It's only because his name is Clough

[WorksopRam]

well......of course it's his name

couldnt be him in person and me call him by another name ,

......................errr,could it ?.

you know .......like prince phillip would be Harry scroggins .

or...errrrr......David beckham would be Lord snooty.

talking of the Beckhams ...looks like miss pouty lips and the ever growing

tats man with the 3 hair styles a day will be at the royal wedding .

o.k mag will love that ay....

You should take the 'footy' part out of your name fella.

[footymadme]

You should take the 'footy' part out of your name fella.

hahaha i get ya.

hey , have a laugh on me .

good for the soul m8.

[RotherhamRam]

This squad is not ready for this league and players like Bailey who was brought initially as backup for this season has done vey well for us. In respect of Cloughs signings being criticised recently very unfair. Now I will support this with the following.

People say Clough can not identify a player

Barker, Fielding (loan and been a target last summer), Brayford, Bailey, Cywka, Ben Davis.

Low budget signings and apart from Ben all young.

Then there is Roberts who just about does a job but can fill the gap.

The thing with these targets are they are young and cheap or on free contracts. No real investment (except for Barker the only time he was allowed to spend the money) required from the board.

Now we saw the last transfer window our board offer £150k below the accepted price of the Irons for Sammon, question is why would they accept that offer when know they can get higher price from team at bottom of championship. We then sell Moxey but this is a debate thhat has been done to death.

Now the credit goes to the fans who have protested and placed comments on the newspaper articles, emailed AA and so forth. For me these actions have started to change the boards approach all be it temp at the moment.

We have signned Ward very good business I think and looking at summer deal young quick and can score (played well yesterday). Ayala very good for Centre Half.

Now previously this would have been it but now they are still after 3 more players. These targets identified are good establsihed players and the ones still being targeted Edwards and Hayes are potentially better ones. Both could be availabel at end of season especially if Blackpool stop up and PNE go down. Now who do you thiink hhas picked these targets Clough or Click?

He is getting backing although only on temp basis and this is still too small to say they are going to back Clough in summer. The proof in pudding will be over next 2 weeks and targets in signed and then end of March if they start talking of signing these or other players and then they have to follow this up in the Summer.

Clough can find players for Derby but the board have to back him. Once the players are there then he can play the football he wants. If then it does not work then he can be criticised on players and tactics. Clough is the man for now until this is the situation if it does not work then fair enough.

Yes Clough is a great name respected by the club. Clough jnr loves this club and the fans, the people of Derby and he is passionate. These are the credentials any fan would want in a manager as they will do their upmost to be a success at the club. However any manager needs board backing and support with money. This tosh of the money is there for a manager is unbelieveable as every manager would spend the money if it is available. Recently Clough has been asked if money was there for Barker type players (after Millwall game) his response was to ask the CEO and obviously it wasn't through the transfer window.

[WilkoRam]

I don't have a problem with the quality of his signings especially for how much they have cost. Personally I think he's done alright in the transfer market, nothing amazing but Brayford, Cywka, Bailey, Barker have shown he can pick up a good player. Not all his signings are good but who's are?

I have an issue with the players he's buying if he likes 4-4-2 so much? Out of the players we've signed how many fit well in a 4-4-2? Average signings but wrong for his choice of formation.

[SillyBilly]

He's had more or as much money to spend on recruitment as most other championship managers over 2 years, plenty of other clubs in the league are selling clubs. Success in recruitment I'd make out to be about 1 in 2, with the only criteria being has it improved on what we have. Nobody has explained to me why he can't even get us near top 12 despite our budget being relatively high. We're not that far from Scunny ffs and we probably have a wage bill treble or quadruple theirs at a guess. I dislike GSE greatly but Clough should take as much responsibility. Clough may have a tight budget but he's not prioritising it where it needs to be, namely a point Wilko picked up on with us carrying so many CM's but not having enough strikers or wingers for example, inexcusable. Defence worries me greatly, he's spent good money for a championship defensive line which is bottom 8 sort of standard.

[RamNut]

of course its the name.

personally i've been disappointed in him.

In my heart of hearts I don't believe he's got it....but....... because of the name he's got 9 lives.

Not sure how many he's used up. Quite a few.

