Duracell Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Has he ever heard of 'form' and 'confidence'? Explain them to him. Our problems lie a little deeper than just form and confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Our problems lie a little deeper than just form and confidence. Indeed, but they've played a major part in our season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheep<3 Posted January 27, 2011 Author Share Posted January 27, 2011 okai so 30,000 was an exageration but we need to hit them where it hurts and yes that is with our feet, but on tuesday we need to make things vocal its time we made these yanks understand that they may own the club but we MAKE the club. i wanna know why yanks that no absolutly nothing about football buy a club and have no passion and do not understand how much this hurts the fans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dangerous Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Has he ever heard of 'form' and 'confidence'? Explain them to him. he knows all about form.he has been a season ticket holder for 3 years (he is 8).He knows that the form has been inconsistent at best in that time.The good run of form this season appears to be a flash in the pan.As for confidence,there is none in the managers office,the dressing room,on the pitch and it is diminishing in the stands too. But hey ho. its only football..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duracell Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Indeed, but they've played a major part in our season. Of course they have, but form and confidence has little to do with tinkering with team selection, letting competitive players leave and bizarre substitutions. That's what's worrying me. This run is completely different to our poor runs. Before, it's been easy to make excuses for Clough, and I think most of them were genuine. He did inherit a rubbish, overpaid squad. He did inherit a losing culture. He did inherit players that wouldn't play ball, if you'll pardon the pun. That, and circumstance, made his job difficult, and two solid mid-table finishes were respectable IMO. But this isn't. Clough's lost a situation where we were, for a month at least, the best team in this division. Other things have gone against us but our manager should not have let things got this much worse. It's bizarre, it's as if he's forgotten how to be a good manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boycie Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 okai so 30,000 was an exageration but we need to hit them where it hurts and yes that is with our feet, but on tuesday we need to make things vocal its time we made these yanks understand that they may own the club but we MAKE the club. i wanna know why yanks that no absolutly nothing about football buy a club and have no passion and do not understand how much this hurts the fans M O N E Y put em together whaddaya got!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duracell Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 okai so 30,000 was an exageration but we need to hit them where it hurts and yes that is with our feet, but on tuesday we need to make things vocal its time we made these yanks understand that they may own the club but we MAKE the club. i wanna know why yanks that no absolutly nothing about football buy a club and have no passion and do not understand how much this hurts the fans When you say "make our voices heard", I hope you are going to be shouting "board out" rather than booing. Booing just takes it out on the players. Doing that just gives Clough and Glick and excuse to use players as scapegoats....the players they signed, and the players we're meant to be supporting. Let's not make a bad situation any worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 he knows all about form.he has been a season ticket holder for 3 years (he is 8).He knows that the form has been inconsistent at best in that time.The good run of form this season appears to be a flash in the pan.As for confidence,there is none in the managers office,the dressing room,on the pitch and it is diminishing in the stands too. But hey ho. its only football..... Confidence is growing back, the win at Preston, the battling draw against Millwall. The performance against Forest, while not great, was a battling one. Confidence is very slowly coming back, and so is the form of some of the players. Bueno for one, looked a bit better. Ben Davies will add new life to the side, as will Ayala and Waghorn when they get here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 I don't agree with any part of that letter, it's THAT sort of ignorance I just cannot stand at the minute, why do people think a new manager will come in and change it all? I think if a new manager came in we would hit league one inside the next 16 months, without a doubt. I think with Clough, we are still set for an improvement on this season and come the summer months, I would hope for a slow and steady investment. I'm not always been the biggest fan of the board, well I say board I actually mean investors which have turned from being investors to spectators overnight which is disappointing, I don't want us to spend millions of pounds on players and crank the wage budget back to 15-16million it was because again I don't think people realise when other teams do this, they put the debt onto the club and nothing actually comes out the owners pocket, that is why portsmouth got themself into a mess..etc and that's how Gadsby went about his business (I believe, although don't quote me on that) I know it's not like this at ALL clubs but how quickly can we find a chairman like the 70s throwback at Forest who has lost around 30million of his personal fortune and he still keeps investing, it's ridiculous. I am very content at the minute, I really can't see why everyone is hammering at the panic buttons, I've not always been the most optimistic fan and I'm definitely not blind faith but some people on here are ridiculous. I would say for the moment, we should back Clough and back the Board, they're running things correctly and for the minute I praise that, I'm glad we aren't chucking stupid money around and if we can get in the striker, plus the loan pair then I believe we will have significantly improved the side in this transfer window, even though we will lose Commons. Put the panic buttons away, stop jumping to conclusions and just focus on supporting the side, If we actually could just do that small little job then everything might not seem so bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 M O N E Y put em together whaddaya got!? Bibbaty Bobbity Boo! :redface: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Of