Do they not understand?

[SillyBilly]

I'm booing at the monitor right now

I hope he comes, I've just made a banner.

[Ramshankered]

I hate the 'I know a man who knows a man' that goes on in this forum, but it is a solid, 100% fact that the board were very reluctant to lay down a £50k deposit for Ben Davies until after the Crawley game.

If Roberts was genuinely a solid player, I can't believe that Clough has played such a dramatic part in his demise. In terms of getting the most out of players I'd be inclined to point at players like Brayford, who he has turned in to our best (current) player this season.

Is their evidence to back the 50k claim? I'm not having a dig, I'm genuinely interested, as I was unaware of that fact. I would've thought the late bid for Sammons is a clear indicator that *some* money is available, although granted very little. Even if the 50k claim is true, that doesn't necessarily mean the money wasn't there to spend, and could be perceived as yet another failure in DCFC's current haggling approach to transfer policy (which I mentioned in my previous post).

Again you can't pin the blame for Roberts poor form solely at Clough's door. Who can say exactly why some players / managers will excel at one club but fail at another? It's usually a catalogue of errors rather than one solitary problem (e.g. Clough can't train him properly). I'm sure there are players at Doncaster that Sean O'Driscoll has failed to get the best out of too.

[james_ram]

It doesn't inspire much confidence but of course, we are buying him (possibly) in the hope that he has nowhere near fulfilled his potential so far and Clough can bring him on. A couple of things worry me about Derby's transfer strategy.

1) we keep bringing in young, unproven players who might be good one day in the future. Surely we need proven talent to help us with the desperate situation we are in right now?

2) After Leeds, Derby are the biggest club outside the premier league. Why do we have the same transfer strategy as the likes of Ssausagehorpe and Barnsley? We should be bringing in high quality players to get us promotion. I don't mind if we bring in a few lower league players every now and then, in fact I find the signings quite interesting. But it's all we ever seem to do these days.

Plus, Nigel is failing to get the best out of the players he already has, which is still an ongoing concern.

I'm sorry but how the hell are Leeds United the biggest club in this division? You are only as good as your last game and as big as where you are in the league.

[Asanovic]

Is their evidence to back the 50k claim? I'm not having a dig, I'm genuinely interested, as I was unaware of that fact. I would've thought the late bid for Sammons is a clear indicator that *some* money is available, although granted very little. Even if the 50k claim is true, that doesn't necessarily mean the money wasn't there to spend, and could be perceived as yet another failure in DCFC's current haggling approach to transfer policy (which I mentioned in my previous post).

Again you can't pin the blame for Roberts poor form solely at Clough's door. Who can say exactly why some players / managers will excel at one club but fail at another? It's usually a catalogue of errors rather than one solitary problem (e.g. Clough can't train him properly). I'm sure there are players at Doncaster that Sean O'Driscoll has failed to get the best out of too.

It's from someone who works for the club - working with the players, ie, not a member of the catering team! My links to the club in terms of personnel are next to non existent and I'm not someone who bandies rumours about, but this is from as reliable a source as I can think of, with no reason to make it up.

I agree re Sammon, maybe there is some money available. Maybe they felt under pressure to spend some of the Commons money for fears of a backlash, as there has been with the protests. I suspect the offer was derisory in comparison to Wigan.

I find the thing with Roberts strange - it's really, really rare he has a good game in my opinion. I'd say 3 or 4 games since he joind us. Bad transfers happen at the best clubs so it's not ludicrous to suggest that he's just not very good.

[Ramshankered]

I find the thing with Roberts strange - it's really, really rare he has a good game in my opinion. I'd say 3 or 4 games since he joind us. Bad transfers happen at the best clubs so it's not ludicrous to suggest that he's just not very good.

I'm not contested that he's not been poor for Derby - I think the writings on the wall as far as his performances go. I was merely debating why he has played so badly despite his previous reputation as a steady player. Maybe the pressure of playing for a big championship club is getting to him? Maybe Sean O'Driscoll had a super performance elixir that he brewed just for Robert's benefit? Maybe it's Clough's methods or Robert's inability to respond to said methods?

