eranio20 Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Is being right that important to you? Not really, I'd much rather be wrong and Clough gets us promoted whilst murdering Forest and Leicester in the process. Even if we failed miserably in the Premiership under Clough, I'd still consider him a success for him to even get there. But personally, I just can't see it ever happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronnieronalde Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 How many times can Nigel Clough and Sam Rush come out and say top 6 is our target before it gets accepted that top 6 is our target. It's picking holes in things for picking sakes. How everyone can't just be sittinjg back and getting excited about the start of the season is beyond me. For the first time in ages we've got some real hope of pushing on. For the first time ever, our manager is talking up the squad as challengers. We've signed players we think are better than the ones we had. We're singing from the rooftops (to anyone who will listen) about how excited we are for the coming season and all some can do is moan. Please, just take a break for a while, it's the summer and we should be full of hope if nothing else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notts_ram Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 How many times can Nigel Clough and Sam Rush come out and say top 6 is our target before it gets accepted that top 6 is our target. I genuinely cant recall either saying that Top 6 is the target for this season, have you got a link, not playing devils advocate, cannot remember either ever specifying a Top 6 spot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cisse Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 This is the season I would like Nigel to get his hands on a loanee of the decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilkleyram Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 I know this is hard but let’s just take a leap of faith (not blind) and presume that the Board, GSE and Nigel actually want promotion to the Premier League. Let’s also accept that their strategy for doing so is to go up with a significant nucleus of young(ish) players sufficiently good that they will form the basis of a PL team, able to stay up – not win the thing, just stay up. They plan to add to any promotion winning squad but not at huge cost, partly for financial reasons, yes, but also because they genuinely believe in the importance of squad/team spirit (which could be damaged by too many expensive newcomers). So, the basis of any promotion must be that the majority of the winning squad must be able to prosper sufficiently in the PL. On that basis, IMO we have moved forward considerably in the last 12 months. With more to go. Lee Grant could be a good PL player; Brayford, ditto; Forsyth, maybe; Keogh, yes; Bucko – heresy to criticise him on here but we might need some extra central back four experience and knowledge – a Paul McGrath type when we go up. Barks will probably not be that person unless we (and he) are very lucky In midfield, options abound. Hughes may go to fund others but is PL class in waiting; so too Hendrick; Eustace (if he comes) may be caught out just as Robbie van de Laan was; Bryson might make the step up but would have to add something to his game – useful PL squad player though Up front, pace will always help Jamie Ward as will his ability to irritate; Russell, who knows?; Sammon will be undone by the cleverer centre backs but not every team and every back four is clever, even at PL level; Martin may struggle like Ron Willems did. Jacobs needs to develop as does Mason Bennett. Of the rest, they either need to continue to develop – Hoganson, Freeman, the new young lads coming through – or won’t survive promotion – Ben Davies. But Nigel is right to say this is his best squad so far – even now there are good options for him everywhere, in the back four, in midfield and up front. He will, I think, tinker more this year than last – we won’t have the fewest number of players record at the end of 13/14 I would guess - systems and players, depending on the opposition. And with more luck, continuing good home form and a much better away record (including more clean sheets/1-0 wins) there is no reason why he, and we, shouldn’t be more optimistic about completing stage 2 of the plan, challenging for promotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 I would just like some openness and transparency not banal utterances about how great our squad is - I can't think of many jobs where you are not given targets every year and there are success/failure rewards/consequences. Even on Championship Manager when I had nothing better to do the boards expectations were communicated every year, non compliance would result in the bullet. The person who has not been set any targets can never fail, I don't necessarily want Clough to fail I want someone to come and communicate what an acceptable season would be next year from the club and then reward achievement or conversely punish failure - stretch targets as well. The thing is, whereas the board might communicate their desires, wishes and targets to the manager, why should they tell you or I what they are? I have targets that apply to my work - but my local homebrew shop doesn't know what they are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notts_ram Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Fair point, conversely why wouldnt they want to communicate the clubs goals and targets to the supporters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Fair point, conversely why wouldnt they want to communicate the clubs goals and targets to the supporters? Sam Rush told me what he expected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notts_ram Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Sam Rush told me what he expected. Oh OK. Inbox me then. Need a giggle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Carroll V grant............grant Bywater V legzdins.....bywater Price V deeney...........draw Connolly V brayford....brayford Mceverley V forsyth....draw Leacock V buxton.......draw Albrectsen V keogh....keogh Nyatanga V obrien......obrien Davis v a wardrobe....the wardrobe Edworthy V oconnor.......edworthy Todd V gjokai.............void Stewart V hoganson.....draw Zadkovich V freeman....freeman Powell....... Camara...... Green V bryson........bryson Teale V coutts..........coutts Addison V hendrick....draw Barazite V jacobs......draw Sterjovski V davies......davies Barnes V hughes.....hughes Savage V eustace......void Pearson V bailey........draw? Kazmierczek...... Ellington V tyson...........draw Commons V ward........commons Davies V robinson........davies Prijovic V doyle...............void Dickinson V bennett.......bennett Villa V martin..................villa Hulse V sammon............hulse Varney V russell.............void we havent seen him ?.........v ball Result 10-6 to the current squad (miscounted) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ladyram Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 I genuinely cant recall either saying that Top 6 is the target for this season, have you got a link, not playing devils advocate, cannot remember either ever specifying a Top 6 spot They both have Notts, I'm absolutely sure of it and interestingly, a couple of players have too, one of them is Bryson in an interview he did about a fortnight ago. What I've noticed is the frequency of the same hope and determination to actually do it, is evident - something seemed different within the squad and that was before Clough said this is his best team. I can't wait for it to start now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Well apparently