course they have, but form and confidence has little to do with tinkering with team selection, letting competitive players leave and bizarre substitutions. That's what's worrying me. This run is completely different to our poor runs. Before, it's been easy to make excuses for Clough, and I think most of them were genuine. He did inherit a rubbish, overpaid squad. He did inherit a losing culture. He did inherit players that wouldn't play ball, if you'll pardon the pun. That, and circumstance, made his job difficult, and two solid mid-table finishes were respectable IMO. But this isn't. Clough's lost a situation where we were, for a month at least, the best team in this division. Other things have gone against us but our manager should not have let things got this much worse. It's bizarre, it's as if he's forgotten how to be a good manager. For me, Fielding changed the defences mentality and they were totally confident with him in goal. As was I. Bywater came back in poor form and now they're all edgy again. Leacock lost form badly, Clough dropped him but had no-one to cover, and so Green and Brayford had to fill out different positions to normal. having said that, it worked against teams like Middlesborough and Swansea well enough. But at some point it would be found out. Certain things have not quite worked, certain players haven't performed etc. The loss to Crawley was Cloughs fault, bad team selection, but I suppose he genuinely thought we could beat them with that set up. I don't blame him that much to be honest, but I understand why you are questioning him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCFC1 Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 okai so 30,000 was an exageration but we need to hit them where it hurts and yes that is with our feet, but on tuesday we need to make things vocal its time we made these yanks understand that they may own the club but we MAKE the club. i wanna know why yanks that no absolutly nothing about football buy a club and have no passion and do not understand how much this hurts the fans I totally agree with you on the vocal side sheep<3 . . . its time to voice the fustration, the board has had long enough and the investment is turning into a joke we pay our money week in week out and get below average not good enough.............:eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ESR Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Great post, good to read something constructive and true, nothing thats brainwashing and unrealistic. All I have thought today is that this time last year, Rob Hulse turned down a £4 million move to Middlesbrough, at the same time Commons would have been worth £3 million-ish? So if we had sold both a year ago we could have gained a very hefty £7/8 million? Yet fast forward a year and we've flogged both off for a combined total of £1 million. Great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Well, that's not quite the truth, but acept that it's your version of it. My reality is that we've had nothing to confirm that NC isn't a decent manager, given the circumstances, other than people who have never done the job before saying that if he did it their way we'd be challenging for promotion. Reason I say that is because we're there in midtable, despite raising more than we spent and slashing £7million of the wage budget. Take that into context, Bris - it wasn't as if we were particularly blessed with talent in the first place, so it's not like we were a man utd, man city or even QPR for that matter, cutting down a good but large squad. It was a ***** squad with a couple of gems. Those gems have now gone, and all that's left is the legacy under-achievers like Pearson and Leacock, a half-crocked Barker, then a load of kids still finding their feet at this level. They were superb for a few months running up to Christmas, so nobody here can say NC is incapable of getting a team playing great football. So yes, NC signed lower division players with the hope that they might be brought on by the older heads, but never in a month of Sundays did he ever imagine that that's all he'd not have the money to bring a few more in, nor have to sell the ones he's already got. Do I think he's fcked up a few times? Yes I do. Then again I've never seen a manager yet who didn't. I am convinced that there's isn't a manager on the planet that could do a massively better job in the circumstances NC has been in since day one - which incidentally has got worse financially despite the cuts he's managed, rather than better as everyone expected based on GSE's comments about getting debts / costs down before putting in money. If you think a 'decent' manager would have done better than Clough then that's your opinion - but your opinion isn't any more relevant than mine. First of all I enjoyed reading that, a very well balanced post.. I'm not here to start off petty name calling arguements, I'm here solely to debate with other Rams fans such as yourself.. You definately have a different view than I do, but that in no way is a bad thing.. I fully agree that NC inherited a poor squad on huge wages.. And that he had to get rid of them, both financially and ability wise they were no good for DCFC.. I'm shocked how a manager of PJs (well his achievements with Wigan) calibre could have got it so wrong. It was unrealistic for NC to build a team around the likes of them.. (Teale, McEverly, Alby, Claude) etc.. However, whilst doing a decent job of getting the wages down, it is no different to what any other manager would have done.. And you can't argue that some of his signings, whether unfortunate with injury or not, were simply a waste of money.. In our case, valuable/precious money.. The likes of Anderson, Porter, Martin, Croft etc. Could have been spent alot better.. I understand his signings of Deeney, Buxton, Pringle, Doyle as squad fillers.. Are they better than what we have in the reserves (youth players)? If so, fair enough, if not, again they're hardly worthwhile signings when we could have used homegrown players.. Watford certainly haven't done too badly using their youth players.. However I do accept the risks involved. But to your point, the point that got me, is where you mention you are convinced that there isn't another manager who could have done a massively better job.. I beg to differ. Any manager would have got rid of those players.. And I'm I correct in saying NC has brought in alot of players? Possibly as an exchange for those outgoings? He maywell have recoupled money, even made a net profit, but the players previously wasn't worth keeping IMO. I've given examples in the past of managers that have bought players from Ireland, Scotland, PL reserves, Lower Leagues, Abroad