Guest Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Nigel cough, if he had stayed there would have been no form in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Nigel cough, if he had stayed there would have been no form in the first place.hmmm. Opinion only. His 9 games in charge last season yielded more points than our last 9 games.We lost 4 games but they were to the promoted teams and eventual 6th placed Reading. (infact the teams we list to were all top 6 at that point) it was shocking form really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Yeah but then there was the other 220 games where we lost more than we won.Cicumstances need to be considered but we never got near the position we're in now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 I have no idea what that quote is about. I didn't quote Gstar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 True Alpha - but it was the first season he had that group of players together and there were signs of the flowing football to come. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 hmmm. Opinion only. His 9 games in charge last season yielded more points than our last 9 games.We lost 4 games but they were to the promoted teams and eventual 6th placed Reading. (infact the teams we list to were all top 6 at that point) it was shocking form really. The form guide I'm afraid does not let you remove the teams based upon the quality you face. My post was somewhat tongue in cheek, but before this we hadn't lost more than two games on the bounce under SM (something like that I think). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 The form guide I'm afraid does not let you remove the teams based upon the quality you face. My post was somewhat tongue in cheek, but before this we hadn't lost more than two games on the bounce under SM (something like that I think).we didn't under Clough in 12-13 when we had the majority of last seasons squad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 we didn't under Clough in 12-13 when we had the majority of last seasons squad.True, but sadly we finished 10th, including a winless run of 8 games.i like posts like that, reminds how far we have come and how lucky we are now under the new regime :-D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 True, but sadly we finished 10th, including a winless run of 8 games.i like posts like that, reminds how far we have come and how lucky we are now under the new regime :-Dbut look back at the seasons before it and it demonstrates how far the club had come under his tenure - and shows that with the additions he'd made to a top ten (just) squad it was possible for him to keep improving league position and not inevitable that it wouldn't have happened without SM coming in. (our best football under SM was primarily with players that were here when he arrived) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 but look back at the seasons before it and it demonstrates how far the club had come under his tenure - and shows that with the additions he'd made to a top ten (just) squad it was possible for him to keep improving league position and not inevitable that it wouldn't have happened without SM coming in. (our best football under SM was primarily with players that were here when he arrived)Something we will never agree on I'm afraid, I seem to recall that in the 4 years he managed a full season, he was one of only a couple of managers who didn't achieve higher than 10th in the championship. We were stagnant, his 5 year plan was turning into a 10 year, coupled with embarrassing cup losses, and all we kept hearing was year on year improvement. His final season we hadn't won at home, had once again been knocked out of the cup by a lower league side and was ambling along for another mid table finish.One season he did get us into the top 4 (was it?) and then we failed and only won one in 15 or something ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Something we will never agree on I'm afraid, I seem to recall that in the 4 years he managed a full season, he was one of only a couple of managers who didn't achieve higher than 10th in the championship. We were stagnant, his 5 year plan was turning into a 10 year, coupled with embarrassing cup losses, and all we kept hearing was year on year improvement. His final season we hadn't won at home, had once again been knocked out of the cup by a lower league side and was ambling along for another mid table finish.One season he did get us into the top 4 (was it?) and then we failed and only won one in 15 or something ? Stagnant? Look at the league positions he achieved - every year improved on the one before.(except for the year of the massive injury list) 14th, 19th, 12th, 10thNot won at home in his final season true - Lost to the eventual runaway top two.But you forget that we won 3 out 4 away matches.12-13 was the first season he'd got rid of the deadwood and had the majority of the 13-14 squad available.I just think the improvements were not happening fast enough for fans, but with the run of fixtures Mclaren had those results would have come under Clough. Dont get me wrong I wanted a change, posted as much on here, but I still don't buy that it was inevitable, or even significantly likely, that Clough wouldn't have got us into the top 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 One season he did get us into the top 4 (was it?) and then we failed and only won one in 15 or something ?That was in 2010-11The season with horrific injury list of about 15 players at one pointThe run before that terrible one was 8 wins and 2 draws in 12 games - pretty impressive.for an incapable managerOnce again injuries hampered a positive season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spooney1963 Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Not exactly setting the world on fire at SU!!Move on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Not exactly setting the world on fire at SU!!Move