we have a top squad and a top manager.. If we don't finish in the top 6 one of those will be wrong.. Wait I'll rephrase that.. When we don't finish in the top 6 we will asume one of those comments will be wrong but more likely people on here will just find yet another excuse.. Like it's the boards fault our away form is poor, it was the opponents' GK's fault that we didn't win.. Or that made up statisitic that we conceded the majority of our goals to long range wonderstrikes.. I can't wait until the season begins.. I'm looking forward to Messi II (Russell) scoring on average 1.3 goals a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Well apparently we have a top squad and a top manager.. If we don't finish in the top 6 one of those will be wrong.. Wait I'll rephrase that.. When we don't finish in the top 6 we will asume one of those comments will be wrong but more likely people on here will just find yet another excuse.. Like it's the boards fault our away form is poor, it was the opponents' GK's fault that we didn't win.. Or that made up statisitic that we conceded the majority of our goals to long range wonderstrikes.. I can't wait until the season begins.. I'm looking forward to Messi II (Russell) scoring on average 1.3 goals a game. There are times, Bris, that you talk sense. There are other times when you spout rot. This is one of those decomposing occasions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notts_ram Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 They both have Notts, I'm absolutely sure of it and interestingly, a couple of players have too, one of them is Bryson in an interview he did about a fortnight ago. I'm genuinely pleased about that, pleased that now we have something to measure the success or failure of the season against - I hope Clough gets all the plaudits if he gets us into the Top 6 (and people on here can say I told you so) and likewise if we dont make the Top 6 I will be looking for change in management, either way the 2 potential outcomes please me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scott129 Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Well apparently we have a top squad and a top manager.. If we don't finish in the top 6 one of those will be wrong.. Wait I'll rephrase that.. When we don't finish in the top 6 we will asume one of those comments will be wrong but more likely people on here will just find yet another excuse.. Like it's the boards fault our away form is poor, it was the opponents' GK's fault that we didn't win.. Or that made up statisitic that we conceded the majority of our goals to long range wonderstrikes.. I can't wait until the season begins.. I'm looking forward to Messi II (Russell) scoring on average 1.3 goals a game. The bits in bold are completely unnecessary and reaffirm my opinion that you're a jumped up little troll. It's all well and good having an opinion but there's no need to belittle other people's opinions with pompous arrogance and sarcasm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramble On Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Carroll V grant............grant Bywater V legzdins.....bywater Price V deeney...........draw Connolly V brayford....brayford Mceverley V forsyth....draw Leacock V buxton.......draw Albrectsen V keogh....keogh Nyatanga V obrien......obrien Davis v a wardrobe....the wardrobe Edworthy V oconnor.......edworthy Todd V gjokai.............void Stewart V hoganson.....draw Zadkovich V freeman....freeman Powell....... Camara...... Green V bryson........bryson Teale V coutts..........coutts Addison V hendrick....draw Barazite V jacobs......draw Sterjovski V davies......davies Barnes V hughes.....hughes Savage V eustace......void Pearson V bailey........draw? Kazmierczek...... Ellington V tyson...........draw Commons V ward........commons Davies V robinson........davies Prijovic V doyle...............void Dickinson V bennett.......bennett Villa V martin..................villa Hulse V sammon............hulse Varney V russell.............void we havent seen him ?.........v ball Result 10-6 to the current squad (miscounted) Half of them I went the other way to you, shows how people's opinions can differ so much having seen all of them play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curb Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 We're pretty much shuffling out average players and shuffling in average players. IMO the squad has been thinned out yet again and we won't get past December without another crisis/loss of form. The only thing that's changed this season is expectations, there's going to be a lot of excuses and backtracking come February. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eddie Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 We're pretty much shuffling out average players and shuffling in average players. IMO the squad has been thinned out yet again and we won't get past December without another crisis/loss of form. The only thing that's changed this season is expectations, there's going to be a lot of excuses and backtracking come February. Maybe you ought to make preparations then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curb Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Maybe you ought to make preparations then. Ha, nice one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilkleyram Posted July 9, 2013 Share Posted July 9, 2013 Well apparently we have a top squad and a top manager.. If we don't finish in the top 6 one of those will be wrong.. Wait I'll rephrase that.. When we don't finish in the top 6 we will asume one of those comments will be wrong but more likely people on here will just find yet another excuse.. Like it's the boards fault our away form is poor, it was the opponents' GK's fault that we didn't win.. Or that made up statisitic that we conceded the majority of our goals to long range wonderstrikes.. I can't wait until the season begins.. I'm looking forward to Messi II (Russell) scoring on average 1.3 goals a game. Bris, old fool that I am I prefer to believe that you are a genuine rams fan supporting from afar. I also try to believe, right or not, that you deliberately aim to inject a dose of realism in many of your posts to counter what you think is the over optimism of some, because perhaps of a distant experience of watching properly world class players in Derby shirts. What would we all give for those times to return? Sometimes, I think, you do it deliberately, just to get a reaction. Fair enough I don't think that failing to reach the top 6 this season will necessarily be a failure - like all things the Championship has moved on this year with new teams with different financial strength and different squads - about 25% of the division. In short it is a different competition than last year and is different every year. But I do think that we should believe that our club and playing squad are moving forward towards promotion; that our players are overall of better quality, playing (even) better football than before and starting to win more often. Whether that means that we are in the top 6 at the end of the year is, to some extent, in the lap of the Gods, and the performance of others. What I do like to see, and hear, is that there is more talk from within the club about us doing well, that expectations are being raised, to my mind with good reason. And what I like, above all, is the great feeling of hope and positive expectation before the season starts. Trouble is that I have had similar feelings every season for the last 50 or so. And, as you will know, most of those have not exactly been successful. Ah well, that's being a Rams fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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