Hordh

16 hours ago, Derbylad01 said:

I think this is the way to go. 

1 hour ago, Anag Ram said:

If that’s a genuine quote he should be ashamed of himself 

Why, he's only stating the truth again. CK was overselling himself, courting people through twitter. Worse than Morris as an owner and nothing more than timewaster for the administrators. 

18 hours ago, Oldben said:

Why should bidders have to wait for administrators to deal with creditors and hmrc.

It's insulting to bidders, wealthy bidders have teams of people who are more than capable of settling those issues.

Kirchner said he believes there's only one other bidder for Derby and that their bid was no where near the 60 million he had offered, I believe him.

 

Administrators work for the creditors interests as far as they can and why this belief in Kirchner? Do you know him? If the admin won't name him as preferred bidder before Xmas then they are aware of problems in the bid. Perhaps HMRC won't negotiate over the money owed, or perhaps there's a problem with the Dell loan for PP? Whatever, it's not a rosy outlook and I can see a fire sale to the level of the Wigan one in January. 

13 minutes ago, Hordh said:

But it's not Morris's fault. He's innocent in the whole charade.......

In fact I would prefer Morris over the chancer Kirchner and that's saying something.

5 hours ago, RoyMac5 said:

Black & White Together Retweeted:

@cskirchner: "It’s not necessarily that… very very complex situation the admins were dealt. I do have issues with the delays and inability to keep deadlines. The only one to really blame for this situation is Mel Morris. Proper duck job."

 

But it's not Morris's fault. He's innocent in the whole charade.......

6 hours ago, PistoldPete said:

I think we need a very good reason why this has slipped again so soon after announcing to the fans and to the players that it was expected this week.

amd if anyone is to blame for the delay the. The fingers should be firmly pointed at them. Wycombe, Boro … you are first in the firing line you parasitical lowlifes.

Either the administrators don't know what they are doing, or mores the likely, the prospective buyers like Kirchner are just trying it on with the hope of getting the club on the cheap and making a quick buck. 

1 hour ago, Eatonram said:

Fair point Bobbster, in that no one can say for sure that QPR cost us promotion by their overspend......just as no one can say for sure that DCFC cost Boro promotion or Wycombe relegation by our much smaller overspend.....The difference is that DCFC are being sued and QPR were not, despite us argueably having a stronger case. What Galls is that we have been publicly lambasted far more than any other Club, denied Covid loans and now being sued for far more than the fine you actually paid and yet not a single Club, even previous transgressors like QPR have offered the slightest support. In fact what did your striker do at Pride Park a few weeks ago?

Blame Morris for the way other clubs are behaving. He rode roughshod over the rules. 

21 minutes ago, SBW said:

I think we all want all owed taxes paid, we can agree on that.  

 

But the £27m itself is a drop in the ocean too HMRC.  If they accept say, half, £13.5m.  They then let every other football debtor that 50p in the £1 is okay.  Going forward the implications of that are gigantic, much more than the relevance of Derby County to them.  

 

Would you fight for power (in terms of being a preferential creditor in this sense) to then essentially just 'give' that right away?  Precedence in law is everything, sentences is court of made off the back of precedence, people being found guilty and not guilty of offences is done so on the back of precedence.  That's why is makes zero sense that HMRC are going to do anything to benefit DCFC.  They don't care about us.

HMRC are likely to be a hard nut to crack and as I have said before, they are very likely to use Derby as a test case going forward. A shot across the bows of other clubs. 

If there is a fire sale, plus the chances of further deductions if the club do not exit with a CVA, it's going to be more like a fight against relegation. 

1 hour ago, atherstoneram said:

But you would still be paying VAT on your holiday and other associated items + airport taxes etc. As for other teams having less pulling power that won't concern HMRC. In context if it happens to be the demise of DCFC HMRC won't bat an eyelid.

I think this is the first footballing admin since the new rules came in and I'd be surprised if the HMRC didn't use this opportunity to set a precedent as a warning to other clubs not paying their taxes. You are correct that they won't bat an eyelid. 

He's the greatest thing since sliced bread so of course he should! 

1 minute ago, jono said:

I know about MSD’s charge on certain fixed assets via a debenture on the stadium, but I think, from what I heard the admins say on the radio, that HMRC are high up the list or have some priority since a rule change.. I.e ahead of trade creditors. My impression ( could be wrong ! ) was that the offer any new owner made to HMRC was the critical point when it came to likely liquidation - or not .. ….. dependant on the size / attractiveness of that offer to them … This would be tied logically and relatively  to whatever HMRC think they might get if we collapse completely. 

