Leeds Ram Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Anything by Hitchens or Dawkins is a must-read. I do alot of reading these days because I don't watch any of the trash on TV. It worries me that people actually derive enjoyment from some of the reality garbage on the box these days. i completely concur, i also watch hitchens debates on youtube as well. I really wanted to see him live as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SillyBilly Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 i completely concur, i also watch hitchens debates on youtube as well. I really wanted to see him live as well. He is an absolute legend, he is a very intelligent drunk I may add too! You have to feel sorry for his "opponents" at times, owned is the word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 exactly, they all get hitch slapped lol, i know he is an intelligent drunk, he and Stephen fry on educational squared debate completely destroyed Anne widecomb and a bishop of the church in africa, had a change of i believe 600 out of 2000 people within 45 minutes. The debate between his brother and chris is sooo good as well, i felt sorry for his brother after because he was destroyed by chris. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SillyBilly Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 exactly, they all get hitch slapped lol, i know he is an intelligent drunk, he and Stephen fry on educational squared debate completely destroyed Anne widecomb and a bishop of the church in africa, had a change of i believe 600 out of 2000 people within 45 minutes. The debate between his brother and chris is sooo good as well, i felt sorry for his brother after because he was destroyed by chris. Yeah I watched that too, Anne Widdecombe "oh I just knew somebody would mention condoms..." or "why does everybody have to bring up paedophila". Onaiyekan typically clueless whilst also loose on the issue of gays as all clergymen tend to be. The only person who I think has been a worthy adversary to Hitchens is Tony Blair. I still thought he was barking up the wrong tree. The trend of putting an ill-educated American Pastor who can't function without consulting a work of fiction against one of the world's greatest thinkers and writers is always an interesting mix I find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 tbh i am a massive fan of blair but chris still had the upper hand even with cancer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SillyBilly Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 Blair and his faith school agenda wasn't for me. Totally divisive. Not to mention what happens to masquerade itself as science in the classroom . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted May 21, 2011 Share Posted May 21, 2011 i despise faith schools but i like him generally, i think he is honest in what he believes and does what he thinks what is right which is more than most politicians. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANGERMAN1 Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 That sort of stuff is ok. It's where they sometimes expand into fantasy where I lose interest. I've read a couple of Richard Dawkins books, they mess with your head a bit but are very interesting. Awesome!! I rarely read, Just have the two Brian Cox hardback's...........But I am currently reading 'The Greatest Show on Earth' by Richard Dawkins. The guy is an absolute legend, truly inspiring. It's crazy that Darwins 'On The Origin of Species' was written 152 years ago now tho!! And Darwin still has to carry the torch for him. If not more passionate/agressively. Adored watching 'The God Delusion' on TV but haven't read the book..... Dawkins is a bloody LEGEND!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duracell Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 I don't find anyone as militant as Dawkins a good read, whatever their cause. I place him along with the cuckoo fundamentalist Baptists from the Deep South. Granted, he's incredibly intelligent, but he's also pretty stupid. But anyway, on to Reading. I'm going in August, can't wait, the line up looks great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANGERMAN1 Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 Where's that 'un-like' button?!?!? Yeah the line-up isn't too bad. Been to quite a few festivals in my time (Mostly Download, Which is pish now!!) but still haven't seen Rise Against, Would love too. Quality band. Hot Water Music and Comeback Kid on the Lock-Up stage too.....Sweeeeeeeeeeet!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 Awesome!! I rarely read, Just have the two Brian Cox hardback's...........But I am currently reading 'The Greatest Show on Earth' by Richard Dawkins. The guy is an absolute legend, truly inspiring. It's crazy that Darwins 'On The Origin of Species' was written 152 years ago now tho!! And Darwin still has to carry the torch for him. If not more passionate/agressively. Adored watching 'The God Delusion' on TV but haven't read the book..... Dawkins is a bloody LEGEND!!! dawkins and hitchens are both brilliant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uttoxram75 Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 I don't find anyone as militant as Dawkins a good read, whatever their cause. I place him along with the cuckoo fundamentalist Baptists from the Deep South. Granted, he's incredibly intelligent, but he's also pretty stupid. But anyway, on to Reading. I'm going in August, can't wait, the line up looks great. I take it you don't rate Dawkins because of his message. Its totally understandable to be like that, it actually makes the reason you are on earth different to the one you have been told to believe in since birth. Its a sobering thought mate but one that needs to be considered for its merits and not discarded because it goes against what you've always been told. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duracell Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 I take it you don't rate Dawkins because of his message. Its totally understandable to be like that, it actually makes the reason you are on earth different to the one you have been told to believe in since birth. Its a sobering thought mate but one that needs to be considered for its merits and not discarded because it goes against what you've always been told. I siagree, there are plenty of Atheist thinkers who do that far far more effectively than Dawkins - Johann Hari for example. Anyone as fundamentalist and fanatic as Dawkins can't be taken seriously, whatever your viewpoint. He tries to be as offensive as possible to sell as many books as possible, in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 dawkins is pretty effective actually, he is extreme but serious for me, i personally prefer hitchens but he is at the top really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duracell Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 dawkins is pretty effective actually, he is extreme but serious for me, i personally prefer hitchens but he is at the top really. Osama Bin Laden was also extreme and serious! Okay, Dawkins doesn't blow people up, but crikey, if he was an Islamic cleric making his point in the same way, the right-wing press would have him for breakfast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uttoxram75 Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 good point. You can't beat the Anarchist view tho' NO GODS, NO MASTERS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 well the very fact that he believes in reason and not total idiocy is an important item, he believes in evolution, freedom and not a warped morality which tells you it matters exactly what you eat, how you sleep with someone and that to reach "paradise" you need to blow yourselves up and that as sexually repressed young men you will be with 72 virgins. Dawkins does go very far however to me to understand and tackle the full extent of the problem one does have to go far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duracell Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 well the very fact that he believes in reason and not total idiocy is an important item, he believes in evolution, freedom and not a warped morality which tells you it matters exactly what you eat, how you sleep with someone and that to reach "paradise" you need to blow yourselves up and that as sexually repressed young men you will be with 72 virgins. Dawkins does go very far however to me to understand and tackle the full extent of the problem one does have to go far. Could easily pick apart the bad parts of atheist society too, and again, if an Islamic cleric did that as insensitively as Dawkins he'd be in trouble. I mean, I'm a Christian myself, yet I don't see the need to pick apart religions and dismiss the views of others like he does, including Athiesm. Can't stand people who preach hate like he does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 to me he doesn't preach hate, also there has never been a totally atheist society in the world thus one can't judge, if people based their logic upon, Milne, Darwin, Shakespeare etc i doubt we would have problems, actually plenty of Islamic clerics and priests do as do preachers and they get no trouble. I like Dawkins find it difficult to understand how people can believe in something so fervently without any proof at all, also how quite frankly evil people can be, and when someone believes in god they can do anything, a big point of Dawkins is you don't need a book to gain a moral code, how is that soooo bad? he picks it apart partly because he is asked too e.g. going to debates and when he writes books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duracell Posted May 28, 2011 Share Posted May 28, 2011 to me he doesn't preach hate, also there has never been a totally atheist society in the world thus one can't judge, if people based their logic upon, Milne, Darwin, Shakespeare etc i doubt we would have problems, actually plenty of Islamic clerics and priests do as do preachers and they get no trouble. I like Dawkins find it difficult to understand how people can believe in something so fervently without any proof at all, also how quite frankly evil people can be, and when someone believes in god they can do anything, a big point of Dawkins is you don't need a book to gain a moral code, how is that soooo bad? he picks it apart partly because he is asked too e.g. going to debates and when he writes books. He does preach hate. To him, I'm stupid. He's explicitly said that believers are stupid. And of course we'd still have problems! Humans are naturally evil. Before organised religion, tribes have always thrown sticks and stones at each other, homo erectus and neanderthals were always fighting it. Faith asks things science can't always prove itself, so I think the whole "why believe in something you can't prove" thing is a particularly weak one. Science tell us how, religion asks why. And isn't that the whole point in "faith" anyway? Something you can prove is "knowledge". That's viewing the world in binary, as either 1 or 0. I think putting all your faith in any argument is foolish and stupid, you have to look at the world with an open mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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