GSE should be ashamed.

[Hartley Hare]

how is that stating anything as fact?

It is my opinion that between them, GSE and Nigel have failed in the transfer market, and that neither can be solely to blame. No "fact" stated there, only my suspicion.

I never said you stated anything as fact. I just highlighted a portion of the thread to another poster who was having difficulty finding it.

[WilkoRam]

I never said you stated anything as fact. I just highlighted a portion of the thread to another poster who was having difficulty finding it.

I know, cheers I had been out last night so I wasn't the most focused. Still can't believe that anyone can agree with the first post though!

[Hartley Hare]

I know, cheers I had been out last night so I wasn't the most focused. Still can't believe that anyone can agree with the first post though!

Well, I certainly don't.

[NorfolkRam]

No.

All these threads along a similar line seem to assume that Clough is some kind of passive cowardly character in the face of an oppressive GSE regime. I think we've all heard enough from him to assume that that isn't the case. Still going on about the "need" for a "proven assistant" - when has anyone heard Clough say that he wants to bring someone in but has been refused permission? Is there any suggestion that he's not happy with the level of support given to him by the club this week?

If he was the victim that some people seem to think he is (the quoted article even describes the relationship between GSE and Clough as "abusive" - really?!?!?!?) then I'm sure he'd have gone himself by now. GSE need Clough more than Clough needs GSE and if he needed us to support him in facing down GSE then he'd have asked us. What in fact he has asked us to do is to get behind the team and cheer them on, confidence is low and chants of discontent, even if aimed at the board, don't create an atmosphere conducive to confidence and assurance amongst the home team. Saturday is a home match - it should be to our advantage. If you want to make a noise on Saturday, get behind the players, we can be the 12th man but we've got to put the effort in that we demand of the 11 on the pitch. If people want to support Nigel Clough then the best way to do it is to do what he's asked. We've all heard this week how much he dislikes it when people fail to do the things he's repeatedly asked them to do, so why add to his frustration?

That is probably the most honest and true thing I have read on a forum and knocks spots off half the articles I've read about Derby. Especially the last bit.

Make it a mandatory read at every turnstile at PP follow by a swift punch in the snout for everyone that argues.

Take a bow son.

[Hartley Hare]

Aw, shucks Norfolk.

If you've ever asked yourself, "Can hare's blush?", well I can confirm in the affirmative. :redface:

[Ramalama]

"I have been an undoubted Clough supporter since day one, I wanted to believe in the romance of the situation but in recent days I began to waver."

That sums it up, you WANTED TO BELIEVE, a lot of us did, but events since have shown us what the reality is, he's not really up to the job.

Some of us have (sadly) let go of the dream, while some of you still cling to it.

[The Ram]

"I have been an undoubted Clough supporter since day one, I wanted to believe in the romance of the situation but in recent days I began to waver."

That sums it up, you WANTED TO BELIEVE, a lot of us did, but events since have shown us what the reality is, he's not really up to the job.

Some of us have (sadly) let go of the dream, while some of you still cling to it.

'tis about where I'm at, lets hope for one last push starting tomorrow!!

[RotherhamRam]

Certainly the board should have given him better leverage financially, much of the rest of it is utter tosh.

The events of the last week are entirely of Nigel's making, no-one else. Every manager in the country gives interviews immediately after games. He could have come out, said something about a good away point, Steve Davies' goalscoring return and that would have been that.

His backroom staff are his to choose, he could bring in someone more experienced if he wanted to but he has stuck by Crosby and co. If this proves his downfall he will have no-one else to blame but himself.

As for transfer dealings, i have no idea whether it's GSE or Nigel, or a combination of both, that have failed. I suspect the latter.

You can't blame GSE for the negative tactics, poor use of subs, poor quality of the basics, playing people out of position, lack of spirit etc that we have seen for the last couple of months on the pitch.

I'm no great fan of GSE and I really want Nigel to succeed but in this mess everyone should take their fair share of responsibility - the board, the manager and the players.

Not sure you quite grab the concept here. If we can't bring the players in to provide stability the improvement and you have ploayers underperforming on the pitch you have to use your limited resources. You have a centre halve in Leacock who has been injured for a month and banned twice then anderson and buxton injured and Addison out. Who do you turn to. When Brayford went in there until Forest game he played better than Leacock. And lets not forget Brayford started out as a centre half.

This is GSE and purely GSE. I am now starting to think that it was GSE who let Commons go because Commons knew no investment was coming and why sign for a club who has a board who don't think it is necessary to be promoted as long as they give us free masks and t-shirts.

[WilkoRam]

Not sure you quite grab the concept here. If we can't bring the players in to provide stability the improvement and you have ploayers underperforming on the pitch you have to use your limited resources. You have a centre halve in Leacock who has been injured for a month and banned twice then anderson and buxton injured and Addison out. Who do you turn to. When Brayford went in there until Forest game he played better than Leacock. And lets not forget Brayford started out as a centre half.

This is GSE and purely GSE. I am now starting to think that it was GSE who let Commons go because Commons knew no investment was coming and why sign for a club who has a board who don't think it is necessary to be promoted as long as they give us free masks and t-shirts.

Was Addison playing in midfield, Leacock on the bench, Green and right back and Bailey as an attacking midfielder (as played against Watford) GSE and purely GSE? I'm no big fan of theirs but this whole "let's blame GSE for the lot then I don't have to look too deeply at whether Nigel is up to the task of fulfilling our dreams" is getting a bit OTT. Yes they've not invested a lot in new players but to blame them for no experienced No2, for not vetting his interviews and not employing a bigger scouting network? My god, there's rose tinted then there's that.