Maybe the Doncaster fans just needed glasses? :eek:

[nookiebear]

Maybe the Doncaster fans just needed glasses?:D:D

top comment

[Asanovic]

I'm not contested that he's not been poor for Derby - I think the writings on the wall as far as his performances go. I was merely debating why he has played so badly despite his previous reputation as a steady player. Maybe the pressure of playing for a big championship club is getting to him? Maybe Sean O'Driscoll had a super performance elixir that he brewed just for Robert's benefit? Maybe it's Clough's methods or Robert's inability to respond to said methods?

Maybe the Doncaster fans just needed glasses? :eek:

Maybe he's a playing equivalent of Paul Jewell - good with teams punching above their weight in small grounds, then when he comes to a club with big expectations it doesn't quite work for him. Can't fault his effort, and he'll get nothing but my support whilst he's on the pitch.

[ras]

Tom Glick said that by going into the loan market we could get premier league quality and instead were looking at a striker who has only been proven in league 2 with chesterfield. He's scored 63 in 9 games for shef utd, and only scored one this season out of 20+ apperances and 14 starts, if shef utd are below us in the table why are we looking at one of their sub strikers.

I hope Gadsby buy's the club purely on that he is passionate and will invest money into derby.

There in lies the problem. In fairness to get real quality strikers proven at this level you typically have to pay good money for them. Loans are all well and good but its typically youngsters from the prem or other championship strikers who cant get a kick for their own teams. Hulse cost us not far off 2 million and I would class him as a good championship striker, we cant offer big wages either these days to anyone out of contract, so I suspect it will be loans predominantly for the forseeable future.

[footymadme]

There in lies the problem. In fairness to get real quality strikers proven at this level you typically have to pay good money for them. Loans are all well and good but its typically youngsters from the prem or other championship strikers who cant get a kick for their own teams. Hulse cost us not far off 2 million and I would class him as a good championship striker, we cant offer big wages either these days to anyone out of contract, so I suspect it will be loans predominantly for the forseeable future.

loans for the rest of this season yes.

for the forseeable future....rubbish.

and as for Roberts up and down form ....how come some of you lay

everything at the feet of N.C !!!!!!

yes he is his manager ,but,once he steps over that white line if his nerve

goes ...Roberts that is ,what can N.C do ?...

Roberts according to reports is a very decent defender and in all probability

is unsure himself WHY he can't get it together 100 % ...perhaps it will all

start again for him and us this sat vs scunny............

[Ambitious]

I am not holding onto a lot of hope for our future, we've put ourself back into the brown and amigo days, the atmosphere around the club is similar and the quality of the team is also similar!

I have to agree, I couldn't see us staying in this division with the current squad.. it's not the players fault, they're simply not good enough for this division.. in some cases it's because they're young, in others it's just a question of ability.

They try hard, and work for the fans but you can have all the effort in the world, the ability just isn't there.

Hayes is questionable, he did alright at ssausagehorpe but nothing more than a squad player at this level.

Ward's another one with potential, apparently has a real premiership class about him also comes with alot of fight but whether he makes an impact remains to be seen.

Rob Edwards, I just can't see it being anything more than a disappointment.. effectively a league one player in a premiership squad, he won't offer us anything, was poor last time.. I'm guessin he'll be poor again.

I know you can't predict the future but I was much more happier looking at lower league players with form, we know there are gems down there but looking at average championship players, doesn't fill me with anything.

The ward signing I am happy with, but he is similar to Cwyka and SDavies in terms of positioning, alright he is quicker than them two, so i'm lead to believe.

Hayes and Edwards don't fill me with confidence, I had the same feeling when Stern John stepped through the door.

[HoratioSC]

I'm sorry but how the hell are Leeds United the biggest club in this division? You are only as good as your last game and as big as where you are in the league.

What bizarre logic. So Wolves are a bigger club than Man U based on the result a couple of weeks ago. Fulham are bigger than Aston Villa 'cos they're higher up the table?

No is the answer.