At times he seems to embody the worst of Jewell and Brown.

(sorry Toadbelly)

[blackNwhites]

That's nothing though is it really?

Wigan, Wimbledon,Blackpool and various other smaller clubs have done better than us in the past, and som comparable if not bigger have done a lot worse than us over the years.

I concur, i can't remember who made the original post but that's basically the same point i was trying to get across.

[Kevin Hector]

He's had more or as much money to spend on recruitment as most other championship managers over 2 years, plenty of other clubs in the league are selling clubs. Success in recruitment I'd make out to be about 1 in 2, with the only criteria being has it improved on what we have. Nobody has explained to me why he can't even get us near top 12 despite our budget being relatively high. We're not that far from Scunny ffs and we probably have a wage bill treble or quadruple theirs at a guess. I dislike GSE greatly but Clough should take as much responsibility. Clough may have a tight budget but he's not prioritising it where it needs to be, namely a point Wilko picked up on with us carrying so many CM's but not having enough strikers or wingers for example, inexcusable. Defence worries me greatly, he's spent good money for a championship defensive line which is bottom 8 sort of standard.

I agree!

What people don't seem to understand is that we haven't bottomed out yet. We're still in a nose dive, our current position flatters DCFC. Talk of improvement is premature and we have very few decent players to build any success around in the future, IMO.

[blackNwhites]

I agree!

What people don't seem to understand is that we haven't bottomed out yet. We're still in a nose dive, our current position flatters DCFC. Talk of improvement is premature and we have very few decent players to build any success around in the future, IMO.

Barker - 1m

Bailey - Brayford - 1m

Roberts - free

Cywka - free

Ben Pringle - free?

Connor Doyle - free or V cheap.

Dave Martin - 300k?

Lee Croft - free

Chris Porter - 3 - 400k

Buxton - free

(have i missed anybody?)

These players are the ones Clough has been able to afford.

In Barker, we thought we had a solid defender but this season, as has often been mentioned, playing with one leg so not to his full ability.

Bailey looks a good prospect, had Clough been allowed to sign established players he would of improved quicker with experience around him. As it stands, he's a regular first teamer with a lot of responsibility for his first season in the Championship. Savage may have done all he can, although their relationship at the beginning was working well. I hope he sticks around for a long while.

Brayford - By far Cloughs best signing for me. He never gives up, can cross a ball, puts challenges in, has a bit of pace and has a footballing brain. Very intelligent player. His true potential won't be visible until he has established championship/premiership talent around him. Have to bite my tongue when people like Savage lofts balls towards his head, rather than playing the ball into his path when he makes a run. Hope he sticks around, great future.

Martin - Not seen enough of him, but what i have seen he's a little bit light weight. Potential though, still very young and has the pace we sorely need. Can see him playing a part at some stage.

Porter - Bit of a sad story this one. The potential WAS there before all that hip trouble. Since his return, doesn't seem to have the same presence about him. Shame really because at the start of last season i was excited about this guy...then he was injured again.

They all had a fee. These are the only players Clough has been able to afford. Which is absolutely mind boggling, the thoughts behind this limited budget make absolutely no sense seen as we had to clear practically a whole squad out.

Apart from Barker, intended for development purposes. Development. Not instant first team choices (although Brayford has shown he is more than capable), they need that established class around them. Clough HAS NOT been allowed to sign them.

The free's, stop gaps i guess. Some are for development, Cywka (first ever full season) and Doyle (for development).

How can you blame Clough for that? For what he's been allowed to sign, he's done very well. It's not enough, because you need that established class (something Clough has mentioned a few times) and the board have NOT supported him in this.

That is absolutely crazy for a group of people who describe the Premiership as the goal. Recipe for disaster, losing money, support and respect. How you can point fingers at Clough for that, i have no idea.

Like i've said before, you're gonna make mistakes tactically sometimes. Ask Wenger and Ferguson, Ancelotti etc.. It happens. But if you're not supported financially, in WAGES and in transfer fee's, you can't afford to build a team you want.

So you make do with the development squad.

[RotherhamRam]

Barker - 1m

Bailey - Brayford - 1m

Roberts - free

Cywka - free

Ben Pringle - free?

Connor Doyle - free or V cheap.

Dave Martin - 300k?

