Ambitious Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Is that worth an answer. Grant was flapping away and totally lost his confidence Are you president of Grants fan club. Competition for places that's what it's about. Roos didn't give Grant competition he has a long way to go to get up to Championship standard Carson is known for flapping and played in a team that was relegated, well, lost his place in a team that was relegated.I'm all for replacing Grant, but ideally with someone better.I wanted to see us strengthen our backline and goalkeeper area. However, bringing in two players who are already similar if not worse than the players we already have, in my opinion, has limited that - it's just frustrating. We should have bought better, more shrewder! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted June 14, 2015 Share Posted June 14, 2015 Carson is known for flapping and played in a team that was relegated, well, lost his place in a team that was relegated.I'm all for replacing Grant, but ideally with someone better.I wanted to see us strengthen our backline and goalkeeper area. However, bringing in two players who are already similar if not worse than the players we already have, in my opinion, has limited that - it's just frustrating. We should have bought better, more shrewder! No guarantees in Football .Carson could turn out to be a fantastic signing and so could Pearce so lets see how it goes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfie Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Surely we were quite successful at bottling last season. A failure would have meant promotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Barton was in the Premier League last season and the team that beat Derby at wembley I don't think Leadbitter played at the same level of football last seasonBarton is a good footballer despite the fact he's been in trouble a lot. He may well have been in the Premier League but he didn't exactly excel did he. For the record QPR didn't beat us at Wembley, our own p1ss poor defending of a throw in and Bobby Zamora beat us. Barton was annonymous in the final... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 He may well have been in the Premier League but he didn't exactly excel did he. For the record QPR didn't beat us at Wembley, our own p1ss poor defending of a throw in and Bobby Zamora beat us. Barton was annonymous in the final...For the record they did have 10 men for a very long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 For the record they did have 10 men for a very long time.That doesn't mean barton made a significant contribution. I've got no issues with him coming with all his past deeds and stupid twitter philosiphising. I've got an issue because he's a bang average player... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLACML Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 For the record they did have 10 men for a very long time. We were dominating before the sending off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 We were dominating before the sending offYeah - the guy got sent off taking one for the team because we had cut them open (not for the first time). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 That doesn't mean barton made a significant contribution. I've got no issues with him coming with all his past deeds and stupid twitter philosiphising. I've got an issue because he's a bang average player... Right that's your opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLACML Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Right that's your opinion Sorry if it seems like I keep calling you out on things like this but you do it all the time. People describe a player as average (Hendrick, Barton) and you respond with a video of goal they've scored, like that actually proves anything. Give some analysis of what he brings to a team, not just a clip of a freekick that the keeper should save. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Sorry if it seems like I keep calling you out on things like this but you do it all the time. People describe a player as average (Hendrick, Barton) and you respond with a video of goal they've scored, like that actually proves anything. Give some analysis of what he brings to a team, not just a clip of a freekick that the keeper should save. But people rightly or wrongly are totally biased against Barton not matter how he does on the field. You don't play for England if you have no ability and you don't play for QPR or Man City in the Premier League either. Most of the stuff about Barton is negative because of his own actions in the past but he does have football ability IMO Reasoned arguments are always taken apart .eg You say we dominated QPR before the sending off at Wembley but that doesn't mean we should lose to 10 men does it . Joey Barton Full name Joseph Anthony Barton[1]Date of birth 2 September 1982 (age 32)[1]Place of birth Huyton, EnglandHeight 1.80 m (5 ft 11 in)[2]Playing position MidfielderYouth career–1996 Everton1996 Liverpool1997–2002 Manchester CitySenior career*Years Team Apps† (Gls)†2002–2007 Manchester City 130 (15)2007–2011 Newcastle United 81 (7)2011–2015 Queens Park Rangers 93 (7)2012–2013 → Marseille (loan) 25 (0)National team2003 England U21 2 (1)2007 England 1 (0)* Senior club appearances and goals counted for the domestic league only and correct as of 16:40, 27 May 2015 (UTC).† Appearances (Goals).Joseph Anthony "Joey" Barton (/ˈdʒoʊiː ˈbɑrtən/; born 2 September 1982) is an English professional footballer who plays as a midfielder, and is currently a free agent having been released from Queens Park Rangers. He was born and raised in Huyton, Merseyside.[3] He began his football career with Manchester City in 2002 after working his way through their youth system. His appearances in the senior side gradually increased over the following five years and he made more than 150 for the club. He earned his first cap for the England national team in February 2007,[4] despite his criticism of some of the team's players. He then joined Newcastle Unitedfor a fee of £5.8 million in July 2007. After four years with the club, he joined Queens Park Rangers in August 2011, from where he was loaned to Marseille in 2012. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLACML Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 But people rightly or wrongly are totally biased against Barton not matter how he does on the field. You don't play for England if you have no ability and you don't play for QPR or Man City in the Premier League either. Most of the stuff about Barton is negative because of his own actions in the past but he does have football ability IMO Reasoned arguments are always taken apart .eg You say we dominated QPR before the sending off at Wembley but that doesn't mean we should lose to 10 men does it .He played once for England 8 years ago, what relevance does that have now? Any ability he might have had is long gone. Loads of talentless dross play in the Premier League, we should know that better than anyone. Saying 'he played in the Premier League so he must be good' isn't exactly a strong argument, especially when QPR have been relegated both times. Reasoned arguments are always taken apart, so you go for unreasoned?No, we shouldn't have lost to 10 men but that wasn't the point. Your point was about whether the sending off changed the flow