Derby are one of the biggest clubs in the Championship. It's a fact.

[ras]

for the forseeable future....rubbish.

Why is it rubbish. Nigel himself says we feel we can get better value with a loan (which usually equates to thats all we can afford - i.e. the wages no fee). I think your completely deluded if you honestly beleive GSE will give Nigel a 3/4 million transfer kitty pre-season to get in some quality permanent signings, it simply wont happen

[ras]

What bizarre logic. So Wolves are a bigger club than Man U based on the result a couple of weeks ago. Fulham are bigger than Aston Villa 'cos they're higher up the table?

No is the answer.

Derby are one of the biggest clubs in the Championship. It's a fact.

Well said.

Would probably go along with Leeds being one of the bigger clubs in the division as well, 40000 fan base if they are doing well, mind so they should have in a city that size.

[footymadme]

Why is it rubbish. Nigel himself says we feel we can get better value with a loan (which usually equates to thats all we can afford - i.e. the wages no fee). I think your completely deluded if you honestly beleive GSE will give Nigel a 3/4 million transfer kitty pre-season to get in some quality permanent signings, it simply wont happen

have a look how many loanee's we had 2 wks ago m8e.

was it one ...Bueno ...correct me if i'm wrong.

the better value statement re-loanee's only applys if and when n.c HAS

to dip into the loan market.

i will tell you now , and no i am not ###### deluded as you put it,

when we kick off next season in the championship n.c will put eleven

players on that pitch that are ..none of em , loaned .

unless Bueno gets his act together and either signs permanent or is

on loan for a further year.....

and n.c WILL have cash to spend , albeit from new owners.....

end of......

[blackNwhites]

What bizarre logic. So Wolves are a bigger club than Man U based on the result a couple of weeks ago. Fulham are bigger than Aston Villa 'cos they're higher up the table?

No is the answer.

Derby are one of the biggest clubs in the Championship. It's a fact.

That's an interesting logic so i'm going to put it to the test. I'm not exactly disagreeing with you mind!

1 QPR - Premier League experience, been a while, also have some of the richest owners in the world.

2 Cardiff - Always at the top end of the table.

3 Norwich - Premier League experience, a sort of recent european competition history. Bit of a dodgy spell in League 1.

4 Nott'm Forest - Premier league experience, a sort of recent european competition history (not including the Brian Clough era), dodgy spell in league 1.

5 Swansea - Always seem to be near the top end.

6 Leeds - Won the Premier League (or was it division 1 then?) in the 90's, really should be in that league, multi million pound signings past, dodgy spell in league 1.

7 Leicester - Won the league cup twice no so long ago, premier league history spend much more time in the top end of this division than Derby do, dodgy spell in League 1.

8 Burnley - A solid team in this division, recently relegated from the Premier.

9 Millwall - A solid team in this division, dodgy spell in league 1.

10 Hull - A spell in the Premier league, asserting themselves as a solid team.

11 Watford - A couple of flings into the premier league (like Derby), solid championship team...should really be doing better this season.

12 Reading - A fling in the premier league, solid championship team.

13 Ipswich - A fling in the premier league, have a good history, solid championship team.

14 Barnsley - A fling into the premier league (have they been down into league 1 as well). 14th in the championship sounds about right for them.

15 Coventry - Haven't managed to get back to the highest tier for a while now, but a sound history in that division. Solid championship team.

16 Doncaster - Surprised to see them this low, might be leveling out as a lower end team now.

17 Derby - I rate us as 'big' as Norwich, Forest, Leicester, Watford

18 Portsmouth - Good recent history, how much of that you can call 'fair' unknown, but players who want to play for good teams will remember that. FA CUP winners in the last decade.

19 Bristol City - I know naff all about this club, should be higher up though i think. Some good players at the club, not James.

20 Middlesbrough - Strachan did his best to muck up this boring outfit. Lots of history in the top league, few flings into cup finals even the european one. Under achieving and the fans (always awful) are disappearing all the time.