Lee Croft - free

Chris Porter - 3 - 400k

Buxton - free

(have i missed anybody?)

These players are the ones Clough has been able to afford.

In Barker, we thought we had a solid defender but this season, as has often been mentioned, playing with one leg so not to his full ability.

Bailey looks a good prospect, had Clough been allowed to sign established players he would of improved quicker with experience around him. As it stands, he's a regular first teamer with a lot of responsibility for his first season in the Championship. Savage may have done all he can, although their relationship at the beginning was working well. I hope he sticks around for a long while.

Brayford - By far Cloughs best signing for me. He never gives up, can cross a ball, puts challenges in, has a bit of pace and has a footballing brain. Very intelligent player. His true potential won't be visible until he has established championship/premiership talent around him. Have to bite my tongue when people like Savage lofts balls towards his head, rather than playing the ball into his path when he makes a run. Hope he sticks around, great future.

Martin - Not seen enough of him, but what i have seen he's a little bit light weight. Potential though, still very young and has the pace we sorely need. Can see him playing a part at some stage.

Porter - Bit of a sad story this one. The potential WAS there before all that hip trouble. Since his return, doesn't seem to have the same presence about him. Shame really because at the start of last season i was excited about this guy...then he was injured again.

They all had a fee. These are the only players Clough has been able to afford. Which is absolutely mind boggling, the thoughts behind this limited budget make absolutely no sense seen as we had to clear practically a whole squad out.

Apart from Barker, intended for development purposes. Development. Not instant first team choices (although Brayford has shown he is more than capable), they need that established class around them. Clough HAS NOT been allowed to sign them.

The free's, stop gaps i guess. Some are for development, Cywka (first ever full season) and Doyle (for development).

How can you blame Clough for that? For what he's been allowed to sign, he's done very well. It's not enough, because you need that established class (something Clough has mentioned a few times) and the board have NOT supported him in this.

That is absolutely crazy for a group of people who describe the Premiership as the goal. Recipe for disaster, losing money, support and respect. How you can point fingers at Clough for that, i have no idea.

Like i've said before, you're gonna make mistakes tactically sometimes. Ask Wenger and Ferguson, Ancelotti etc.. It happens. But if you're not supported financially, in WAGES and in transfer fee's, you can't afford to build a team you want.

So you make do with the development squad.

This is gd piece and supports what I have been trying to put in writing. You can not pull his tactics apart when he does not have a squad of players he is entirely happy with or unable to add to as he wants to. Now if the likes of Hulse and Commons were not in their final year and on high wages (especially Hulse) do you honestly think they would have left. Last yr could have had £4 mill if reports correct from Boro the reason that broke down was due to his wages so that indicates how much he was on. Now he would not take a pay cut for us when QPR are in the hunt as we would not offer the same money and the same with Commons. We could not offer an injury prone player the money he wanted until he had proved he could keep fit which he did and got offered Celtic fair enough.

Now this is the problem for me GSE offer low bids for players and accepts low bid for our players. Now QPR offered £900k for an injured player in last ear of his contract who is 30+ then Commons for £300k. I can remember Clough coming out and saying we could not replace Commons for £2million we didn't get this in total for both players.

GSE invest and invest now if you want the fans to support you if not Foxtrott Oscar back home

[WilkoRam]

Barker (£900k), Moxey (300k), Porter(£400k), Bailey, Brayford, Davies (£350k)

Brayford and Bailey? Set about £900k seem about right? No not including loan fees (we include them when we talk about Sven's money but not when it comes not money Nigel has). So £2.85m?

In 2 years. Not a great amount really. But the point remains that his signings not match his tactics.

As for, two other points. 1, yes all managers make mistakes but good managers learn from them. Look at the line-up and style we put out yesterday and then look at the team we were putting out last season and tell me what has been learnt.

And also you can pull his tactics apart, every club pulls their managers tactics apart. Nigel should be no different to any other manager. Just because he's had less money than other managers it doesn't mean his tactics can't be questioned.

[davenportram]

As for, two other points. 1, yes all managers make mistakes but good managers learn from them. Look at the line-up and style we put out yesterday and then look at the team we were putting out last season and tell me what has been learnt.

That that way of setting up when you need to start picking up points following a poor run of results works, at least it did last season.

