World of crypto

[Returning ram]

21 hours ago, NottsRam77 said:

Everyones different 

as i said DYOR and whatever works for you then go with. We all have different outlooks and risk tolerances and shouldnt deviate from our beliefs

i deem holding money in bank a risk as i know it will lose value against real inflation. Im not saying im Right its just what i believe. 
prem bonds, stocks and shares , property etc etc can all work for people and gives them the security they are happy with.  
 

imo diversity is also key 

And good luck to you, if BTC is working for you, then why not shout about it. I'd certainly wished I'd had the hindsight to invest all then years ago. People keep saying the value is going to drop, it's going to fall through etc...but doesn't seem to be happening any time soon, so hopefully you continue to make money.

What I do find interesting, is that one of the main selling points was its anonymity and the obvious benefits it brought with that to some. I was shown last week how you can trace the funds now from the wallets and the journey the funds takes via open source software.
 

I won't delve into what they had done, but it does highlight that even with regulatory focus, it appears it's here to stay, which is where I thought it would start to lose its appeal.

[Wolfie]

On 16/06/2024 at 08:47, NottsRam77 said:

But not in line with inflation.

my mrs is a teacher and sister a nurse

so am well aware of this 

my car renewal quote went from 297 to 498 …

my expected fuel bill sits at circa 1500 from 1100 per annum.

council tax 205 to 221 per month (whats that 7 ish percent) 

Actual inflation vs measured inflation 

How is your fuel bill still going up?. That's one of the negative drivers that's brought average inflation back down to what it is now.

So if your car insurance is now £41.50 / month and your council tax is now £221, that's only a fraction of your total monthly outgoings - which will be offset by stable or falling prices for other stuff (petrol, gas/Elec, some food etc etc).

[Stive Pesley]

21 minutes ago, Wolfie said:

How is your fuel bill still going up?.

His mining rig? 😂

[Comrade 86]

7 hours ago, GboroRam said:

I think the reality is, bitcoin looks like a great investment at the moment. It is volatile, but consistently has gone up more than it has gone down. 

Just my opinion, but I think now is a terrible time to be buying BTC. The price has plateaued for probably the longest period ever and price history shows that any sustained plateau a is typically a portent to another dip, or 'balancing'. That's always been the trend with BTC and why I've always favoured playing in the dips over the HODL strategy, as doing so greatly increases the amount of coins one accumulate over time and also affords investors a means to play with profits, not savings. It's one of the very few absolutes for me.

Of course as with any investment, past performance is not a 100% indicator of future values, which is why I get testy over anyone suggesting or implying that BTC trumps all other investments, though I do agree with @NottsRam77's assertion that the price is likely to continue to climb over time.

My guess is we'll see BTC balancing down to somewhere between $35K and $50k, before rallying to in excess of $100k in 2025/25, but there are a number of outside factors that worry me, that give me pause for thought. The regulatory outlook seems to change daily and with elections both here and in the US, who really knows how the new incumbents will view things? There is a growing and increasingly noisy group of lobbyists unhappy with BTC's carbon footprint, a not unreasonable stance IMO and from a transactional perspective, regards for mining are coming under ever-increasing pressure.

Equally, there are also some strong positive indicators, greater uptake of the BTC blockchain in the financial sector being a good example, that could really benefit BTC holders. Visa and Mastercard are increasingly using the chain to validate payments and are even extending that to significantly less mainstream blockchains, Solana being the latest addition I believe and this is only one of the reasons I believe that out of hand dismissal of all alt coins (read 'blockchains') makes very little sense.

By the same token, some folk seem to believe that the value of BTC is notional and to a degree, it is, but a fundamental understanding of blockchain tech and it's related eco systems would explain why it's not purely notional. The fact is, this is a volatile and ever evolving landscape and anyone wishing to get involved really should spend some significant time researching the subject, hence my DOYR mantra, the only 'absolute' I stand by.

[NottsRam77]

1 hour ago, Comrade 86 said:

Just my opinion, but I think now is a terrible time to be buying BTC. The price has plateaued for probably the longest period ever and price history shows that any sustained plateau a is typically a portent to another dip, or 'balancing'. That's always been the trend with BTC and why I've always favoured playing in the dips over the HODL strategy, as doing so greatly increases the amount of coins one accumulate over time and also affords investors a means to play with profits, not savings. It's one of the very few absolutes for me.

