cheron85 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 2 minutes ago, rynny said: What else am I supposed to do at work when the boss is off? I don't think physically or mentally there IS anything else you could possibly do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddy Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 58 minutes ago, Cam the Ram said: Just checked to see how that ranks with the other higher scoring midfielders in the Championship. Russell 6.4 Butterfield 7.7 Johnson 7.8 Toral 7.9 Forestieri 8.5 Judge 8.6 Chery 9.1 Diame 9.7 Ince 10.4 Phillips 11.6 Not too bad. Russell is classed as a forward not a midfielder Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddy Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 1 hour ago, Cam the Ram said: Because that player plays out wide and isn't our main goal threat? How many games did he compete in to have a shot at goal tally of 64? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam the Ram Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Just now, toddy said: Russell is classed as a forward not a midfielder If you wish to be so pedantic, I'll do a comparison between Russell and the top Championship strikers for shots per goal, just for you. Gray 4.7 Vibe 5.8 Hernandez 6.3 Russell 6.4 Kodjia 6.4 Hemed 6.5 Vokes 6.5 McCormack 6.5 Martin 6.6 Dembele 6.9 Wells 7.5 So he still does fairly well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 1 hour ago, BathRam72 said: Says it all really. I bet the sell mongers will still have another argument as to why we should get rid. Because he's an average championship footballer and I think he's more of a bench player now for us. Do you think at his age he'd want to be bit part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddy Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 2 minutes ago, Cam the Ram said: If you wish to be so pedantic, I'll do a comparison between Russell and the top Championship strikers for shots per goal, just for you. Gray 4.7 Vibe 5.8 Hernandez 6.3 Russell 6.4 Kodjia 6.4 Hemed 6.5 Vokes 6.5 McCormack 6.5 Martin 6.6 Dembele 6.9 Wells 7.5 So he still does fairly well. You could have put in the goals each player had scored in brackets............ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Hilarious contradictions. "Russell is inconsistent at times, but he's got passion etc and can play brilliant We can't sell" "Jeff is inconsistent, he goes missing, can play brilliant but goes missing, let's sell" I like turtles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRam Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Just now, Mafiabob said: Because he's an average championship footballer and I think he's more of a bench player now for us. Do you think at his age he'd want to be bit part. I think he loves it here, to be honest, so I'm not sure he's that bothered. Besides, he still manages to outperform other players in his positions enough to get a lot of game time. Personally I think our wide players are better than him, when they perform, but it's up to NP to get that performance level out of our players. As of right now though, I doubt Russell is looking at this season thinking he's not going to play much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddy Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Just for the record I am not a Russell basher, just don't see the point in keeping a player to warm the bench is a few million is offered. If I was Russell and was told - stay at Derby and you be used as a sub, or go to so and so and get first team football, I would go to so and so because I want to play football. Johnny Russell wants to play football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRam Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Just now, toddy said: Just for the record I am not a Russell basher, just don't see the point in keeping a player to warm the bench is a few million is offered. If I was Russell and was told - stay at Derby and you be used as a sub, or go to so and so and get first team football, I would go to so and so because I want to play football. Johnny Russell wants to play football. But no-one can say that to him. You genuinely think, with the winger quality we have (actually shown) that he thinks he's a bench warmer? He 100% thinks he can nail down the starting spot in our team. It's up to the others to out perform him. We can think what we like of him, it's what he thinks of himself. He's at no point in his career at Derby been primarily a bench warmer so I don't know why everyone thinks it's suddenly going to start, and even if it did it would have to have been happening for a while for him to want to leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam the Ram Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 8 minutes ago, toddy said: How many games did he compete in to have a shot at goal tally of 64? For feck sake, if you're going to ask me for a stat to find out, can you at least make it interesting and not something like, 'how often does he shoot?' I'll compare him to other high scoring wingers from the league. Average minutes per shot taken: Ince 26 Murphy 33 Henry 34 Gudmundsson 36 Adomah 39 Canos 40 Phillips 41 Russell 49 So all we can take from that is that Russell shoots less frequently than the average high scoring winger in the Championship, but still scores more goals than all of them (apart from Ince). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 11 minutes ago, Mafiabob said: Because he's an average championship footballer and I think he's more of a bench player now for us. Do you think at his age he'd want to be bit part. 4 minutes ago, toddy said: Just for the record I am not a Russell basher, just don't see the point in keeping a player to warm the bench is a few million is offered. If I was Russell and was told - stay at Derby and you be used as a sub, or go to so and so and get first team football, I would go to so and so because I want to play football. Johnny Russell wants to play football. Why do you both assume he'll be warming the bench? We've seen over the last few seasons that the most rotated players in the squad are our wingers... Under Mclaren I think there was an amazing stat something like between them they'd only completed 10% of full 90 mins... Last season he got a fair amount of game time... And Pearson is know to like quick, wingers who run at people and work hard.. On the consistency issue... Since his stats suggest he's one of the better perfomers in his position across the league... IF he's as inconsistent as everyone suggests, that means if there are games where he commits nothing to the game and nothing to those stats... That means to balance out the stats he must therefore be having the same number of games where he's the best winger in the division... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRam Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 3 minutes ago, Cam the Ram said: For feck sake, if you're going to ask me for a stat to find out, can you at least make it interesting and not something like, 'how often does he shoot?' I'll compare him to other high scoring wingers from the league. Average minutes per shot taken: Ince 26 Murphy 33 Henry 34 Gudmundsson 36 Adomah 39 Canos 40 Phillips 41 Russell 49 So all we can take from that is that Russell shoots less frequently than the average high scoring winger in the Championship, but still scores more goals than all of them (apart from Ince). Now do the average tackles of those players for me, Cam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam the Ram Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 10 minutes ago, Mafiabob said: Hilarious contradictions. "Russell is inconsistent at times, but he's got passion etc and can play brilliant We can't sell" "Jeff is inconsistent, he goes missing, can play brilliant but goes missing, let's sell" I like turtles Russell contributed to 18 goals and only had 2 periods in the season in which he had failed to assist or score in over 4 matches and both those times were when he spent time starting matches on the bench. Not exactly inconsistent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddy Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 4 minutes ago, Cam the Ram said: For feck sake, if you're going to ask me for a stat to find out, can you at least make it interesting and not something like, 'how often does he shoot?' I'll compare him to other high scoring wingers from the league. Average minutes per shot taken: Ince 26 Murphy 33 Henry 34 Gudmundsson 36 Adomah 39 Canos 40 Phillips 41 Russell 49 So all we can take from that is that Russell shoots less frequently than the average high scoring winger in the Championship, but still scores more goals than all of them (apart from Ince). At least you are earning your money.......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 2 minutes ago, Cam the Ram said: Russell contributed to 18 goals and only had 2 periods in the season in which he had failed to assist or score in over 4 matches and both those times were when he spent time starting matches on the bench. Not exactly inconsistent. How many seasons he been here? Hes flattered to deceive for me since he signed. Flashes of great play and no doubt a talent. Not going to deny that. I just don't think he's as good as made out. He has the supporters no doubt, he's a fan favourite and I get that. Just think he's not quality. As for the stat thing. 4 goals in 18 months I believe before his latest scoring run suggests a period of inconsistency..... Don't you agree? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mafiabob Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 6 minutes ago, cheron85 said: Why do you both assume he'll be warming the bench? We've seen over the last few seasons that the most rotated players in the squad are our wingers... Under Mclaren I think there was an amazing stat something like between them they'd only completed 10% of full 90 mins... Last season he got a fair amount of game time... And Pearson is know to like quick, wingers who run at people and work hard.. On the consistency issue... Since his stats suggest he's one of the better perfomers in his position across the league... IF he's as inconsistent as everyone suggests, that means if there are games where he commits nothing to the game and nothing to those stats... That means to balance out the stats he must therefore be having the same number of games where he's the best winger in the division... 4 goals in 18 months ha I believe before he got going again when Clem got usurped. Suggests a period of inconsistency. He is a forward is he not? Good player not going to deny it, but I'm not going to be sorry if he went. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toddy Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 2 minutes ago, cheron85 said: Why do you both assume he'll be warming the bench? We've seen over the last few seasons that the most rotated players in the squad are our wingers... Under Mclaren I think there was an amazing stat something like between them they'd only completed 10% of full 90 mins... Last season he got a fair amount of game time... And Pearson is know to like quick, wingers who run at people and work hard.. On the consistency issue... Since his stats suggest he's one of the better perfomers in his position across the league... IF he's as inconsistent as everyone suggests, that means if there are games where he commits nothing to the game and nothing to those stats... That means to balance out the stats he must therefore be having the same number of games where he's the best winger in the division... He benched warmed a bit last season? I forget. But with NP's possible formations its possible that he will use attacking wing backs. Wingers and wing backs are counter productive playing together especially with the squad players we currently have. As NP has not brought in anybody yet, I do believe he will and our current squad is over blown at the moment, so some will go........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 Just now, Mafiabob said: 4 goals in 18 months ha I believe before he got going again when Clem got usurped. Suggests a period of inconsistency. He is a forward is he not? Good player not going to deny it, but I'm not going to be sorry if he went. So this goes to my point really... If he was terrible under Clement... But his stats were still impressive for the season as a whole... then surely he must have been the top winger in the league under Wassell? Otherwise the stats wouldn't balance out... Plus it really depends how you define a forward... I would say he is... BUT we've traditionally played him as a winger which in our formation I'd consider and attacking midfielder... And under Clement we were playing more like 4-5-1 than 4-3-3 (I think we actually play 4-1-2-2-1 but that's semantics) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
satty atwal Posted July 22, 2016 Share Posted July 22, 2016 5 hours ago, toddy said: With the 3m add it to the Hendrick pot and bring in a quality attacking forward or attacking midfielder. Russell is surplus as we have Ince, Weimann, Blackmann and Bennett plus depending on which formation/system NP goes for [say 3-5-2] we may play wing backs so a winger would be kept on the bench. It does look like Hendrick will go, if we get the £7 million, add the 3 and we could bring in some quality, or if NP thinks one of our a youth players might be good enough to promote , save the cash and use it for loans. Im shocked how u can call russell surplus and put those 4 ahead of him. Ince weimann yes i see the argument.... but blackman and bennett? Really? Blackman has done nothing in his entire career bar a 3 month spell... as for bennett he will end up league 1 or 2.... about his level, seen absolutely nothing from him since he broke thru all those years ago. Totally disagree with the russell is surplus comment mate. Would only sell him if an extraordinary offer came in. Can obviously play on the wing, and imo would be an exceptional wing back at this level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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