kevinhectoring

1 hour ago, Grumpy Git said:

Not a chance, fight the barstewards every inch of the way and then some.

And how does this work, exactly, in the real world ?

2 hours ago, Jimbo Ram said:

Why is Wazza getting involved in the takeover? Needs to be planning his next club and challenge. Walsall have sacked their manager ?

Wazza is fighting for his life. This could be his first and last job as a manager. He and his acolytes will probably figure his job as manager is most secure if he has the owner in his corner. Don’t think Alonso is a guy who gets in anyone’s corner, except in order to punch them 

22 hours ago, Jimbo Ram said:

Third time lucky?

Rumours are that Wayne and his ‘representatives’ are looking to bring a US consortium in. So the answer to your question is ‘no’

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

But we were charged with filling P&S. "Breach of acounting standards", "EFL regs" and misleading the EFL does not equate to failing P&S.

I envisage a fine for misleading the EFL and refusing to hand over details of the policy on request. There is absolutely no chance of a points deduction.

Charges were wider I think. As outlined at the start of the 2020 decision. Eg EFL asserted that ‘submission of non-compliant accounts was in breach of P&S rules’

1 minute ago, RadioactiveWaste said:

that accept P&S (FFP) submissions which are based on the accounts. HMRC don't have an issue with our accounts other than this year's being late.

Ok they accept the submissions. But surely they do so on the assumption the underlying accounts are compliant. 

13 minutes ago, StarterForTen said:

However, you can not deny that farting in a lift is wrong on so many levels...

Assume you mean ‘on so many floors’ 

18 minutes ago, JABBA said:

But the EFL will have already signed off at least one possibly two set of accounts using this accounting method. 

Is it right to say the EFL ‘signs off’ on accounts? I doubt they do that

7 minutes ago, Foxy Ram said:

It says a(nother) Daily Mail report.

The secrecy suggests it’s a points deduction and that the EFL decided - when they were told they had won the appeal - that it would apply for next season 

This is presumably why the club threatened the telegraph (Percy) with legal action if they disclosed it   Because premature disclosure could have forced the EFL to act this season 

11 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

So what?

The appeal is to do with 'describing' our accounting practice - a practice was allowed and signed off by the EFL, and isn't something that comes with a points deduction even if guilty.

There’s a breach of accounting standards, possibly a breach of the EFL regs and the companies act, and the EFL most likely suspects the notes to the accounts were intentionally misleading. And you say ‘so what?’  
By the way, did the EFL really sign off on the amortisation policy (as you say)? Or did they sign off on the accounting treatment of the stadium sale? I thought it was the latter 

29 minutes ago, Ellafella said:

I know MM has a fair few things on his plate right now, so no blame if the Club ignores this, but I would call this chap out without question.

The club’s PR team seem to have dealt with the recent turmoil in a pretty savvy way. I think they will ignore it. Hope so 

59 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

The charge does not relate specifically to the methodology used and as such, this is not being contested, but rather to the fact that the way the practice was described in our annual report, 'could have been clearer'. 

Unfortunately the problem was in the notes to the accounts themselves, not just the annual report.  And weren’t the words ‘could have been clearer’ the words of the club’s auditor himself ?   He would hardly overstate the problem 

On 07/05/2021 at 21:26, Mostyn6 said:

So then the stadium loan would put MEL into admin, not the club. Surely?

MM is a person not a company.   Also, he has said he’ll support the club to keep it out of admin which is in his power to do provided he has the cash. 
So what we need to worry about is four things: efl, our awful manager, who the new owner will be, and whether ffp means we can’t strengthen the squad 

just now admin is the least of our worries. If Alonso buys us, that could change big time. 
(But it seems the club is beginning to tell us he won’t buy us)
 

6 hours ago, rammieib said:

I don't believe any commentator is in the know. Just a generic comment given everything thats happening.

The club has issued a statement that says they will update us on the issue of ownership. Surely the club is not going to tell us that the EFL has approved Alonso -  wouldn’t that be for the EFl to announce? So perhaps they are going to tell us something different ...   

56 minutes ago, Rev said:

I'm sure I've read somewhere that the rental value was arrived at by working out the cost of annual rent, dividing that by 365, then charging the club for the days they'd actually use it.

 

That rings a bell. But it makes commercial sense only if third parties are paying for alternative use whenever the club is not there.  
 