[blackNwhites]

That that way of setting up when you need to start picking up points following a poor run of results works, at least it did last season.

Which has been an absolute essential, important, safe lesson. Something learned.

You can't buy the players you want, if there is nothing to buy them with.

Doesn't matter what formation/tactics we use, if you can't get the players no formation out there will suit the squad we have. I'm sure Clough would love to fill the area's that need a player who is fluent in that position, but he's not allowed to.

Something people don't see, yet is staring them in the face. They keep asking why play such and such out of position. Because he HAS to, there is nobody else.

[WilkoRam]

Which has been an absolute essential, important, safe lesson. Something learned.

You can't buy the players you want, if there is nothing to buy them with.

Doesn't matter what formation/tactics we use, if you can't get the players no formation out there will suit the squad we have. I'm sure Clough would love to fill the area's that need a player who is fluent in that position, but he's not allowed to.

Something people don't see, yet is staring them in the face. They keep asking why play such and such out of position. Because he HAS to, there is nobody else.

I could disagree with this more I'm afraid. "doesn't matter what formation/tactics we use" - a ridiculous comment when you think about it. Of course it matters, if that was the case why not play 2-2-3-3 or 3-4-4 or even 1-2-3-4? just because you can't get who you want doesn't mean you play players out of position. As for "because he HAS to" how does he have to? I've gone over him not having to put Brayford at CB and I won't do it again but how many players have changed from when we played 4-2-3-1? we've lost Commons from when we started playing it in the opening games. Remember we kept the formation and played Moxey up top, we had faith in the style and formation.

Bywater

Brayford Barker Ayala Roberts

Addison Green

Davies Bueno Davies

Ward

All were available for the last game, nobody was out of position. You can stick Savage in there, Pearson, Cywka, whoever (as you may not want Bueno away on a bog of a pitch) and nobody would be out of place. Instead we have central midfielders on the wings again and it's all because he HAS to? He doesn't have to, the players we have suit this formation, they don't suit 4-4-2. It's not a necessity to play 4-4-2 with four bleeding CM's! It's about 2 solid banks of 4 and backs to the wall to try and keep a clean sheet and nick a winner, instead of sticking the the principles that put us on a run that got us to 4th.

[RotherhamRam]

I could disagree with this more I'm afraid. "doesn't matter what formation/tactics we use" - a ridiculous comment when you think about it. Of course it matters, if that was the case why not play 2-2-3-3 or 3-4-4 or even 1-2-3-4? just because you can't get who you want doesn't mean you play players out of position. As for "because he HAS to" how does he have to? I've gone over him not having to put Brayford at CB and I won't do it again but how many players have changed from when we played 4-2-3-1? we've lost Commons from when we started playing it in the opening games. Remember we kept the formation and played Moxey up top, we had faith in the style and formation.

Bywater

Brayford Barker Ayala Roberts

Addison Green

Davies Bueno Davies

Ward

All were available for the last game, nobody was out of position. You can stick Savage in there, Pearson, Cywka, whoever (as you may not want Bueno away on a bog of a pitch) and nobody would be out of place. Instead we have central midfielders on the wings again and it's all because he HAS to? He doesn't have to, the players we have suit this formation, they don't suit 4-4-2. It's not a necessity to play 4-4-2 with four bleeding CM's! It's about 2 solid banks of 4 and backs to the wall to try and keep a clean sheet and nick a winner, instead of sticking the the principles that put us on a run that got us to 4th.

He did not play 4 CM against Ssausagehorpe but can understand why he played 3. We are crap away from home and Ssausagehorpe always bang goals against us. Last year it was 3-2 and 4-1 losses this yr it was 3-2 win and 0-0 and these results come in the bad run. Ssausagehorpe in 4 games have scored 9 goals and these came in 3 goals. The positive is that we kept a clean sheet and picked up a point away from home against the team who for some reason over the last couple of yrs has psuhed us hard

[Roofio]

He did not play 4 CM against Ssausagehorpe but can understand why he played 3. We are crap away from home and Ssausagehorpe always bang goals against us. Last year it was 3-2 and 4-1 losses this yr it was 3-2 win and 0-0 and these results come in the bad run. Ssausagehorpe in 4 games have scored 9 goals and these came in 3 goals. The positive is that we kept a clean sheet and picked up a point away from home against the team who for some reason over the last couple of yrs has psuhed us hard

This part hurts my mind.