So if any prospective buyer puts in a derisory offer then the HMRC can and probably would treat that as not being serious and push for liquidation. 

26 minutes ago, GenBr said:

Just been reading stuart webbs book and thought this paragraph sounded familiar!

We just seem to lurch from crisis to crisis in our history, but so far we've always pulled through. Hopefully its the same in this instance as well

Also didn't Webb get brought in after the Mackay fringe payments and the club having a fine plus losing out a place in the Fairs Cup? 

16 minutes ago, Curtains said:

Why hopeful !     Sounds a bit like they are unsure .

 

https://theathletic.com/news/Derby-mp-calls-for-hmrc-to-be-lenient-as-she-warns-of-disastrous-outcome/g3qNhnPf3yg6/    sounds like a buy out has gone pair shape according to Margaret Beckett. 

4 minutes ago, GenBr said:

Just been reading stuart webbs book and thought this paragraph sounded familiar!

We just seem to lurch from crisis to crisis in our history, but so far we've always pulled through. Hopefully its the same in this instance as well

All Dirty Leeds fault!

39 minutes ago, Kathcairns said:

Arn't theHMRC partly to blame for letting the club get into that much debt in the first place.

The one to blame is Morris. His hand was firmly on the tiller and because of his recklessness and incompetence throughout his reign has brought the club to where it is. The HMRC were cutting the club some considerable slack during the lock downs which is why they are now owed the £30m so let's stop blaming them. Personally I can see some sort 9f agreement being made and I hope that much of the debt is repaid. 

On 21/11/2021 at 19:46, PistoldPete said:

In the summer Morris either had to sell the club or sell some players. He wasn't able to do either. The only offer we got I think was pathetic offer from Forest for Buchanan. So we just ran out of road.

That's what happens when you are a distressed seller. Has happened to many clubs before. 

The Golden Share? 

On 17/11/2021 at 02:22, Bris Vegas said:

We were down with -12 points. -21 points just cements it further.

it’s been a horrible past 18 months and the chickens have really come home to roost. It’s time to wipe the slate clean, and rebuild the club starting now with plans for next season.

Many clubs have used League one as a springboard to better things. I mean look at how Coventry have already overtaken a host of stale Championship clubs like Bristol City, Forest and Ourselves.

 

And look at Ipswich, Sunderland and to a lesser extent Bolton and see just how hard it can be down there for the bigger clubs. Derby will join them as one of the big scalps. 

15 hours ago, hintonsboots said:

Are there any other teams on the EFL points deduction radar ? Perhaps @The Baron could do some forensics on Stoke, Brizzle and Boro ?

 

Cardiff and Hull are rumoured to be in trouble as well. Think Bristol would be OK though. 

2 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Well we lost about £136m between 14/15 and 20/21 whereas Reading lost £57.8m between 17/18 and 20/21.

We failed three periods by a total of £21.5m. They failed 1 period by £18.8m.

I think I said yesterday that we should have had 21 points deducted. They should have had 12 points. Both have basically had that punishment halved.

This ?

15 minutes ago, PistoldPete said:

EFL's business plan? What is their business? Putting a wrecking ball to what is left of the club? 

Making sure the club doesn't go back to the old ways. Brum had the same when they got the 9 points. 

11 hours ago, 24Charlie said:

Leeds where already down when then took the ten points. They went into admin as soon as relegation was assured to get the deduction applied that season so they would not get it applied in league 1. The EFL saw through it and handed them a 15 point deduction which Leeds appealed but where unsuccessful. As a result they didn’t bounce straight back.

They got the 15 points because they didn't exit admin with a CVA courtesy of Ken Bates. 

26 minutes ago, i-Ram said:

The 2018/19 accounts have never been submitted Pete. That is part of the reason we have been under embargo for 2 years. Mel needed to pay c£95m for the stadium or possibly more to have got round it. Or he could have sold Johnson/Butterfield/Anya/Blackman and Nugent at a bargain £15m job lot ?

Good to get this out of the way, although the club are still not out of the woods yet what with the business plans and having to obtain a CVA that will satisfy the EFL. The person to blame for this is Morris who attempted to cheat the system. The irony that PP looks like being part of a deal at way less than the 'valuation' can't be lost either and goes to show the club dodged further punishment over that deal!