Of course as with any investment, past performance is not a 100% indicator of future values, which is why I get testy over anyone suggesting or implying that BTC trumps all other investments, though I do agree with @NottsRam77's assertion that the price is likely to continue to climb over time.

My guess is we'll see BTC balancing down to somewhere between $35K and $50k, before rallying to in excess of $100k in 2025/25, but there are a number of outside factors that worry me, that give me pause for thought. The regulatory outlook seems to change daily and with elections both here and in the US, who really knows how the new incumbents will view things? There is a growing and increasingly noisy group of lobbyists unhappy with BTC's carbon footprint, a not unreasonable stance IMO and from a transactional perspective, regards for mining are coming under ever-increasing pressure.

Equally, there are also some strong positive indicators, greater uptake of the BTC blockchain in the financial sector being a good example, that could really benefit BTC holders. Visa and Mastercard are increasingly using the chain to validate payments and are even extending that to significantly less mainstream blockchains, Solana being the latest addition I believe and this is only one of the reasons I believe that out of hand dismissal of all alt coins (read 'blockchains') makes very little sense.

By the same token, some folk seem to believe that the value of BTC is notional and to a degree, it is, but a fundamental understanding of blockchain tech and it's related eco systems would explain why it's not purely notional. The fact is, this is a volatile and ever evolving landscape and anyone wishing to get involved really should spend some significant time researching the subject, hence my DOYR mantra, the only 'absolute' I stand by.

Please note , I have been very clear, very categoric and repetitive with regard to do ur own research and  repeatedly on here said that past performance is no indication of future performance of any asset.
 

However i believe that if u do ur own research and learn about bitcoin … and not from some guy from a football forum you will start to understand where im coming from and why im so passionate about it, and why imo its the superior asset class to beat inflation.

it is volatile, but its still in its infancy stage .. adoption… and its getting adopted which i have already covered.. soon to be in every pension pot on the planet.

Re your first Statement ……. 
Go look at the charts , bitcoin had plateaued for 6 months after the halving on most other cycles so this is absolutely nothing new.
in terms of worst time to buy bitcoin, depends on your belief in it and ur timeframe which is down to the individual. We are start of the bull run, is it the best time to buy no.. is it the worst no. 

Totally agree the regulatory landscape is always changing.

what is interesting now though is that bitcoin is now seen as a potential vote winner such is its fanatical slightly cult like support.

youve got trump in the states being very very vocal over his support for it and to keep the regulators off our crypto.. now does he mean it ? Probably not.. but thats not he point. The point is wall street are now behind it and it means that bitcoin cannot be ignored and is very much part of the global future financial framework. 

 

Edited June 17 by NottsRam77

[Comrade 86]

8 minutes ago, NottsRam77 said:

Go look at the charts , bitcoin had plateaued for 6 months after the halving on most other cycles so this is absolutely nothing new.
in terms of worst time to buy bitcoin, delends on your belief in it and ur timeframe which is down to the individual. 

 

And this is why I CBA with this thread. I've said historically that any lengthy plateau has most often been a portent to balancing, NOT that there's never been a plateau before. Try reading what folk say before jumping in with 'go look at the charts' comments. 

Enough's enough. I'm out.

Edited June 17 by Comrade 86

[NottsRam77]

7 hours ago, Wolfie said:

How is your fuel bill still going up?. That's one of the negative drivers that's brought average inflation back down to what it is now.

So if your car insurance is now £41.50 / month and your council tax is now £221, that's only a fraction of your total monthly outgoings - which will be offset by stable or falling prices for other stuff (petrol, gas/Elec, some food etc etc).

in the last 2 years or so its gone from 1100 a year to whatever it went to for all of us cos of russia and has now settled back down to 1500… with talk of a slight

increase latter half of the year and a slight pull back start of next 

i make that about a 40% increase in the last 2 years ….. 

that aint 2% measured inflation is it 

Edited June 17 by NottsRam77

[NottsRam77]

21 minutes ago, Comrade 86 said:

And this is why I CBA with this thread. I've said historically that any lengthy plateau has most often been a portent to balancing, NOT that there's never been a plateau before. Try reading what folk say before jumping in with 'go look at the charts' comments. 

