MuespachRam Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Arthur Cox - The BEST by MILES Jim Smith - Great days, but hung on too long Billy Davies - Whatever you might think of him, he did what the rest of the managers below didnt - He got us promoted - his JOB. George Burley - Nice football, failed at the final hurdle. Roy Mac - See George Burley Nigel Clough - See George Burley (at times) and we don't look like getting to the final hurdle. John Gregory - Should have been given more time - Started some promiising work by getting rid of all the deadwood (Burley, Kinky etc) Phil Brown - Oh dear Paul Jewell - See Phiil Brown. Colin Todd - The most embarrased i have ever been walking out of the Bristol Rovers FA Cup game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curb Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Clough + no money = mid tableClough + money = who knows - he deserves a chance to find out thoughA.N.Other + money = who knows. But we've got a manager already - why not give him the chance to spend some money first? Because, as we found with Jewell we might only get one chance at it, waste it and it could be another 5-10 years before we get another chance. Clough spends it, doesn't utilise players properly, falls out with some, the chance is gone. We know what we're getting with Clough alright, an average manager. There are better ones, there are worse. I realise its more complicated than that, for instance I don't trust GSE to employ the right manager if Clough did leave, but that's another argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asanovic Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Because, as we found with Jewell we might only get one chance at it, waste it and it could be another 5-10 years before we get another chance. Clough spends it, doesn't utilise players properly, falls out with some, the chance is gone.We know what we're getting with Clough alright, an average manager. There are better ones, there are worse. I realise its more complicated than that, for instance I don't trust GSE to employ the right manager if Clough did leave, but that's another argument. I don't agree with that. The only thing I know about Nigel Clough is that he can keep a mid table team just about mid table. I can't judge whether he'd be exceptional or total sh*te with a decent amount of money. I think Utch mentioned in a previous post, Clough has barely spent a million, bottom line, since he joined. Until he has the opportunity to spend more, I don't have a clue if he's average or not. Shackell is a case in point. I'm sure he'd like to have kept him, but to finance Keogh (who IMO has turned out to be a better player) he had to sell. Imagine being in a position where we had Shackell and Keogh at the back, O'Brien and Buxton as back up, and Barker to come back? The season we keep hold of everyone he wants, and we make additions rather than replacements is the season where I will judge him on whether he's capable of doing anything decent with us. Noises coming out of the club indicate this is going to be next season, but let's see. I'm not saying there's no one better out there - there is, I'm sure. I just don't see the point in appointing someone else unless we're going to give some money to spend. And if we're going to do that - why not give the current bloke the chance? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroyDyer Posted March 13, 2013 Author Share Posted March 13, 2013 Because, as you say yourself, there are better managers out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asanovic Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Because, as you say yourself, there are better managers out there. Yeah, not that would join us though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TroyDyer Posted March 13, 2013 Author Share Posted March 13, 2013 Why not? How many managers have we approached, that have turned us down? People assume no one would come here. I don't know where these assumptions come from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Because, as you say yourself, there are better managers out there. Like who? I'll take Adkins as an example maybe... He's had success with 2 teams... However he did have a lot of money to throw at Southampton... Almost anyone else available has had moderate success with a single team... Or has had success with some and tanked with others... I think coming to Derby (Good fanbase, good facilities, good youth set up, good history) would be very attractive to a lot of managers HOWEVER I don;t see any out there who have produced championship winning teams using less than £2 million a season... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
top 6 finish Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 so pretty unanimous that Clough is average, yet you say youd rather stick with mid table championship when its just as likely that a Jim Smith or Arthur Cox is waiting for a phone call. youre scared of change because we could get a phil brown or paul jewell. it doesnt make sense to me. We shouldn't get confused between how bad they did here with how their record is elsewhere.For instance you mention Phil Brown who gets bad coverage on here.From my albeit shaky memory,after he got sacked from here he saved Hull from relegation.The following season he got Hull promoted with little money,kept them in the premier the next season again with little investment. Incidently when he got sacked from PNE they were as low as ...er midtable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilkoRam Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 McDermot? And sorry had Nigel produced a Championship side before coming to us? And can people stop saying we can't afford wages etc as you have no idea what wages we can pay or are being paid by other clubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 McDermot? And sorry had Nigel produced a Championship side before coming to us? And can people stop saying we can't afford wages etc as you have no idea what wages we can pay or are being paid by other clubs. I think as good as McDermott has been for Reading is there any proof he would be better than Nigel? Paul Jewell got Wigan promoted... Phil Brown got Hull promoted... neither were a success here or after... Also he had a bit more money at Reading than Nigel has had... AND finally I never claimed that Nigel had produced a championship side before coming to us... You are making an odd argument there... What I'm saying is that IF we were to replace Nigel it must be with someone who has history of doing well with at least 2 teams and preferably on a small budget... It's NOT worth gambling on someone who could be awful when we've never given Nigel the chance to spend a decent amount of money... In fact his job has been to actively get rid of people for 4 years... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilkoRam Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 I know you weren't saying Nigel was. Sorry for the confusion. My point is, we took a gamble on Nigel and have him a chance but now we must stipulate that a proven manager must come in to replace him. Why's that? Due to fear of change? It could be worse? If so I get that and agree there is always that risk and that fear that a different manager might do worse but it's a chance worth taking in my book. And you say McDermott spent more? You sure about that? Always under the impression he got Reading to the play-offs one season and promoted the next and it was on very very little money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 I know you weren't saying Nigel was. Sorry for the confusion. My point is, we took a gamble on Nigel and have him a chance but now we must stipulate that a proven manager must come in to replace him. Why's that? Due to fear of change? It could be worse? If so I get that and agree there is always that risk and that fear that a different manager might do worse but it's a chance worth taking in my book. And you say McDermott spent more? You sure about that? Always under the impression he got Reading to the play-offs one season and promoted the next and it was on very very little money. I'm not averse to change, but I'd rather give Nigel a chance since I think this is the first summer he's had no pressure to get rid of players who were brought in before he joined... this for me is the first time he gets to improve HIS team... and if the board are going to give someone some money to spend I'd like it to be him... If we brought someone new in they'd pull apart the team and start over... You may be right about McDermott, I'm basing it on no research whatsoever... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 I need to know was Tyson supposed to improve Nigels team IYO He was SUPPOSED to yes... They didn't sign him as a favour to anyone... I still think he's been unlucky that he spent the whole first season injured and when he was fit Nigel realised he'd rather play Sammon and Ward... Would have Tyson ahead of Theo any day of the week... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 McDermot? And sorry had Nigel produced a Championship side before coming to us? And can people stop saying we can't afford wages etc as you have no idea what wages we can pay or are being paid by other clubs. You only have to look at the kind of players we've signed to get an inkling of the kind of wages we pay.Even our £1m signings have come from clubs that would likely have been paying less (at the time) than us,with the exception of Sammon.Even there,Wigan signed him from Scotland (where Clough has said wage demands are not high,hence his own possibly forced interest in this market) and it's likely that he wouldn't have been on a great deal at Wigan,as he was hardly signed to go straight in as a first team regular there.If you look at our 2 recent loan signings,they'd both been previously loaned to lower division clubs-an indication of loan wages we might have to pay. I don't think Reading is a particularly good example to choose.They were a far better side/squad than us when they came down.For them it wasn't a matter of trying to get rid of dross,but of attempting to keep what they could and using the odd sale to strengthen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 I agree to a certain extent but i just worry about our present situation. ie 1 win in 11 .. The away form and cup form is awful. Blackburn beat us easy 3-0 in FA cup at Pride Park and our away form is so so bad. Nigel has done a reasonable job at times but we always tail off and have bad runs . There is unrest and alot of fans want change. I would say that the only thing everyone on this entire forum would agree with is that we're worried! I'm just keeping my worry in a little box surrounded by a protective bubble of faith... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curb Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 That ugly girlfriend's got a lot to answer for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curb Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 We shouldn't get confused between how bad they did here with how their record is elsewhere.For instance youmention Phil Brown who gets bad coverage on here.From my albeit shaky memory,after he got sacked from herehe saved Hull from relegation.The following season he got Hull promoted with little money,kept them in the premierthe next season again with little investment.Incidently when he got sacked from PNE they were as low as ...er midtable. Would you like us to get him back then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
top 6 finish Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 No just putting the record straight.I also had to do the same for Jewell on another thread.I sometimes wish people would check the facts before sonding off.I get things wrong I admit but it's an age thing with me, memory and all that.Most of the misinformation comes from the Clough groupies who are desperate to show their man in a good light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ronnieronalde Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 No just putting the record straight.I also had to do the same for Jewell on another thread.I sometimes wish people would check the facts before sonding off.I get things wrong I admit but it's an age thing with me, memory and all that.Most of the misinformation comes from the Clough groupies who are desperate to show their man in a good light. Let me ask you this top6. On a Derby County forum. Why would anybody sit there and say that Paul Jewell is not a bad manager because he did well at Wigan? Why should Derby fans be judging someone at how they do somewhere else? I don't care if Jewell won everything from the cracked cup to the World Club championship for anyone else. All I know is that while he was here he nearly destroyed the club. It's no good saying ah well he nearly got us relegated twice but he did OK at bradford so it's alright. I wonder when Clough is sacked will you be coming on and defending his record because he did OK at Burton? Will you be setting the record straight then? Clough groupies, waffle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
top 6 finish Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 Certainly already done it.He got Burton promoted to the conference from Northern Premier thats it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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