[RotherhamRam]

This part hurts my mind.

sorry in 3 games

[blackNwhites]

I could disagree with this more I'm afraid. "doesn't matter what formation/tactics we use" - a ridiculous comment when you think about it. Of course it matters, if that was the case why not play 2-2-3-3 or 3-4-4 or even 1-2-3-4? just because you can't get who you want doesn't mean you play players out of position. As for "because he HAS to" how does he have to? I've gone over him not having to put Brayford at CB and I won't do it again but how many players have changed from when we played 4-2-3-1? we've lost Commons from when we started playing it in the opening games. Remember we kept the formation and played Moxey up top, we had faith in the style and formation.

Bywater

Brayford Barker Ayala Roberts

Addison Green

Davies Bueno Davies

Ward

All were available for the last game, nobody was out of position. You can stick Savage in there, Pearson, Cywka, whoever (as you may not want Bueno away on a bog of a pitch) and nobody would be out of place. Instead we have central midfielders on the wings again and it's all because he HAS to? He doesn't have to, the players we have suit this formation, they don't suit 4-4-2. It's not a necessity to play 4-4-2 with four bleeding CM's! It's about 2 solid banks of 4 and backs to the wall to try and keep a clean sheet and nick a winner, instead of sticking the the principles that put us on a run that got us to 4th.

I think you've misunderstood what i meant by "doesn't matter what formation.......". What i meant was, our squad is so thin (with development squad players) we haven't exactly got the personnel to cover players when they are out of form or injured.

So, we're that weak, there is no formation that will benefit our squad more than another one.

We're not a strong enough team, like Arsenal, to play the same way week in, week out. They go into every game expecting to win so much so they rotate players all the time. Derby only do that because they're forced to. Players have to play out of position, because that's the only cover we have available.

With Derby, a loss is as likely as a win. I'm sure Clough would like to play the same formation (going out to win) every week, but he can't afford to because every point matters. Ultra defensive 4:5:1 or a narrow 4:4:2 are needed.

[WilkoRam]

I think you've misunderstood what i meant by "doesn't matter what formation.......". What i meant was, our squad is so thin (with development squad players) we haven't exactly got the personnel to cover players when they are out of form or injured.

So, we're that weak, there is no formation that will benefit our squad more than another one.

We're not a strong enough team, like Arsenal, to play the same way week in, week out. They go into every game expecting to win so much so they rotate players all the time. Derby only do that because they're forced to. Players have to play out of position, because that's the only cover we have available.

With Derby, a loss is as likely as a win. I'm sure Clough would like to play the same formation (going out to win) every week, but he can't afford to because every point matters. Ultra defensive 4:5:1 or a narrow 4:4:2 are needed.

Don't get me wrong. The solid minded approach on a boggy pitch to Ssausagehorpe may not have been a bad idea. We got a clean sheet after all. But we're not just playing it on a rain soaked cut up pitch, it's becoming our formation like it was last year.

I know we haven't got the scope to rotate but we have got the scope to play players in their right places. There seems to be this idea that we have to play people out of position, at the same time we have to change formation. Well if we didn't change formation then we wouldn't have to play players out of position. Watford away was a prime example of needlessly playing players out of position, if I'd have put the players that played that game I doubt anyone on here or any other board would have put them in the positions they played in. Bailey looked lost, we lacked attacking from the full backs, etc because players were out of position. This isn't a one of it's just the one I think highlights it most.

We can't rotate players no, we don't have the squad for that. When players are tired or lacking form then we can't freshen it up, and it's a problem, a problem that GSE and a lack of investment need to take responsibility for. But we can still put out a team that has round pegs in rounds holes. I could understand if we'd played 4-4-2 all season and lost some wingers but rather than lose our shape etc we stuck two attacking center mids on the wing. But to change it to 4-4-2 or 4-5-1 when we have no wingers doesn't make sense to me.

[The Suit]

So we need another 21 pts to improve on last season, whats going to be the excuse when we dont ?

I guess this cuts exactly to the heart of the matter - well said