Like I said, decent manager, just not good enough for the big chair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted July 16, 2016 Share Posted July 16, 2016 1 hour ago, McRamFan said: Minimum requirement. How are West Ham doing now, how are Newcastle doing now, all have been touched by Big Sam. Its the past, counts for nothing after he has gone, what did he do when he was there? Very little, go read David's post regarding the head to head vs Eddie Howe. Like I said, decent manager, just not good enough for the big chair. Do you really think Howe's achievements in League One and Championship match up to Allardyce taking Bolton to 5th in the Premier League on a comparative shoestring budget? Who is decent enough for the big chair in your opinion then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted July 16, 2016 Share Posted July 16, 2016 1 hour ago, G STAR RAM said: Do you really think Howe's achievements in League One and Championship match up to Allardyce taking Bolton to 5th in the Premier League on a comparative shoestring budget? Who is decent enough for the big chair in your opinion then? Not directly however gives an indication that Howe will potentiallyachieve more. If I could appoint someone, the structure would need to change. It would be a contract for that paricular qualifier and competition and it would be result driven in terms of general basic and huge bonus on certain goals set. The England coach would have more access to the squad, club sides would have to cooperate. Scolari, Klinsman, Mourinho, Marc Wilmots, Antonio Conte, Gianni de Biasi, Joachim Löw or an outside punt on Michael O'Neill. All doing/have done something different with various teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted July 16, 2016 Share Posted July 16, 2016 36 minutes ago, McRamFan said: Not directly however gives an indication that Howe will potentiallyachieve more. If I could appoint someone, the structure would need to change. It would be a contract for that paricular qualifier and competition and it would be result driven in terms of general basic and huge bonus on certain goals set. The England coach would have more access to the squad, club sides would have to cooperate. Scolari, Klinsman, Mourinho, Marc Wilmots, Antonio Conte, Gianni de Biasi, Joachim Löw or an outside punt on Michael O'Neill. All doing/have done something different with various teams. So the tried and tested option of a foreign name... Unfortunately, your dream scenario will never become reality due to the financial situation of club football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted July 16, 2016 Share Posted July 16, 2016 31 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: So the tried and tested option of a foreign name... Unfortunately, your dream scenario will never become reality due to the financial situation of club football. Since 1966 how many foreign coaches have we tried? Its 2 and both come in the top 5 of win% Capello 66.7 Hoddle 60.7 Greenwood 60 Sven 59.7 Roy 58.9 Yes we have tried it and it has resulted in a better win ratio that all of the others, so yes please lets dio it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted July 16, 2016 Share Posted July 16, 2016 29 minutes ago, McRamFan said: Since 1966 how many foreign coaches have we tried? Its 2 and both come in the top 5 of win% Capello 66.7 Hoddle 60.7 Greenwood 60 Sven 59.7 Roy 58.9 Yes we have tried it and it has resulted in a better win ratio that all of the others, so yes please lets dio it again. May have something to do with the number of matches in east qualifying groups? The best times in recent memory were under Hoddle and Venables. If Hodgson is 5th just behind Sven why didn't we keep him if win percentages are what we are going off? Foreign manager is a big no for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 15 hours ago, G STAR RAM said: May have something to do with the number of matches in east qualifying groups? The best times in recent memory were under Hoddle and Venables. If Hodgson is 5th just behind Sven why didn't we keep him if win percentages are what we are going off? Foreign manager is a big no for me. Even though they have better results, Venables 26 matches one Euro semi final, Hoddle 28 matches one WC secound round is so much better achievement that 3 back to back quarter finals? Really? Its probably a big no for the FA, hence we will only have Mike Bassett type managers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 2 minutes ago, McRamFan said: Even though they have better results, Venables 26 matches one Euro semi final, Hoddle 28 matches one WC secound round is so much better achievement that 3 back to back quarter finals? Really? Its probably a big no for the FA, hence we will only have Mike Bassett type managers. ...and managers who have no real passion for England and are just here for a £5m salary... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 20 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: ...and managers who have no real passion for England and are just here for a £5m salary... Stop throwing that up, you cannot say that Capello and Sven where rubbish, the win rates disprove that. Its more like that no matter who you put in charge the players have no passion for the national side. Perhaps the reality is that foreign managers are better at getting players to play, when was the last time an english manager won the prem? I'll give you a clue it was back in 1991-92. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 44 minutes ago, McRamFan said: Stop throwing that up, you cannot say that Capello and Sven where rubbish, the win rates disprove that. Its more like that no matter who you put in charge the players have no passion for the national side. Perhaps the reality is that foreign managers are better at getting players to play, when was the last time an english manager won the prem? I'll give you a clue it was back in 1991-92. Didn't say that were rubbish. We underachieved because both bought inton the idea of picking 11 good players rather than trying to mould a team. What percentage of foreign managers have won the Premier League? And how much money have foreign managers had to spend in comparison to English managers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 12 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: Didn't say that were rubbish. We underachieved because both bought inton the idea of picking 11 good players rather than trying to mould a team. What percentage of foreign managers have won the Premier League? And how much money have foreign managers had to spend in comparison to English managers? Roys done exactly the same. So perhaps the nationality is irrelevant and it is this fa mentality that must change first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 8 minutes ago, HantsRam said: Roys done exactly the same. So perhaps the nationality is irrelevant and it is this fa mentality that must change first. I would disagree. He's the first manager for a while that has given youngsters and 'unfashionable' players a chance. Really seemed to lose the plot in the Euros though, maybe the FA comments on his position didn't help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 44 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: I would disagree. He's the first manager for a while that has given youngsters and 'unfashionable' players a chance. Really seemed to lose the plot in the Euros though, maybe the FA comments on his position didn't help. Bent over backwards to accommodate rooney though - in a relatively unfamiliar position. And started changing his formation prior to euros. And went back to previous players who were woefully out of form. Maybe the pressure just gets to them all and they bottle. Sven persisted with 442 despite not having a wide left player and kept picking heskey so not unique to Roy at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 3 hours ago, G STAR RAM said: Didn't say that were rubbish. We underachieved because both bought inton the idea of picking 11 good players rather than trying to mould a team. What percentage of foreign managers have won the Premier League? And how much money have foreign managers had to spend in comparison to English managers? Since the start 14 titles have gone to the scots and 9 to outside Britiain. So: 0% English, 57% Scottish and 43% Outside. Perhaps they got more money to spend because they have proven that they can deliver success, whilst the English managers just come up with excuses. There has been plenty of English managers that have spent a lot of money and your mate Sam is one of them. http://www.transferleague.co.uk/managers-comparison-table/transfer-league-tables/transfer-league-managers-table Any other questions, please look up the answer and stop using it as an excuse, as you can see, it is easily disproved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 7 minutes ago, McRamFan said: Since the start 14 titles have gone to the scots and 9 to outside Britiain. So: 0% English, 57% Scottish and 43% Outside. Perhaps they got more money to spend because they have proven that they can deliver success, whilst the English managers just come up with excuses. There has been plenty of English managers that have spent a lot of money and your mate Sam is one of them. http://www.transferleague.co.uk/managers-comparison-table/transfer-league-tables/transfer-league-managers-table Any other questions, please look up the answer and stop using it as an excuse, as you can see, it is easily disproved. I meant the percentage of foreign managers that have actually managed in the Premier League and won a title. I won't bother looking up the answer because I know it will be extremely low and disprove your point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 1 hour ago, G STAR RAM said: I meant the percentage of foreign managers that have actually managed in the Premier League and won a title. I won't bother looking up the answer because I know it will be extremely low and disprove your point. More than 0% and that is what the English managers are at. My point is that there are no English manager good enough for the England job. Thank you for helping me prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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