etc.. for cheap, very cheap, in some cases cheaper than what we've spent on the likes of Moxey, Bailey, Brayford (I rate them all as very good signings) and managed to forge a squad of playoff ability.. We all remember how GB struck gold with Idiakez, Rasiak and Bisgaard.. And it's for this reason I wish NC would look further than just The UK.. Whilst NC has made huge mistakes, team selection etc.. He hasn't done terribly bad, nor has he done very good.. For example, Gordon Strachan did a terrible job given the circumstances, whilst Malkay McKay has done a fantastic job.. NC for me is somewhere in the middle.. In school terms, a satisfactory C+ Pete, this maybe irrelevant given our position, but just out of curiosity, should NC be given decent money, do you think he will spend it wisely and greatly improve us? Or do you think there are better managers out there who could possibly use the money the greater effect.. ie. Chris Hughton? I ask this as NC so far has no experience of big-money ($1.5mill+) signings, and I'm slightly worried at what he classifies as 'Value for money' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rigamortis Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 i've been reading that fella posts for too long - wasting time and energy on doing so. I think it's a crap letter, i think he's spent too long trying to make himself sound clever. As soon as I read the part about it being the most competitive league in Europe a paragraph after reading how the poor record against teams at this level is unjustifiable... what a load of *****...does not sum up what 30,000 derby "fans" are thinking. I'd suspect a few of us are thinking ffs - lets just have some good news. I'd suspect a few of us are thinking holy **** - i hope i don't have to read another mindlessly depressing post from that fella in china, or from that fella in russia.. I'm also thinking it's no wonder Dangerous junior is depressed about the state of things at DCFC - if I had to listen to my old man spouting ***** all day - I'd burn my derby top just to get him to shut up... DCFC at the moment needs a boost - it doesn't need it's own fans digging a deeper hole.... either offer to put your own hard earned in- if there's30,000 of you thinking the same way - if you each put in a grand and a half I'm sure the "yanks" who are destroying the club would sell up like a shot and do a runner after bleeding the club dry...30,000 at a grand and a half is 45m quid.. you'd even have enough left over to shpunt 15 million or so on superstars...and have enough to pay off clough the clown and his amatuer backroom boys.. feck me Yojimbo knows enough about football, transfers, training and tactics to run it from his internet in Japan or wherever the hell he is... what's that?? You won't put your own money in?? 1500 quid is too much? either organise a MYFC type situation or for god sakes give it a rest...at least for a couple of days... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayram Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Improvement each season, genuine bid to get Commons and other targets despite some peoples reservations, and a decent squad who have shown what they can do. I'm pretty happy, yes. Time for your medication Alex.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheep<3 Posted January 27, 2011 Author Share Posted January 27, 2011 we all know whats going to happen, cloughie/glick will come out with some shizz about why we didn't spend in the transfer window and you know that cloughie will come onto radio derby and say AND I QUOTE "well err the err emergency transfer err window will open soon and err we will be looking to err bring err someone in err soon" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayram Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 I don't agree with any part of that letter, it's THAT sort of ignorance I just cannot stand at the minute, why do people think a new manager will come in and change it all? I think if a new manager came in we would hit league one inside the next 16 months, without a doubt. I think with Clough, we are still set for an improvement on this season and come the summer months, I would hope for a slow and steady investment. I'm not always been the biggest fan of the board, well I say board I actually mean investors which have turned from being investors to spectators overnight which is disappointing, I don't want us to spend millions of pounds on players and crank the wage budget back to 15-16million it was because again I don't think people realise when other teams do this, they put the debt onto the club and nothing actually comes out the owners pocket, that is why portsmouth got themself into a mess..etc and that's how Gadsby went about his business (I believe, although don't quote me on that) I know it's not like this at ALL clubs but how quickly can we find a chairman like the 70s throwback at Forest who has lost around 30million of his personal fortune and he still keeps investing, it's ridiculous. I am very content at the minute, I really can't see why everyone is hammering at the panic buttons, I've not always been the most optimistic fan and I'm definitely not blind faith but some people on here are ridiculous. I would say for the moment, we should back Clough and back the Board, they're running things correctly and for the minute I praise that, I'm glad we aren't chucking stupid money around and if we can get in the striker, plus the loan pair then I believe we will have significantly improved the side in this transfer window, even though we will lose Commons.Put the panic buttons away, stop jumping to conclusions and just focus on supporting the side, If we actually could just do that small little job then everything might not seem so bad. Good grief..I genuinely wonder if I'm following the same football club as some people on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rigamortis Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 we all know whats going to happen, cloughie/glick will come out with some shizz about why we didn't spend in the transfer window and you know that cloughie will come onto radio derby and say AND I QUOTE "well err the err emergency transfer err window will open soon and err we will be looking to err bring err someone in err soon" err change the err record err. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donny Ram Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 If the last survey on this forum showed only 22% in support of removing Clough, then I'm afraid this thread is attracting the vociferous minority rather than the silent majority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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