Enough's enough. I'm out.

There is irony here, that u chose to ignore that i had so many times said DYOR and that history means nothing

 

but hey 

best of luck

Edited June 17 by NottsRam77

[NottsRam77]

7 hours ago, Returning ram said:

And good luck to you, if BTC is working for you, then why not shout about it. I'd certainly wished I'd had the hindsight to invest all then years ago. People keep saying the value is going to drop, it's going to fall through etc...but doesn't seem to be happening any time soon, so hopefully you continue to make money.

What I do find interesting, is that one of the main selling points was its anonymity and the obvious benefits it brought with that to some. I was shown last week how you can trace the funds now from the wallets and the journey the funds takes via open source software.
 

I won't delve into what they had done, but it does highlight that even with regulatory focus, it appears it's here to stay, which is where I thought it would start to lose its appeal.

I think theres a little confusion there

let me try and explain

Anonymity isnt one of bitcoins features/ selling points

quite the opposite, transparency.

I can send u £1000 of btc and anyone in the world, anywhere in the world can view that transaction. Bitcoin is a public ledger for the planet… just think about that for a second… i think thats mindblowing

no one can change the transaction, no one can delete it, copy it,  reverse it, manipulate it. Its there.. forever for anyone to view

etched in digital time 
 

it also doesnt need the permission of a 3rd party, it doesnt need to be held by a third party 

it is trustless and permissionless

those are its main points 

 

    

Edited June 17 by NottsRam77

[Comrade 86]

23 minutes ago, NottsRam77 said:

There is irony here, that u chose to ignore that i had so many times said DYOR and that history means nothing

 

but hey 

best of luck

I haven't said that history means nothing either, that's your assertion, not mine, indeed I used historical trends to try and explain the thinking behind the notion that BTC might be bought for considerably less than than the current figures in the not too distant future. You are so quick to jump on anyone whose opinion does not precisely mirror yours, that you can't even read what they've actually said. 

But hey, best of luck 

Edited June 17 by Comrade 86

[NottsRam77]

13 minutes ago, Comrade 86 said:

I haven't said that history means nothing either, that's your assertion, not mine, indeed I used historical trends to try and explain the thinking behind the notion that BTC might be bought for considerably less than than the current figures in the not too distant future. You are so quick to jump on anyone whose opinion does not precisely mirror yours, that you can't even read what they've actually said. 

But hey, best of luck 

For what its worth i think the current levels will represent the next cycles low.

based purely on chart data .. but again thats history related and speculating 

[Returning ram]

9 minutes ago, NottsRam77 said:

I think theres a little confusion there

let me try and explain

Anonymity isnt one of bitcoins features/ selling points

quite the opposite, transparency.

I can send u £1000 of btc and anyone in the world, anywhere in the world can view that transaction. Bitcoin is a public ledger for the planet… just think about that for a second… i think thats mindblowing

no one can change the transaction, no one can delete it, copy it,  reverse it, manipulate it. Its there.. forever for anyone to view

etched in digital time 
 

it also doesnt need the permission of a 3rd party, it doesnt need to be held by a third party 

it is trustless and permissionless

those are its main points 

 

    

I understand Crypto, I work with it. I said one of the main selling points was its perceived anonymity at the time, which it was, for criminal activity. You will of course know that even now, it's the main payment type on the dark web.
 

My surprise was that it's remains as popular despite a lot of regulatory focus around it and the exchanges that are the bridge between turning the currency into cash. I know what people see as benefits, once again not my point, I don't need a salesman pitch to tell me, I can see the numbers for myself, I just said in my opinion I was surprised it hasn't impacted it more.

[NottsRam77]

On 16/06/2024 at 11:31, Day said:

If the FCA are reading, I am not a financial advisor, this is just my own personal view.

Never listen to people on the internet what to do with your money, especially through social media/YouTube.

Too many shills and influencers out there with only one interest in mind, their own. Ask yourselves why someone on X would want to make you rich, why this attractive woman on Instagram in lingerie is promoting a Crypto coin.

Investing your hard earned money correctly is one of the biggest challenges we all face, do your own research then if it fails or returns you a lot of money, that is on you.