21 Crystal Palace - Should be a solid championship team, few flings into the premier league and a decent history.

22 Sheff Utd - Under performing as a club, crap manager at the moment. Fling into the premier league, unlucky to get relegated, suffering.

23 Ssausagehorpe - Fling into this league really.

24 Preston - Billy Davies probably over achieved here in the recent past, finding their feet again.

So, RE: this league, i wouldn't say we're 2nd 'biggest', but we should ideally be knocking around the top 10 on a regular basis. 17 teams have experienced premiership football.

[footymadme]

That's an interesting logic so i'm going to put it to the test. I'm not exactly disagreeing with you mind!

1 QPR - Premier League experience, been a while, also have some of the richest owners in the world.

2 Cardiff - Always at the top end of the table.

3 Norwich - Premier League experience, a sort of recent european competition history. Bit of a dodgy spell in League 1.

4 Nott'm Forest - Premier league experience, a sort of recent european competition history (not including the Brian Clough era), dodgy spell in league 1.

5 Swansea - Always seem to be near the top end.

6 Leeds - Won the Premier League (or was it division 1 then?) in the 90's, really should be in that league, multi million pound signings past, dodgy spell in league 1.

7 Leicester - Won the league cup twice no so long ago, premier league history spend much more time in the top end of this division than Derby do, dodgy spell in League 1.

8 Burnley - A solid team in this division, recently relegated from the Premier.

9 Millwall - A solid team in this division, dodgy spell in league 1.

10 Hull - A spell in the Premier league, asserting themselves as a solid team.

11 Watford - A couple of flings into the premier league (like Derby), solid championship team...should really be doing better this season.

12 Reading - A fling in the premier league, solid championship team.

13 Ipswich - A fling in the premier league, have a good history, solid championship team.

14 Barnsley - A fling into the premier league (have they been down into league 1 as well). 14th in the championship sounds about right for them.

15 Coventry - Haven't managed to get back to the highest tier for a while now, but a sound history in that division. Solid championship team.

16 Doncaster - Surprised to see them this low, might be leveling out as a lower end team now.

17 Derby - I rate us as 'big' as Norwich, Forest, Leicester, Watford

18 Portsmouth - Good recent history, how much of that you can call 'fair' unknown, but players who want to play for good teams will remember that. FA CUP winners in the last decade.

19 Bristol City - I know naff all about this club, should be higher up though i think. Some good players at the club, not James.

20 Middlesbrough - Strachan did his best to muck up this boring outfit. Lots of history in the top league, few flings into cup finals even the european one. Under achieving and the fans (always awful) are disappearing all the time.

21 Crystal Palace - Should be a solid championship team, few flings into the premier league and a decent history.

22 Sheff Utd - Under performing as a club, crap manager at the moment. Fling into the premier league, unlucky to get relegated, suffering.

23 Ssausagehorpe - Fling into this league really.

24 Preston - Billy Davies probably over achieved here in the recent past, finding their feet again.

So, RE: this league, i wouldn't say we're 2nd 'biggest', but we should ideally be knocking around the top 10 on a regular basis. 17 teams have experienced premiership football.

m8e.....reading that made my brain HURT..........

[blackNwhites]

m8e.....reading that made my brain HURT..........

That is an achievement!

[dcfcdavecov]

It doesn't take very much.

Just give him a pack of jammy dodgers.

[blackNwhites]

It doesn't take very much.

Just give him a pack of jammy dodgers.

I don't think he's failed to hurt my brain once, so my return favour is a personal achievement and i didn't use the jammy dodgers!

[james_ram]

What bizarre logic. So Wolves are a bigger club than Man U based on the result a couple of weeks ago. Fulham are bigger than Aston Villa 'cos they're higher up the table?

No is the answer.

Derby are one of the biggest clubs in the Championship. It's a fact.

So you're suggesting a team is as big as the titles and trophies they've won in the past? Yet Sheffield Wednesday who are struggling in League 1 have won 4 League Titles, 3 FA Cups, 1 League Cup and a Community Shield. Do they still have the players they had when they won all these trophies? No they do not.

Somehow I think your logic is 'bizarre' not mine.