RamNut Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 The football just wasn't as quick back then as it is now, many ex professionals have said this. It isn't a myth, as I don't think Nigel is fooled by 'myths'. Kuqi couldn't manage 3 games in eight days and be expected to perform as well as he usually does. He'd be a yard or so short on everything, and he'd be getting tired earlier and earlier in games until you came to the point where he was already flagging at the end of afirst half in a game at some point. And yes, Savages fitness is good generally, but if you'd have read reports on the Swansea game he was already out on his feet by the 60th minute, he'd not been rested enough. If we keep playing him for 90 minutes, he will get injured, and he won't be anywhere near as effective as usual. The Premier League is faster because the players are quicker, fitter, bigger, stronger. But I dont see any difference between the Championship now and say 1987 when we won it. And we have 7 subs now instead of 2. I'd love to see the pro-zone stats on how far Sav runs in a game, and with the extra man in midfield too....? Come on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 The Premier League is faster because the players are quicker, fitter, bigger, stronger. But I dont see any difference between the Championship now and say 1987 when we won it. And we have 7 subs now instead of 2. I'd love to see the pro-zone stats on how far Sav runs in a game, and with the extra man in midfield too....? Come on. The Championship is quicker than the Premiership, in the Premiership there is more skill on the ball, which is the challenge. The Championship is more about speed and breaking on teams. The game is so much quicker than in 1987, all ex pros say it. The levels of fitness needed are big, they're training and in the gym all week, it's not for nothing you know. The game is definately tons quicker. It'd undeniable, RamNut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXDcFcXx Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 Your missing my point, i am saying he can't play for the youth team if he is involved in the 1st team. Surly playing 90 mins for the under 19 has to be more for his learning process than maybe getting 5 mins in the 1st team he isnt jut going to get 5 min through the rest of his development. Build it up. 15 min one match. 20min after so many. eventually leading to him being able to cope and do something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 he isnt jut going to get 5 min through the rest of his development. Build it up. 15 min one match. 20min after so many. eventually leading to him being able to cope and do something. If we thought he was good enough to be on the bench, then he would be. As it is, he isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WorksopRam Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 Yes, you might, but it doesn't stop your team-mates who are also paid that amount who haven't played much from having fresher legs than you does it... Older players should work on fitness more, in order to be at the same level as their fresh-legged team mates. Easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 And yes, Savages fitness is good generally, but if you'd have read reports on the Swansea game he was already out on his feet by the 60th minute, he'd not been rested enough. And thats another thing.....we made three substitutions in that game. And savage was not substituted so they obviously weren't concerned about him tiring. He played 82 mins v palace, 90 ins v Middlesbro, and the full game at Swansea. And he was picked for the next match v Preston, and played the full game again. Tired? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hucknall Ram Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 How long is that going to take to build him up? You can't do it every game, like yesterday and Ssausagehorpe game you wouldnt bring him, every time you take him away from playing under 19 could be harming him. Clearly he not good enough for the 1st team yet, so better off playing youth matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 they're training and in the gym all week, it's not for nothing you know. They're not in the gym all week lol. They are mainly resting during the week. There was a forum where a guy asked NC how much training they do. The answer might surprise you. It was very little because Nigel - like Brian - believed in resting. Championship faster than the Prem? LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 And thats another thing.....we made three substitutions in that game. And savage was not substituted so they obviously weren't concerned about him tiring. He played 82 mins v palace, 90 ins v Middlesbro, and the full game at Swansea. And he was picked for the next match v Preston, and played the full game again. Tired? We didn't have anyone to change for Savage, we needed him in there at Swansea, but it was clear that he should have been substituted, I presume he was left on for his leadership qualities. Wasn't the Preston game after a weekend without a game? So of course he would be fine. The fact is, the speed of the game now far outweighs what it used to be, hence why players at that age drop down leagues. If they could keep going, players wouldn't be looked at as 'getting on' at 35 would they. If Savage had the fitness he had at 28, he'd still be in the Premiership. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 They're not in the gym all week lol. They are mainly resting during the week. There was a forum where a guy asked NC how much training they do. The answer might surprise you. It was very little because Nigel - like Brian - believed in resting. Championship faster than the Prem? LOL They still do gym work throughout the week. Look at Gareth Roberts, you don't get that well built by resting now do you? And it is faster than the Prem, the Prem is more about technical skill, which means games are slowed down as sides try to break each other down. The Championship is more about legwork and speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 The fact is, the speed of the game now far outweighs what it used to be, hence why players at that age drop down leagues. If they could keep going, players wouldn't be looked at as 'getting on' at 35 would they. If Savage had the fitness he had at 28, he'd still be in the Premiership. hang on....you just said the Championship was faster than the Prem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 hang on....you just said the Championship was faster than the Prem. Teams tire quicker than they do in the Championship than the Premiership. The Premiership is slower than the Championship, but more sustained. In the Championship, there's frantic action then it calms down a bit, then starts again. The Premiership is about non stop attacking, defending for the most part, just not at the same level of speed. Savage can't manage sustained defending for 90 minutes, he can however manage the frantic action for two thirds of a match in the Championship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 The Championship side of 87 contained Gary Micklewhite. Ask any Derby fan to name a player who ran his nuts off for 90 minutes and Gary Micklewhite will feature very very prominently. The team also contained Geraint Williams....another hard worker; Phil Gee who's game was based on pace....Bobby Davison, Ross Maclaren...hard working and pacy. They didnt have pro-zone in 87 but if you compared that teams stats to the current side for pace, distance run, whatever else I doubt whether they would be beaten. Its yet another myth to suggest that in those days it was jumpers for goal posts and a fag at half-time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 But any either of them 33+? And despite that, the game still wasn't as quick as it is now. In no way am I suggesting that it was easy in years gone by, or that it was slow, it's just that the levels of fitness demanded of players far outweighs that of the 1980's players etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 http://www.bbc.co.uk/derby/content/images/2005/07/28/derby_county_kits_gallery_89_90_home_saunders_470x300 Exhibit No1 Dean Saunders The fastest hardest working striker that I can remember. Played for Derby 1988-1991. Faster than any current Derby player ? probably Harder working than than any current Derby player? probably Could he cope in the Championship 2010...LOL ...you bet. He'd p1ss on everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 You and I can discuss this all we want to, but if you take the quotes of most players on the subject of whether the game is quicker than in their day then they almost all say that yes, it is far faster than it was when they played themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodders Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 http://www.bbc.co.uk/derby/content/images/2005/07/28/derby_county_kits_gallery_89_90_home_saunders_470x300 Exhibit No1 Dean Saunders The fastest hardest working striker that I can remember. Played for Derby 1988-1991. Faster than any current Derby player ? probably Harder working than than any current Derby player? probably Could he cope in the Championship 2010...LOL ...you bet. He'd p1ss on everyone. would he do better than ronaldo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 Any quotes will in the main: Refer to the Prem Refer to the 50s, 60s and 70s Ignore the fact that the pitches were heavier then Ignore the fact that the ball weighed a tonne Ignore the fact that there are 3 subs now, and 7 on the bench and finally..... ignore the fact that the object of the exercise is to make the ball do the work and retain possession. Mackay didnt run because he didnt have to....he was there before the ball.... And he's still the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 Any quotes will in the main: Refer to the Prem Refer to the 50s, 60s and 70s Ignore the fact that the pitches were heavier then Ignore the fact that the ball weighed a tonne Ignore the fact that there are 3 subs now, and 7 on the bench and finally..... ignore the fact that the object of the exercise is to make the ball do the work and retain possession. Mackay didnt run because he didnt have to....he was there before the ball.... And he's still the best. I can't argue with the Mackay comment, all the older fans seem to refer to him as a demi-god of somesort Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duracell Posted December 5, 2010 Share Posted December 5, 2010 Older players should work on fitness more, in order to be at the same level as their fresh-legged team mates. Easy. You think Savage or Kuqi could be as physically fit as Cywka or Bailey or Brayford? Seriously, come on. Sav and Kuqi could train day and night and Cywka could do nothing for weeks and he'd still be fitter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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