Ambitious Posted November 13, 2012 Author Share Posted November 13, 2012 I was talking over the past 15 years or so.. I excluded the likes of Gazza and Scholes who technically were far superior to Lampard.. I also said he perhaps has a claim to being worldclass rather than actually being worldclass.. As far as a goalscoring midfielder goes it's pretty impressive.. I think he got a rough deal in the Gerrard/Lampard partnership.. I feel Lampard was the better of the two and he single handedly dragged us back into our Euro 2004 defeat to Portugal.. Opinions are massively divided on him.. Technically there are and were many better players than him, but his goalscoring stats were very impressive for a midfielder.. When people try and tell me Scholes is better than Lampard I simply laugh it off - Lampard is an incredible player, a very intelligent player - not fast, not overally strong but can read a game like no other midfielder I have seen. Gerrard used to run around, could drive the play - Lampard would simply read the game and get himself in dangerous positions. He has been effective doing that. How many times have you seen Lampard beat his man and score a goal? does that make him a bad player? or a smart player for not having to do that and being 10x more effective than those who do. And he is technically a brilliant player, regardless of what people can argue against him. As I said he doesn't try and beat his man, he just passes them off the pitch - makes the ball do the work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PalaceFan Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 When people try and tell me Scholes is better than Lampard I simply laugh it off - Lampard is an incredible player, a very intelligent player - not fast, not overally strong but can read a game like no other midfielder I have seen. Gerrard used to run around, could drive the play - Lampard would simply read the game and get himself in dangerous positions. He has been effective doing that. How many times have you seen Lampard beat his man and score a goal? does that make him a bad player? or a smart player for not having to do that and being 10x more effective than those who do. And he is technically a brilliant player, regardless of what people can argue against him. As I said he doesn't try and beat his man, he just passes them off the pitch - makes the ball do the work. I know this is no longer Palace related but I can't help but agree with this, the best player of the Premiership era for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCFCfranco Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 I personally thought eddie Lewis was the best player of the premiership era. but hey ho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Probably worth noting that at Chelsea the system they played was created to make chances for Lampard and work around him and one or two others. He was a cracking player, incredibly effective, but Scholes could do what he did and two or three other jobs at the same time. He could cross, he could tackle ('could' tackle, more of a booking machine nowadays) he could shoot, he could pass, he had everything you needed. And yet you laugh off mentions that Scholes is the best, do you Ambitious? Allow me to throw a few quotes your way: “Paul Scholes would have been one of my first choices for putting together a great team - that goes to show how highly I have always rated him. He would have been one of the first players I’d have bought, given the chance” ~ Marcello Lippi. "The player in the Premiership I admire most? Easy - Scholes." ~ Patrick Viera "He is the one whose level I aspire to. He is the best player in the Premier League." ~ Cesc Fabregas "Scholes is undoubtedly the best midfielder of his generation." ~ Zinedine Zidane "I'm not the best, Paul Scholes is." ~ Edgar Davids "If you ask footballers to pick out the player they most admire, so many of them will pick Paul Scholes. He can tackle, and his passing and shooting is of the highest level. He’s the most consistent and naturally gifted player we’ve had for a long, long time." ~ Alan Shearer You can have a favourite player, you can have a preferred player, but in the eyes of much of the football world, Paul Scholes was the greatest English player of his generation. No-one comes close to his all-round ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex W Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 But anyway, a tad off-topic there, my bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 One key difference between Lampard and Scholes (when both in peak of careers) was that Scholes can create from deep positions. Lampard likes to keep things ticking over and bursts into life 25 yards from goal. Scholes can/did what Pirlo was singled out for in the Euro's. Open teams up from inside his half. Not to say Lampard can't. Just often when Lampard has the ball in his own half you can feel safe (well, as safe as possible with that guy)..... With Scholes, he has vision to utilise the width United have always played with. A midfielder who just pulls strings. Class. Proper class. Anyway, that's enough niceties about Fat Frank. He's useless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Scholes gains so much respect for who he is.. A genuinely nice person who stays out of the limelight.. Although he can't tackle for toffee With hindsight now England would have been far better off having a midfield 3 of Hargreaves, Scholes and Lampard during 2004/2006.. Trying to accomodate Gerrard for years and Scholes retiring gave us no chance... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastKentRam Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Gerrard was decent in his day, he's looked absolutely pony when ever i've seen him play lately though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted November 13, 2012 Author Share Posted November 13, 2012 Gerrard was decent in his day, he's looked absolutely pony when ever i've seen him play lately though. Gerrard's game was utilizing that 'engine' he had - His highlight reel will be one of the best ever created, no one can argue with that. I think Bris is right - Scholes and Lampard would of perhaps been better but at that time Gerrard was picking up his highlight reel - don't think I've ever quite seen anyone as good as Gerrard in that second half in the champions league final - that was a performance I would tell my kids about. Scholes for me, I just have never understood it - never. I don't really watch a lot of premier league football and haven't unless Derby have been up there, I have always been more of a lower league fan - trying to spot the hidden gems among the rough. I can't say I have ever been particularly impressed with Scholes - last time I saw him properly was when we beat man utd 1-0 and he was completely off the pace and awful that night - Addison back pocketed him without breaking a sweat. The only reason I respect Scholes as much as I do is because I listen to other people - regardless of what I have seen of him in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 That second half performance v Milan in the CL final was Gerrard winning a European Cup single handed. Milan being my soft spot club I remember it pretty well. Unplayable as anybody has ever been. It was cheating to have him on their side! Poor lad has expired now. His legs stop him being action man and with the slower tempo Rodgers prefers...... His best days are gone. Step up Jack Wilshere. He could be the next Proper claim to World Class. Fingers crossed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CumbrianRam Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Weren't the Barca players fighting over who would get Scholes shirt after the 2011 final? That says it all for me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsilks Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Zaha worldclass now? I don't see Barcelona, Real Madrid, Bayern Munich or so on lining up to sign him. Jose Mourinho has reportedly showed an interest as have some of the top English clubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted November 13, 2012 Share Posted November 13, 2012 Wern't the Barca players fighting over who would get Scholes shirt after the 2011 final? That says it all for me Really? Didn't know that. Doesn't surprise me though. There aren't many professionals you'd like your kids to idolise but Scholes is the perfect player. I suppose Iniesta and Xavi have been great professionals too. But Scholes is up with them easily. Won't see another one of him for a while. Ever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 That second half performance v Milan in the CL final was Gerrard winning a European Cup single handed. Milan being my soft spot club I remember it pretty well. Unplayable as anybody has ever been. It was cheating to have him on their side! Poor lad has expired now. His legs stop him being action man and with the slower tempo Rodgers prefers...... His best days are gone. Step up Jack Wilshere. He could be the next Proper claim to World Class. Fingers crossed. That second half performance? I assume you mean that 2nd half 15 minute spell.. Liverpool came back from the dead, but they were only ever on top during that 15 minute spell.. For the remainder of the game and extra time they were second best and had it not been for a Shevchenko 1 in a million miss from 2 yards out it would have counted for nothing.. They were really hanging on for penalties towards the end (Dudek kept them in it, his penalty dance will live long in the memory haha!) Liverpool were as second best to Milan as Chelsea were to Bayern in last years final.. Take nothing away from the achievement, what Liverpool did was phenomenal, but it was also incredibly lucky.. It was also my favourite ever CL final, even better than the Barca 2-0 Man Utd (which I absolutely loved for Iniestas performance) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsilks Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Liverpool were as second best to Milan as Chelsea were to Bayern in last years final.. Take nothing away from the achievement, what Liverpool did was phenomenal Surely you fact that Liverpool didn't deserve to win should be taken away... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Surely you fact that Liverpool didn't deserve to win should be taken away... Coming back from 3 down against Milan is far more of an achievement than going defensive for 90 minutes and fluking a lucky goal and having an incredible amount of luck with the frame of the goal at your end.. Or was that your point? Any side that comes back from 3 down deserves respect because it's a very difficult feat to do.. Can you imagine a NC side coming back from 3-0 down? No chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcsilks Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Coming back from 3 down against Milan is far more of an achievement than going defensive for 90 minutes and fluking a lucky goal and having an incredible amount of luck with the frame of the goal at your end.. Or was that your point? Any side that comes back from 3 down deserves respect because it's a very difficult feat to do.. Can you imagine a NC side coming back from 3-0 down? No chance. No, my point is that you're most certainly contradicting yourself. You have said on one hand that the team that plays the best deserves to win the game regardless. And now you are saying that Liverpool were deserving due to their circumstance. Surely that fact that Celtic managed to man the barricades against what is "the greatest ever club side in the history of World Football" is as equal a feat as coming from 3 down against Milan. Again, you find time to have a cheap shot at the manager. I have come to the conclusion that you are an attention seeker. You choose to right sensational and argumentative posts because you want the reaction. You want other users to mention your quite ridiculously negative anti Clough posts. And yes, I am another who is rising to your fairly glaring bait. How naive of me. My apologies for going off topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bris Vegas Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 No, my point is that you're most certainly contradicting yourself. You have said on one hand that the team that plays the best deserves to win the game regardless. And now you are saying that Liverpool were deserving due to their circumstance. Surely that fact that Celtic managed to man the barricades against what is "the greatest ever club side in the history of World Football" is as equal a feat as coming from 3 down against Milan. Again, you find time to have a cheap shot at the manager. I have come to the conclusion that you are an attention seeker. You choose to right sensational and argumentative posts because you want the reaction. You want other users to mention your quite ridiculously negative anti Clough posts. And yes, I am another who is rising to your fairly glaring bait. How naive of me. My apologies for going off topic. Erm for starters Liverpool didn't win the game.. Well not in 120 minutes.. And I never said they deserved to win.. I said they deserve respect and you shouldn't take that away from them.. It's an incredible achievement.. Celtic also made an incredible feat, beating the best team in history (well not the best as they were missing Puyol, Pique, Villa, Busquets) but still that Barca team they put out would win 47 times out of 50.. But Celtics case was different, it was based on ugly anti-football tactics.. At least Liverpool had some decent footballers in their team that day that tried to attack.. Coming back from 3-0 against anyone is difficult, coming back from 3-0 against an awesome Milan side is something different.. Again, it would only happen once every 100 games.. But I never said they deserved to win it.. Milan were the far better side over the 120 minutes.. I don't think I'm anti-Clough at all.. He's just an average manager that won't ever get us promoted.. I think you're ridiculously pro Clough.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 14, 2012 Share Posted November 14, 2012 Erm for starters Liverpool didn't win the game.. Well not in 120 minutes.. And I never said they deserved to win.. I said they deserve respect and you shouldn't take that away from them.. It's an incredible achievement.. Celtic also made an incredible feat, beating the best team in history (well not the best as they were missing Puyol, Pique, Villa, Busquets) but still that Barca team they put out would win 47 times out of 50.. But Celtics case was different, it was based on ugly anti-football tactics.. At least Liverpool had some decent footballers in their team that day that tried to attack.. Coming back from 3-0 against anyone is difficult, coming back from 3-0 against an awesome Milan side is something different.. Again, it would only happen once every 100 games.. But I never said they deserved to win it.. Milan were the far better side over the 120 minutes.. I don't think I'm anti-Clough at all.. He's just an average manager that won't ever get us promoted.. I think you're ridiculously pro Clough.. Hooray we agree on something at last Bris, the last statement you made :-) I notice that the Barca team would only win 47 out of 50 now, last week it was 97 out of 100, this season they have not managed to win 2, so thats means they will fail to win only once more this season, and if this happens will you admit you got something wrong ? And Scholes was the best out of the three, followed by Gerrard then Lampard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ambitious Posted November 19, 2012 Author Share Posted November 19, 2012 http://www.adifferentleague.co.uk/p6_0_17628_man-utd-focus-ferguson-targets-zaha-to-fill-ronaldo-void.html 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/huh' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':huh:' /> Is he cracking up? 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blink' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':blink:' /> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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