Gritstone Ram Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Will the value of the shares drop now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Will the value of the shares drop now?No,not really.The ultimate real value of the shares will only be determined when they sell up.It would have been interesting over the last few years if we'd been a public limited company quoted on the stock exchange, and we could have seen the swings in share price ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We'll be back in 81 Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Ramblur,So the ivestors are owed 12m and how much did they spend to buy the club? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Ramblur,So the ivestors are owed 12m and how much did they spend to buy the club?Overall (including buying out AP) it was c£16m, but don't forget they've also put in a further equity investment of around £50m to cover working capital. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 Ramblur,So the ivestors are owed 12m and how much did they spend to buy the club?dint forget about all the other loans they gave to the club that were swapped for equity as well. Not sure of the numbers but its considerable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We'll be back in 81 Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 So when they decide to sell up what figure would you say will be a realistic sum to sell for? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 So when they decide to sell up what figure would you say will be a realistic sum to sell for?I have no idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 So when they decide to sell up what figure would you say will be a realistic sum to sell for?Depends what division we were in,and I haven't a clue what the figure might be in either.Depends what the owners would be willing to sell for and what a buyer would be willing to pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We'll be back in 81 Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 To get there money back they would be looking at around 70m then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted May 3, 2015 Share Posted May 3, 2015 To get there money back they would be looking at around 70m then.Something like that. Can't be accurate on the working capital because things aren't exactly crystal clear there yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Apologies for bringing this thread back again,but I just wanted to correct something I said earlier.I'd forgotten that Mel only joined in the latter stages of the accounting period,and the £3.7m of working capital would have been needed a lot earlier than that.Hence I now feel that it was just coincidence that the likely amount he input was similar to this figure, and that it probably formed the major part of the £5m cash sitting on the B/S at the year end. The working capital was therefore almost certainly provided by NAP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Well I've thoroughly enjoyed this thread... @ramblur I'm assuming you are an accountant or something similar in real life? Obviously much more clued in than most on the finance side... However, the art of storytelling seems to elude you so far! Let me see if I can lend some simplicity using my advertising skills: Some people who own the club have invested LOADS (money) for little reward (shares) eg. £28m for a single share This is AWESOME cos it shows a REAL commitment to the club (They only stand a chance of getting that back if we get promoted... If even then) We still have debt - However not with the Coop anymore Of the debt we DO have only £3m is to an external institution - The rest is to investors (who do well if the club do well) I think this is right? Yeh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 Would that it were that simple,Cheron (and I do like storytelling). The one share at £28m+ was really a technical matter,and I can't say for definite that the owners paid off £12m of debt,only that it seems a distinct possibility.Good effort though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheron85 Posted May 8, 2015 Share Posted May 8, 2015 @ramblur It was more of a massive over simplification... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B4ev6is Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 I say derby is worth 90m to 120m Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RLACML Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 I say derby is worth 90m to 120mBased on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 I'd say if you offered them that,there'd be a big cloud of dust Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B4ev6is Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 Our fan base ppFirst rate training groundA great youth system and a really good under 21 side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramblur Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 The net assets as at 30/6/14 were valued at just over £27m,so anyone considering an offer based on this info would just have to decide how much goodwill to include in such offer.As I've mentioned before,intangible fixed assets (players' registrations) appear to be way undervalued at not much more than £2m. An impressive Academy might also lead to goodwill,as well as increasing income streams (although one wonders how much more might be squeezed out)Don't ask me what I think the club's worth,however,as I haven't a clue.As we all know,beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted May 10, 2015 Share Posted May 10, 2015 An annual return (AR01) has landed at CH,giving details of shares issued as at 30/11/14 (so bear in mind these totals will have increased in the meantime).The issued shares are in sterling and other currencies,and include both ordinary and preference shares.The preference shares have no voting rights,but have preference over any dividends available.Both classes of shares have a nominal (par) value of £1,but as you will see,some were issued at a premium.To get to the value of the investment you have to multiply shares issued by issue price.I'll start with the sterling issues:-Ordinary:- 1@ £28,452,203, 799,664 @£5.32, 11,189,284 @£1 (par)Preference:- 12,000,000 @£1 (par) Total issued:- 23,988,949Other currencies (all ordinary) :- 1@£5886,983,.26, 1@ £1.853,088.60, 1@ £3,720,060.00, 1@ £6,623,586.82The currencies aren't given,and I've assumed they've been converted to sterling. Each ordinary share gives entitlement to one vote. Now onto the shareholdings (numbers of shares only given) :-Ordinary:- North American Partners LP 11,087,667, Mel Morris 799,664, Samuel J Rush 101,622Preference:- North American Partners LP 9,532,888, Mel Morris 2,467,112Total:-23,988,953 (including 4 in other currencies).For those so inclined,a couple of bits of deduction can throw up more details of holdings.For my part,I'm just content to give a huge thanks to all concerned for their magnificent commitment to our great club. At those issue prices that is £55.9m of new equity into the club?Now i read somewhere that a load of outstanding loans had been converted into equity leaving only the mortgage on the stadium outstanding - with your copious analyitical brain Ramblur, did you manage to pick apart how much of the equity was "new" funds and indeed whether we have any of that cash left after funding the 2014-2015 season?My accounting analysis is a bit rusty - i'm a trained actuary myself and we had to do a bit of this stuff as part of qualification but that was a while ago for me so if I have shown ignorance please bear with me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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