curb Posted August 25, 2011 Share Posted August 25, 2011 Far better than Roberts, much more presence. He might get done occasionally for pace but his general stature, better header etc etc more than makes up for it. Prefer him in there to Roberts any day of the week, Roberts is a liability. Just a shame we're getting him at the end of his careeer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 Watford was the first half of the season. Watford away To blame him for the goal against Hull at home would be ridiculous, it was the goalkeepers fault.. Barker had a go at him. Simeon Jackson is more powerful? . exactly ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianm Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 Far better than Roberts, much more presence. He might get done occasionally for pace but his general stature, better header etc etc more than makes up for it. Prefer him in there to Roberts any day of the week, Roberts is a liability. Just a shame we're getting him at the end of his careeer. I would hope tomorrow that Nigel is positive and brings Roberts back in tomorrow, he is fitter, stronger, faster and better able to be a proper left-back. Kilbane's legs have totally gone and with him far to much defensive responsibility is put on the left-midfielder. First half last week after he had been run and Barnes missed that chance Ward and then Davies were playing as left backs and Kilbane was pushed in as left-centre half. This made us bereft going forward against a Doncaster side decimated by injuries. With one up front this is a luxury we can't afford at home against better teams we have to show intent going forward or will get swamped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NothernRam Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 I would hope tomorrow that Nigel is positive and brings Roberts back in tomorrow, he is fitter, stronger, faster and better able to be a proper left-back. Kilbane's legs have totally gone and with him far to much defensive responsibility is put on the left-midfielder. First half last week after he had been run and Barnes missed that chance Ward and then Davies were playing as left backs and Kilbane was pushed in as left-centre half. This made us bereft going forward against a Doncaster side decimated by injuries. With one up front this is a luxury we can't afford at home against better teams we have to show intent going forward or will get swamped. Who are you talking about? Roberts can be ****ed off the ball very easily by any player in this league. Kilbane is much better option. He is definitely **** though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uttoxram75 Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 This thread has turned into a Kilbane v Roberts debate. The OP was whether you'd keep Kilbane after the loan period. Yes, I'd have him for the season. I'd still try and get a younger left back in but I think Kilbane's influence on a young side is beneficial - much better for instance than sav's antics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted August 26, 2011 Author Share Posted August 26, 2011 This thread has turned into a Kilbane v Roberts debate. The OP was whether you'd keep Kilbane after the loan period. Steady on I'm not an old person yet and it's OAP or even VIP to you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uttoxram75 Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 Steady on I'm not an old person yet and it's OAP or even VIP to you sorry. did i wake you from your mid-morning nap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted August 26, 2011 Author Share Posted August 26, 2011 I was already awake to top up the calories, just thought I'd pop on before going back to bed, lucky I did so I can respond to these old person allegations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceland Ram Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 JOE MATTOCK JOE MATTOCK see about him on loan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianm Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 This thread has turned into a Kilbane v Roberts debate. The OP was whether you'd keep Kilbane after the loan period. Yes, I'd have him for the season. I'd still try and get a younger left back in but I think Kilbane's influence on a young side is beneficial - much better for instance than sav's antics. I don't he is a great influence as he no longer has the tools to do his job on the pitch ie be a proper left-back, at least Sav could still perform well on the pitch and that is the best way of earning respect from fellow players. I wouldn't keep him, as after all he was not deemed good enough to play for Hull City and from what he has shown so far I can see why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 I don't he is a great influence as he no longer has the tools to do his job on the pitch ie be a proper left-back, at least Sav could still perform well on the pitch and that is the best way of earning respect from fellow players. I wouldn't keep him, as after all he was not deemed good enough to play for Hull City and from what he has shown so far I can see why. Unless we can find an experienced fullback with pace, strength, stamina, who's good in the air, can tackle, pass, cross with composure, between the ages of 22-29 all for less than £500k and £5k a week we should keep him until the end of the season... So what if he doesn't bomb forward as much as Brayford (most fullbacks in our league don't), having someone of his experience is invaluable at the moment. As for Savage his legs had clearly gone after Xmas and all he seemed to do was run around the centre circle fouling people and playing sideways passes. It's also interesting to hear a lot of the players in interviews say such things as "There's NOW more camaraderie in the dressing room", "There's MORE togetherness this season than there was last season" etc. Surely the rise in team bonding and the retirement of the floppy haired taffy is purely coincidential... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianm Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 Unless we can find an experienced fullback with pace, strength, stamina, who's good in the air, can tackle, pass, cross with composure, between the ages of 22-29 all for less than £500k and £5k a week we should keep him until the end of the season... So what if he doesn't bomb forward as much as Brayford (most fullbacks in our league don't), having someone of his experience is invaluable at the moment. As for Savage his legs had clearly gone after Xmas and all he seemed to do was run around the centre circle fouling people and playing sideways passes. It's also interesting to hear a lot of the players in interviews say such things as "There's NOW more camaraderie in the dressing room", "There's MORE togetherness this season than there was last season" etc. Surely the rise in team bonding and the retirement of the floppy haired taffy is purely coincidential... You clearly were not a fan of Savage from these comments, any dressing room problems are things we would not be aware of. As for Kilbane's wages as a recent premier league player you would expect them to be on the high side. It is not a problem he does not venture forward much, as he has a good left foot and can distribute well from the back, that will never leave him. The