onMatching our form this year so far - I know its a different league but hes onlylost 2 in a row twice all season and considering they were in the relegation spots when he took over last season that a pretty big turnaround. Almost as much as SM did here (Oh wait we were in the top half when SM took over so Clough may actuall have had a bigger impact at SU the SM did here) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spooney1963 Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Like I said previously, move on your getting boring with your Clough love in!!Lets see if he gets them up.Big club with big expectations just like Derby Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Like I said previously, move on your getting boring with your Clough love in!!Lets see if he gets them up.Big club with big expectations just like Derbyyou haven't got to read the posts. Any inciteful opinion on why I'm wrong? The tone of your first post shows you disagree with me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spooney1963 Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Nigel did a reasonable job at Derby and steadied the ship in extremely difficult circumstances. We will never know if the same backing was available to him as with SM.He did put together the nucleus of the team and got them playing good football McClaren simply improved it a little with a trio of shrewd loan signings. Last season raised the expectations for this season and unfortunately it doesn't look like we are going to realise those expectations.In reality they both played a huge part, in their different ways, of making last season something specialThere is no point going on about what Clough might have done, he is Derby's past who played his part in our development but nothing more.Jury is still out on McClaren.Personally I think there are a few reasons why things haven't gone as well as expected/hoped this seasonInjuries have obviously played a part but so has the bad management of that situation. Our style of play has certainly changed from fast flowing attacking football to a slower build up. Planned? I don't know.Also, if you have played to a high standard of football, which I have, you would also know that a settled team builds understanding and confidence. We always seem to be changing for the sake of it.That moves me on to team spirit, I truly don't think it is what it was last season. Whatever, we all want the same. We all have a point of view and I respect your even if I don't completely agree with it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Stagnant? Look at the league positions he achieved - every year improved on the one before.(except for the year of the massive injury list) 14th, 19th, 12th, 10thNot won at home in his final season true - Lost to the eventual runaway top two.But you forget that we won 3 out 4 away matches.12-13 was the first season he'd got rid of the deadwood and had the majority of the 13-14 squad available.I just think the improvements were not happening fast enough for fans, but with the run of fixtures Mclaren had those results would have come under Clough. Dont get me wrong I wanted a change, posted as much on here, but I still don't buy that it was inevitable, or even significantly likely, that Clough wouldn't have got us into the top 6. So on average he improved our league position by one place each year, from memory I think we were 9th when he was sacked.As I said, stagnant, another two years and a top 6 finish may have been achieved;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davenportram Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 So on average he improved our league position by one place each year, from memory I think we were 9th when he was sacked.As I said, stagnant, another two years and a top 6 finish may have been achieved;-)improvement it appears wasn't fast enough for the fans or the board. interestingly we have been poorer this season when players Clough signed have been unavailable or when SM introduced his signings. Remind me again how many of our regular starters are SM signings. Christie was, Albentosa is now we have no choice, Ince and Bent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mostyn6 Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Stagnant? Look at the league positions he achieved - every year improved on the one before.(except for the year of the massive injury list) 14th, 19th, 12th, 10thNot won at home in his final season true - Lost to the eventual runaway top two.But you forget that we won 3 out 4 away matches.12-13 was the first season he'd got rid of the deadwood and had the majority of the 13-14 squad available.I just think the improvements were not happening fast enough for fans, but with the run of fixtures Mclaren had those results would have come under Clough. Dont get me wrong I wanted a change, posted as much on here, but I still don't buy that it was inevitable, or even significantly likely, that Clough wouldn't have got us into the top 6. I know it's just one guy's opinion Vs another guy's opinion, but there is nothing to suggest, off the back of rolling over against Forest in his last game, that Nigel Clough had the mindset, motivation or nous to put together a run of wins and even draws similar to that which McClaren achieved.I believe that we would never have gone 0-4 down to Ipswich under NC, but in parallel to that, we'd never have pulled back from 0-1 or 0-2 under NC, never mind 0-4! Similarly, the turning point in my opinion to last season was the Watford game at Vicarage Road which epitomised the mentality of those few months. It would (in my opinion) have never come under Nigel's management. He was far too negative or cautious if you prefer. So I cannot agree with you.I think we were 14th after the Forest defeat when Nigel left.I think the Reading defeat a few weeks before the Forest defeat was the one that cost his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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