TheHomunculusLives

Is Eames likely to step up to u-21s next season? 

They like names starting with K in that family don't they?

1 hour ago, Ghost of Clough said:

I'm a bit undecided on him tbh. In his role, he needs to add more end product to his game. He showed it in his 2nd year with the U18s, but has struggled a bit in the U21s this season. He needs to be targetting 10 goals/assists next season if he's to make it into our first team.

This season we have Cruz Allen with 3 goals in the equivalant to less than 5 games, and Hawkins (a DM) with 1 goal and 2 assists in the equivalent to just over 8 games. Those are the contribution rates you want to see from your midfielders.
For comparison, Fapetu has just 1 goal and 1 assist in his 1049 PL2 mins.

Thanks @Ghost of Clough - makes sense in that case. From the little I've seen of him he seems to have good technical ability and dribbling skills, but if the end product isn't there then he may not make the step up. Cruz Allen looks to be one of the most talented players to come out of the academy in recent years.

For whatever reason, at this stage Sibley hasn't fulfilled the potential he showed as a teenager, and I wonder if his future is as a utility player who can do a good job at wing back and in attacking midfield, including chipping in with the occasional important goal.

23 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

From the U21 squad, we already have Evans (3rd matchday GK), Radcliffe, DRobinson and DBrown who I would consider to be on the fringes of the first team squad. Weston a little bit behind them.

We then have several players who could still play U18 football but stepped up early - 2nd year scholars Cox, KRobinson and Hawkins, and 1st year scholars JThompson, Gill and Allen.

Davidson has had a lot of trouble with injuries but has always looked promising when in the side. He missed the first half of last season and most of this one (last played in October), but would have been a regualr in the U21 squad (still a 2nd year scholar) if he stayed fit.

McAndrew is on the cusp of stepping up and is still only 16! 

 

I think all of these youngsters have a very good chance of being Championship footballers (or higher), with some doing it with us in a couple of years.

You didn't mention Fapetu in your summary, @Ghost of Clough - would you say he doesn't have the same potential as the players referenced in your post?

We'll find out next season just how ready Brown is. What's clear is that he can cope with the physical demands of men's football now he's had a sustained run of games, and his ability stands out at the (relatively low) level he's playing at even at a young age. But that doesn't mean he's ready to play 3 or 4 levels higher in the football pyramid week in week out, time will tell on that one. He certainly couldn't have done any more to advance his career in his loan spell though - well done Dajaune!

17 minutes ago, Gerry Daly said:

So pretty much off of them😆 Individually some of them will be good enough - and they had better be because some of them will still be here. But collectively they are no where near good enough for the Championship. From that list we need to replace Forsyth, Collins, Smith, Thompson, Sibley, Ward and Gayle as a minimum. We might need a new keeper too and we may not have Adams. I wouldn't bet big money on NML staying fit and playing as many games in the future either. So we need to be prepared for big changes

You don't think Ward is capable of playing in the Championship based on his recent form?

I think around two thirds of the current squad could do a decent job in the Championship - there's not the same step up for the best League One teams as there is from Championship to Premier League, as Ipswich have shown this season.

The key to doing well for me is bringing in greater quality in a few key positions - in particular, a midfield general and a striker who is going to get 20 goals. Easier said than done I know!

It's going to go right to the wire between us and Bolton I think, however we have the points in the bag so I think we're narrow favourites as long as we hold our nerve.

What's clear from his form at Gateshead is that he's capable of adjusting to men's football and excelling, now he just needs the opportunity to see if he can continue that at a higher level.

It's a talented group for sure. I wonder if any will be fast tracked into the first team squad over the next year or so? Often it's about physical development as much as footballing ability, so probably too early for some 16/17 year olds however talented they are.

1 minute ago, Reggie Greenwood said:

Darren Robinson has been , but has been held back by injury this season I think ? 

Does he make the matchday squad if everyone is fit and available though? Not sure he's getting on the bench ahead of Sibley, Thompson, Fornah or Smith, assuming our first choice midfield is Hourihane, Bird and Adams.

1 hour ago, Jram said:

I just hope that some are considered future first team material and we actually see some debuts in the coming years as the academy emerges from the ashes of admin

I do find it quite surprising that a club who have invested as much as us in our Academy in recent years doesn't have a single homegrown player under the age of 21 in the matchday squad when we're currently a League One club. Others on this forum have explained that several of our best prospects in the 18-20 age group were poached by other clubs (e.g. Kellyman, Kaide Gordon) so that's why we have a bit of a gap between the Bird/Sibley/Thompson generation and some of the promising talent in the under-18 age group. 