Memecoin and shitcoin shillers are a poison of the crypto space hence why its always key to do ur own research / dont by s***/meme coins 🤷‍♂️lol

[Wolfie]

43 minutes ago, NottsRam77 said:

in the last 2 years or so its gone from 1100 a year to whatever it went to for all of us cos of russia and has now settled back down to 1500… with talk of a slight

increase latter half of the year and a slight pull back start of next 

i make that about a 40% increase in the last 2 years ….. 

that aint 2% measured inflation is it 

You really don’t seem to understand that the inflation figures are an average of everything over a rolling 12 months period.

Big energy rises were reflected in last years high inflation but the reductions since are helping pull it down again. 

[Comrade 86]

1 minute ago, Returning ram said:

I understand Crypto, I work with it. I said one of the main selling points was its perceived anonymity at the time, which it was, for criminal activity. You will of course know that even now, it's the main payment type on the dark web.
 

My surprise was that it's remains as popular despite a lot of regulatory focus around it and the exchanges that are the bridge between turning the currency into cash. I know what people see as benefits, once again not my point, I don't need a salesman pitch to tell me, I can see the numbers for myself, I just said in my opinion I was surprised it hasn't impacted it more.

I'd have said this was an entirely reasonable position. My understanding is that despite the layers being peeled away, crypto values have been propped up by different kinds of investors. BTC for example, has transitioned from a 'nerd' investment to something far more mainstream and it's likely the institutional investors who have propped up the market. By way of an example, have a look at MicroStrategy's investment history.

Your premise in entirely correct however and you may yet see your hunch fulfilled. In the US, moves are afoot to outlaw 'privately hosted' crypto holdings - basically anything not held on the mainstream exchanges and therefore visible and open to regulation. There's an absolute tonne of crypto investors using Tresor vaults and the like to securely (and secretly) hold their coins and it will be interesting to see what effect this new legislation may have. My hunch is that those who have hidden ill-gotten gains on pen drives may be getting twitchy right about now, though for a little while longer, there are still means for them evade detection.

[NottsRam77]

23 hours ago, Wolfie said:

You really don’t seem to understand that the inflation figures are an average of everything over a rolling 12 months period.

Big energy rises were reflected in last years high inflation but the reductions since are helping pull it down again. 

I do actually mate,

Im talking about how inflation has effected me and my wage and savings buying power. Who says inflation has to be measured annually? The governement ? Colour me Shocked.

i deal in longer time frames, which is why u wont  see me crying about bitcoin being volatile week to week , month to month .. im looking at inflation , my money and bitcoin over the big picture and what bitcoin does through its cycles 

inflation will erode into my moneys purchasing power and bitcoin will go up against fiat because fiat is constantly being debased

both statements are true 

Anything else is just noise quite frankly

 

Edited June 18 by NottsRam77

[NottsRam77]

23 hours ago, Returning ram said:

I understand Crypto, I work with it. I said one of the main selling points was its perceived anonymity at the time, which it was, for criminal activity. You will of course know that even now, it's the main payment type on the dark web.
 

My surprise was that it's remains as popular despite a lot of regulatory focus around it and the exchanges that are the bridge between turning the currency into cash. I know what people see as benefits, once again not my point, I don't need a salesman pitch to tell me, I can see the numbers for myself, I just said in my opinion I was surprised it hasn't impacted it more.

Iv no problem with regulatory compliance from exchanges. 
 

its all to do with making sure taxes are paid on realised profits… fair enough to me 🤷

[Returning ram]

17 hours ago, NottsRam77 said:

Iv no problem with regulatory compliance from exchanges. 
 

its all to do with making sure taxes are paid on realised profits… fair enough to me 🤷

Not really, ATE is way down the list, source of funds is much higher.

[NottsRam77]

5 hours ago, Returning ram said:

Not really, ATE is way down the list, source of funds is much higher.

Hmmm have to respectfully agree to disagree on that one 👍

Edited June 19 by NottsRam77

[Returning ram]

30 minutes ago, NottsRam77 said:

Hmmm have to respectfully agree to disagree on that one 👍

Fair enough, I can only tell you what the regulator has as its priorities for all types of FC.

Sanctions then AML, followed by fraud and ATE 😊