of the game, which it didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 He played once for England 8 years ago, what relevance does that have now? Any ability he might have had is long gone. Loads of talentless dross play in the Premier League, we should know that better than anyone. Saying 'he played in the Premier League so he must be good' isn't exactly a strong argument, especially when QPR have been relegated both times. Reasoned arguments are always taken apart, so you go for unreasoned?No, we shouldn't have lost to 10 men but that wasn't the point. Your point was about whether the sending off changed the flow of the game, which it didn't.Unreasoned it is then. The 10 men for them did change the flow of the game as we tried to go forward in the late stages of the game recklessly IMO instead of waiting to beat them in extra time as they would of tired with 10 men. Ive seen enough of Barton on MOTD and Sky to know how good a footballer he can be and he's still got some left in the tank .Barton is a dynamic midfielder who can pick passes and constantly breaks up opposition play Sometime I wonder if you have ever played football at all . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLACML Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Unreasoned it is then. The 10 men for them did change the flow of the game as we tried to go forward in the late stages of the game recklessly IMO instead of waiting to beat them in extra time as they would of tired with 10 men. I've seen enough of Barton on MOTD and Sky to know how good a footballer he can be and he's still got some left in the tank.Barton is a dynamic midfielder who can pick passes and constantly breaks up opposition play Sometime I wonder if you have ever played football at all .Ok, you could argue that but that's still completely irrelevant to your original point. You were basically saying that we only dominated because they went down to 10 men reasonably early but this clearly wasn't the case. We dominated the whole game. Anyway, back to Barton.I see nothing in Barton that we don't already have. Despite what you would think about him, he's not a particularly hard tackler. There's a large difference between absolutely crunching someone with a tackle and punching them off the ball. Speaking of 'dynamic', I don't particuarly like Bryson as a player but he's still far superior to Barton at his stage of his career.Curtains, your idea of a good player is seemingly someone who scores a good goal occasionally so are you really one to criticise me? You also said that Hendrick was technically superb so alarm bells are really starting to ring at this point. Could you tell me a generally rated player that you don't like? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Right that's your opinion Wowzers!!!! That freekick is up there with Roberto Carlos' against France, absolute tekkers!!! Or how about if the wall had done it's job and not ducked out the way, or Federici had a stronger wrist it wouldn't have gone in. If that's the best you can come up with to change my judgement, i'm sticking to my original opinion... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Ok, you could argue that but that's still completely irrelevant to your original point. You were basically saying that we only dominated because they went down to 10 men reasonably early but this clearly wasn't the case. We dominated the whole game. Anyway, back to Barton.I see nothing in Barton that we don't already have. Despite what you would think about him, he's not a particularly hard tackler. There's a large difference between absolutely crunching someone with a tackle and punching them off the ball. Speaking of 'dynamic', I don't particuarly like Bryson as a player but he's still far superior to Barton at his stage of his career.Curtains, your idea of a good player is seemingly someone who scores a good goal occasionally so are you really one to criticise me? You also said that Hendrick was technically superb so alarm bells are really starting to ring at this point. Could you tell me a generally rated player that you don't like?I'll turn that on its head what's your idea of a good player because Bryson is a good player but a totally different type of player to Barton. Bryson runs off players and is box to box more like Archie Gemmell was .Barton reminds me a little bit of Billy Bremner ie He digs in and is a little bit nasty I'm never going to agree with you as my football philosophy is different to yours Players I don't like are few and far between as I always see merits in most players . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLACML Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 I'll turn that on its head what's your idea of a good player because Bryson is a good player but a totally different type of player to Barton. Bryson runs off players and is box to box more like Archie Gemmell was .Barton reminds me a little bit of Billy Bremner ie He digs in and is a little bit nasty I'm never going to agree with you as my football philosophy is different to yours Players I don't like are few and far between as I always see merits in most players .I was going purely from your description of dynamic.A little bit nasty is not an attribute. If you said hard but fair, then yeah, but Barton isn't that. Your footballing 'philosophy' reminds me of a history teacher I used to have. He would ask questions that had definitive answers and no matter what was said, he never ever said it was wrong. I understand the teaching technique but sometimes people are just wrong. Sometimes footballers are just ****.It would be interesting to hear what you think my philosophy is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 I was going purely from your description of dynamic.A little bit nasty is not an attribute. If you said hard but fair, then yeah, but Barton isn't that. Your footballing 'philosophy' reminds me of a history teacher I used to have. He would ask questions that had definitive answers and no matter what was said, he never ever said it was wrong. I understand the teaching technique but sometimes people are just wrong. Sometimes footballers are just ****.It would be interesting to hear what you think my philosophy is.I have no idea what your philosophy is as you seem to think that the 10 men didn't change the game at Wembley against QPR . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curtains Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 Wowzers!!!! That freekick is up there with Roberto Carlos' against France, absolute tekkers!!!Or how about if the wall had done it's job and not ducked out the way, or Federici had a stronger wrist it wouldn't have gone in. If that's the best you can come up with to change my judgement, i'm sticking to my original opinion..Stick with it pal no problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLACML Posted June 15, 2015 Share Posted June 15, 2015 I have no idea what your philosophy is as you seem to think that the 10 men didn't change the game at Wembley against QPR .I really don't wish to be rude, but do you even read our conversations? Your replies are normally 5% relevant, 95% random thoughts.I said that it didn't change the flow of the game. I meant that we dominated before the red card, and we dominated after the red card. Yes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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