I guess there are always a few players, even up to under-21 level, who are never going to be viewed as potential first team material, but have a role to play 'making up the numbers' to allow the better talents to have a platform to develop. 

So for those he rate him and feel he's been hard done by, what level of player do you feel we'd be looking at if he had a proper run of games in his best position? Because if he's as good as some of you seem to think, he should be standing out as way too good for League One.

I'm really not sure what to make of Sibley at this stage of his career. He's been around the first team for 4 years now, under several managers and in a side struggling in the Championship or down in League One, yet still isn't a regular. Put together a highlights reel of his goals and you'd think he was a very good player, but there's clearly something missing as he's getting past the promising youngster stage now yet still isn't established.

I agree with other posters who have said we're much more likely to play a wide attacker centrally than throw in an untested youngster at such a critical point in the season. Weston could be on the bench - he does look the type who could nick a goal later in the game, but there's no way we'd start with him. 

Where are Waghorn and Washington - any ideas when either are back?

17 hours ago, Jram said:

Morgan Whittaker now joint top scorer in the championship 👏 

As it stands, he's arguably been the most successful of his Academy group, despite being discarded by Derby pretty early. Just goes to show some players develop at a quicker rate than others. Sibley looked a very exciting prospect at 18 but 4 years later he's a League One squad player while Whittaker is getting interest from Lazio and top scorer in the Championship.

Anything other than automatic promotion would be hugely disappointing from where we are now. This is League One. No excuses.

50 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

DRobinson and DBrown are closest to the first team and should have had more minutes this season to help them transition from youth football to men's.

JThompson is my man of the match most weeks now. He's an excellent shot stopper and calm when playing out from the back.

I really like Cox who is perfectly suited to Warne's LCB role. Versitile enough to play LB or LWB too. Eventually I'd like to see him at LCB with Cashin moved central.

Gill was a regular at LB for the U18s last season despite being an U16 player. He's now being introdcued to U21 football.

Hawkins is another who was fast tracked. 17 U18 games when still an U16 player, then 16 games at U21 when a first year scholar. Earlier in the season I stated he needed to start adding end product to his game, which he has started to do over the past coiple of months. He's a simialr type of player to Bird, is currently a DM but could be moved further forward eventually, just like Warne's done with Bird.

Allen is a special player. He was introduced to the U18s late last season and scored 2 goals in 4 apps. Since the summer he has really kicked on. He's scored 3 goals in 343 mins for Wales U17 and 7 goal contributions in 719 minuts for our U18s. He's recently stepped up to the U21s too (scoring on his only start) He's also an excellent freekick taker. Mainly an AM but can play anywhere in midfield or on the wings. He's still only 16.

A really helpful and informative response as always, @Ghost of Clough - thank you. I also like what I've seen of Cox, seems calm and very comfortable on the ball. I wondered if Hawkins' development had stalled a little, but it sounds like you feel he's starting to kick on again. Obviously all these players are still very young, but lads like Allen and Thompson do seem to have a great chance of making it if they're managed well and given the right opportunities at the right time.

Based on long-term potential, which players in our academy have the highest ceiling if they fulfil their talent? Based on a scenario whereby their attitude is good and they don't have serious injuries.

On the limited evidence I've seen, I'd say Jack Thompson and Cruz Allen.

Perhaps the biggest disappointment for me is Tyrese Fornah. I thought he would be the young, athletic, physically dominant midfielder we needed alongside the likes of Bird and Hourihane, but he's basically delivered next to nothing and we've been forced to bring in Adams instead for that position.

I'd be really interested to understand why those 'in the know' about the Academy on this board, like @Ghost of Clough, don't feel Weston has what it takes to be part of the first team squad at Derby? Every time I see him I'm impressed by his skill and finishing ability, are there other factors that are holding him back - maybe his size/physicality?

Still all to play for, no outstanding teams and closely bunched together. We do have a lot of experienced players so if we can stay in contention then get players back from injuries for the run in, I think top two is achievable.

15 hours ago, tinman said:

Great goal by McAndrew

He looks a good prospect based on the few occasions I've seen him. Do any of the members here with a better knowledge of the academy have thoughts on his current progress/potential?