If you have an issue with Nigel's number two then it's Nigel who appointed his own team, same with scouting. It's also Nigel who makes the comments to the press.

The lack of money clearly goes towards GSE, nobody else but GSE but not everything towards them.

[PeteDerby]

Lack of money enough talented players is what sits at the root of all the bitching about the management team at Derby.

You and others blame Clough again and again, pay lip service to the lack of players, then blather on again about minor detail - like he should have played one inexperienced / injured / over-the-hill / not good enough player, in place of another in the same mould, or tried another tactic etc.

Until we've all seen what he can do with a decent squad, the majority of fans will have no truck with those who snipe about the minor detail - especially coming from fellow fans with no more professional football or football management experience than the next fan.

[Bris Vegas]

Do you say that as a fact, or as your opinion?

[Alph]

I posted a post found on Derby Mad in the GSE Protest thread.

Not sure how true any of it is. There are no more details really other than what i've posted. You can see the original post here

http://boards.footymad.net/forum.php?tno=181&fid=16&sty=2&act=1&mid=2118432967

I just copied it and put it on here for some guys to debate.

But anyone who's got a problem with Nigel and Co just have a quick look?

Might not change your mind. But it might make you sympathise with what our coaching staff are having to work under.

Just have a gander please.

[The Ram]

I LOVE the name Clough, just like many on here and other message boards who are desperate for him to do well. Just like in the past, back in 1973 (when I was aged 17/18) when Brian Clough left, many Derby County supporters are now clutching at straws in the hope that young Nigel will succeed - just as they thought that his Dad, Brian would return.

Unfortunately, it is not happening, and we have to move on and forget the name, the whole connection.

I am sorry but if we lose tomorrow against The stinking Fox Piss and continue on this downward spiral, I think we have to accept that Mr. Clough Jr. may not be up for renewal.

GSE will perhaps not think so, but lets be honest, what do they know about soccer???

[CumbrianRam]

£8.5 mill wage is bill is a typical second tier wage bill I'd say. I'd be surprised if Norwich, Watford, C Palace, Coventry etc are higher.

Blackpool got promoted on £6 mill, which was the second lowest with Scunny probably having the lowest. They also sold Shuan Barker to fund the Charlie Adam transfer.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/may/23/blackpool-premier-league-valeri-belokon

[Alph]

The wage bill doesn't seem to be a problem.

Metgod said (or so it's been claimed) that it's about the actual transfer/loan fees. We don't have anything to work with. Savage retiring will free up some wages.

Is there anywhere you can get details or educated guesses on what the Championship wage bills are for each club?

Anyone know Forests or Leicesters?

Just out of interest like.

[Bris Vegas]

The wage bill doesn't seem to be a problem.

Metgod said (or so it's been claimed) that it's about the actual transfer/loan fees. We don't have anything to work with. Savage retiring will free up some wages.

Is there anywhere you can get details or educated guesses on what the Championship wage bills are for each club?

Anyone know Forests or Leicesters?

Just out of interest like.

Heard Forest have a wage bill of around $15mill.. Don't ask me where I read this as I have no idea, I could have even dreamt it..

Leicester have a fairly big squad, wouldn't suprise me if they're on around $14mill.. Yakubu himself is on 40k a week, that's what, $1.5mill a year.

How do we not have anything to work with? Didn't we have an unsuccessful bid for Sammon (500kish?)

[Alph]

You know, it completely left my head that Leicester aren't quite the club to compare your wage bill too at the moment. :redface:

Maybe not Leicester. But the rest of the Championship.

As for the transfer/loan fees. Could it be that the 500k offered to Kilmarnock was the money made from Moxey and Commons? Maybe that's all we'll have to kick off the summer?

No idea tbh. We can all speculate.

[CumbrianRam]

Heard Forest have a wage bill of around $15mill.. Don't ask me where I read this as I have no idea, I could have even dreamt it..

Leicester have a fairly big squad, wouldn't suprise me if they're on around $14mill.. Yakubu himself is on 40k a week, that's what, $1.5mill a year.

How do we not have anything to work with? Didn't we have an unsuccessful bid for Sammon (500kish?)

Heard similar about Forest, but apparently players like Earnshaw, Moussi etc have to agree to wage cuts if they want to sign new deals.

[The Ram]

Today/Tomorrow aw... WTF against The Fox Piss. Wage bills etc. don't matter :frown:it is who plays the better football on the day and scores the goals to win! The MIGHTY DERBY should always beat the foul PISS STAIN FOX **** **** RODS FROM FESTER!!! :mad:

COME ON YOU RAMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMSASSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!

[Bris Vegas]

You know, it completely left my head that Leicester aren't quite the club to compare your wage bill too at the moment. :redface:

Maybe not Leicester. But the rest of the Championship.

The clubs who are throwing money around without a care in the world Hull, Boro, Leicester, Notts Forest and QPR all have high wages.. Whilst well below PL type wages, it's not really sustainable.. Hence all clubs having owners with more money than sense.. Cardiff probably have high wages too, due to an % increase each year with the likes of Whittingham, Chopra, Bothroyd etc..

Donny, Ssausagehorpe, Barsnley and Palace I can imagine have fairly lowish wages.. Well, the other end of the table..

The rest IMO are roughly the same.. It's a shame really, we've had terrible luck with such foolish managers who were happy to blast a stupid amount of money on wages for such poor players.. The likes of Reading, Swansea, Norwich, Millwall have wages similar or lower to ours but a squad of far better ability..

For every Pearson, Leacock, Savage, Bywater, Green, Porter on ridiculous wages (in comparison with ability) theres a Karacan, Morrison, Long, Holt, Pratley, Tate, Church, McAnuff and Angel Rangel on lower wages..