2 hours ago, 1967RAMS said:

The true value is the ground it sits on

Surely the true value is mostly based on the npv of the cashflows it generates as a stadium. Not least because it’s subject to a lease for God knows how many years.
One problem incidentally with the complex web MM has woven is that the stadium  lease rental appears to be at an undervalue which may be an issue the EFL has got its teeth into - the stadium co is a related entity and so the rental should be in arms length terms for FFP purposes 

2 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Yes. So the issue is about adequately disclosing the details of the amortisation policy in the accounts and to the EFL. The original hearing concluded that the policy (once detailed) was acceptable.

Sorry, said this before. Still worried about this despite all the posts saying the efl does not have a leg to stand on. EFL’s view may be: the disclosure of change in policy was inadequate. And we think it was inadequate because the club didn’t want us to focus on the change because the club didn’t want us to challenge it. The harsh interpretation is that the accounts were intentionally misleading because they underplayed the change in policy.  
 

Also, the suggestion in the Sun that the EFL has decided to delay publication of the judgement/sanction until after season’s end has a ring of truth about it. I think it’s what they did w Wendies last season 

24 minutes ago, ziggyram59 said:

I really hope your right sage but you know what the EFL are like. 

Also hope sage is right. But underlying the lesser charge was an insinuation that our accounts were deliberately misleading. If accepted by the panel that is v bad 
 

Mods: why is this not on the EFL appeal thread?

On 07/05/2021 at 14:37, Leeds Ram said:

The lack of comment and general mystery surrounding the club is a problem that Mel needs to fix. It does make me think something is amiss as if everything was totally fine then they could simply release a statement reassuring us all and that would be that. It wouldn't need to comment on the Alonso takeover but simply reaffirm the financial health of the club itself and address the rumours that are doing the rounds. The fact they aren't doing that makes me wonder if it's because they can't do it and that is worrying on its own. I hope these issues are addressed as soon as possible so we can all be made aware of the actual state of the club. 

MM addressed all this via the daily fail two or three months back. Everyone seems to have forgotten 

59 minutes ago, Spanish said:

I can think of no good reason why the decision on a very limited aspect of the original charges should have been delayed this long.  I take comfort from the obvious joy shown by Mel at the end of the game

Why has it taken so long? The only reason I can think of is that the panel has found the issues more difficult that our fans think it is 

21 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said:

Of course the key is what has happened between 2018 and today. Has the £75m been paid to the club? I think I read somewhere that it would be paid over 8 years in instalments of £10m but I have not seen that confirmed anywhere. Has the club been laden with debt or has the parent company borrowed the money against the ground and then loaned that money to the club?

Negative ebitda in recent years implies significant negative cashflow at club level, obviously.  I guess this has been funded by the stadium company paying down the interco balance arising from the stadium sale. The stadium co has financed itself I think from the external borrowings, some of which have been guaranteed by our much maligned benefactor, MM

1 hour ago, Spanish said:

what debt?  Mel owes he club £80m for buying PP.  All of his funding is not a debt

We’ll know when we see the accounts. But hasn’t he borrowed money in the company that owns the stadium.  And paid that money to the club to cover cash shortfalls, so reducing the 80m debt due to the club

8 minutes ago, Rev said:

Let's not hound him out over a Mail story.

Well he is a boxer 

50 minutes ago, MrPlinkett said:

Guess it depends as not fair on Luton if close to Saturday 

Surely all the final games need to be played at the same time tho. 

8 hours ago, MrPlinkett said:

No i think they need to play, i would hate to see a postponement push the game beyond the end of the season, have visions of a luton team with not much to play for having even less when the season has ended and they are already on the beach mentally.

Lets go into Saturday knowing what needs to be achieved, not winning but still wondering if we could get relegated at a later date.

 

If postponed I think the EFl would pretty much force them to play it before the weekend 

16 hours ago, Kernow said:

Yeah of course, a Rotherham loss is what we want as the margins are going to be so fine.

I just hope we don’t end up shooting ourselves in the foot if we know at 12:30 on Saturday that a single point will guarantee survival. If we play for a point, I don’t think I’ll be able to watch the last 10 minutes if the scores are still level. I genuinely think that would be more gut-wrenching than any play-off final.

Worried all this rain will give Rotherham just the pitch they want tonight   Maybe a Postponement might be good for us ...