problem or certainly potential problem is his legs have clearly gone and so he has a problem doing the main job of a full-back defending and so he has to rely on the guy in front of him to do his job, who also needs to be one of the main attacking threats, especially playing with one striker. We have got away with this problem first 2 home games but I can't see that continuing. Roberts is not perfect and ideally we could do with somebody better but I think at the moment he would improve the team, particularly at home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curb Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 I would hope tomorrow that Nigel is positive and brings Roberts back in tomorrow, he is fitter, stronger, faster and better able to be a proper left-back. Kilbane's legs have totally gone and with him far to much defensive responsibility is put on the left-midfielder. First half last week after he had been run and Barnes missed that chance Ward and then Davies were playing as left backs and Kilbane was pushed in as left-centre half. This made us bereft going forward against a Doncaster side decimated by injuries. With one up front this is a luxury we can't afford at home against better teams we have to show intent going forward or will get swamped. Is that why we haven't conceded a goal in the last 3 league games? Bizzare assessment, what other proof do you need that the team is more solid with Kilbane playing? Roberts isn't young himself, he's not particularly fast, not very good with the ball, not got any presence in the air, gets caught out of position, gives away needless free kicks, doesn't have much positional sense and is a baldie. As for the comments about Savage, well they don't even deserve a reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
uttoxram75 Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 I don't he is a great influence as he no longer has the tools to do his job on the pitch ie be a proper left-back, at least Sav could still perform well on the pitch and that is the best way of earning respect from fellow players. I wouldn't keep him, as after all he was not deemed good enough to play for Hull City and from what he has shown so far I can see why. We'll have to disagree about Sav. He was a liability and one of the reasons we played so badly last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Day Posted August 26, 2011 Author Share Posted August 26, 2011 I still woop and fistpump the air everytime the team is announced and I see no Savage in there. Does that make me weird? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramsbottom Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 You clearly were not a fan of Savage from these comments, any dressing room problems are things we would not be aware of. As for Kilbane's wages as a recent premier league player you would expect them to be on the high side. It is not a problem he does not venture forward much, as he has a good left foot and can distribute well from the back, that will never leave him. The problem or certainly potential problem is his legs have clearly gone and so he has a problem doing the main job of a full-back defending and so he has to rely on the guy in front of him to do his job, who also needs to be one of the main attacking threats, especially playing with one striker. We have got away with this problem first 2 home games but I can't see that continuing. Roberts is not perfect and ideally we could do with somebody better but I think at the moment he would improve the team, particularly at home. How do you know his legs have gone??? He was never a out & out pace merchant to begin with and as Curbs has pointed out Roberts isn't exactly Theo Walcott himself. He also makes a very valid point that the league games he's played in we've only conceded 1 goal and scored 7 so it appears that, at the moment, our defense & attack aren't suffering with Kilbane in the side. You can't argue with those stats... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianm Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 Is that why we haven't conceded a goal in the last 3 league games? Bizzare assessment, what other proof do you need that the team is more solid with Kilbane playing? Roberts isn't young himself, he's not particularly fast, not very good with the ball, not got any presence in the air, gets caught out of position, gives away needless free kicks, doesn't have much positional sense and is a baldie. As for the comments about Savage, well they don't even deserve a reply. Just because we have not conceded in 3 games does not mean it is due to Kilbane. I have already highlighted what the team are doing to cover his obvious difficulties, anybody at the Shrewsbury match would see this. Roberts is not ideal but with him in it would not require the left midfielder to have to pretty much play as a left-wing back. Last week it worked we got an early goal and we could sit in and play on the break, away games the same. Real problem though if you go a goal down and have to push on when you have a left-back whose legs have gone. Or if you play against one of the better teams who can target and exploit the weakness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianm Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 How do you know his legs have gone??? He was never a out & out pace merchant to begin with and as Curbs has pointed out Roberts isn't exactly Theo Walcott himself. He also makes a very valid point that the league games he's played in we've only conceded 1 goal and scored 7 so it appears that, at the moment, our defense & attack aren't suffering with Kilbane in the side. You can't argue with those stats... It is not a case of being an out and out pace merchant, you can be slowish and cover with good positional sense and defensive acumen. This guy is not just slow his legs have totally gone the Shrewsbury game was embarrasing. Yes we have only conceded 1 goal the other 3 lads in the back 4 faultless. We will see who is right so far everything has gone OK but I can see teams targeting and exploiting this area of weakness and it costing us points in future games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeds Ram Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 I still woop and fistpump the air everytime the team is announced and I see no Savage in there. Does that make me weird? no it makes you normal, the guy was a useless carthorse Kilbane is our weak link a lot of opposition play comes from the left and kilbane is more often than not unable to deal with it. Even with donny most of the balls in the box, etc were from kilbane's side. His passing isn't really that good either so i wouldn't sign him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramesses Posted August 26, 2011 Share Posted August 26, 2011 We'll have to disagree about Sav. He was a liability and one of the reasons we played so badly last season. I agree. But it wasn't expected he’d play so many games in 10-11. I remember Clough saying before the start of that season that Savage wasn’t going to be playing such a major role I thought Clough was just holding on to Savage as a convenient stop gap until Addison returned from injury. If that was the plan then it didn’t work out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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