McRamFan Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 well the fact they crashed kind of proves my point, that could have been a car with 3 children in or it could have been a lamppost. Of course people drive at different speeds when drunk and often the different speeds do account to different risks e.g. driving 90 or 30, however driving drunk at whatever speed impairs the driver significantly and carries a great risk crashing while endangering peoples lives and it is only luck that they didn't kill 2 kids like McCormick. Also do you have any evidence to back up the assertion? along with how the statistics were took, e.g. if they were self reported then people would say they were thought they were safe and would have a lack of validity. Office of National Statistics (ONS), there is statistics for everything, gathered for public and private companies then aggregated with a supercomputer to produce reports, these reports are then used to help develop policy at all levels from international to local, from defence to the amount of parking spaces in a town 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />. If you are just over the limit at 30mph, what risk of 1 to 10 would you put on causing a death? If you are over twice the limit driving at over 70mph, what value for that. We'll assume the conditions where good, at night and road was well lit. Car in excellent mechnical condition. Just to also add that hitting a child crossing a road at 30mph there is an 80% chance it will live at 40mph its an 80% chance it will die. Probably 100% it will live if it is strapped in another car. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 All i see is a drink driver who killed 2 children....it shouldnt be pandered over and claimed to be accident. Well i know now if i want kill anyone now i'll be sure to be drinking and driving to do it 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':D' /> Your statements have shown there is no point in responding to what you are saying dear sir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 29, 2012 Share Posted May 29, 2012 Office of National Statistics (ONS), there is statistics for everything, gathered for public and private companies then aggregated with a supercomputer to produce reports, these reports are then used to help develop policy at all levels from international to local, from defence to the amount of parking spaces in a town 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />. If you are just over the limit at 30mph, what risk of 1 to 10 would you put on causing a death? If you are over twice the limit driving at over 70mph, what value for that. We'll assume the conditions where good, at night and road was well lit. Car in excellent mechnical condition. Just to also add that hitting a child crossing a road at 30mph there is an 80% chance it will live at 40mph its an 80% chance it will die. Probably 100% it will live if it is strapped in another car. well it depends on the car you are hitting, where the children are positioned how big the car you are hitting them with is as well. Please send a link, the O.N.S do gather statistics but they gather them in different ways as far as I am aware, official statistics may not always be valid as well especially on crime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 well it depends on the car you are hitting, where the children are positioned how big the car you are hitting them with is as well. Please send a link, the O.N.S do gather statistics but they gather them in different ways as far as I am aware, official statistics may not always be valid as well especially on crime. Just answer the question, and I am sure you can use a decent search engine, ie not google, information is freely available if you know where to look. I'll give you a started for 10: http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/taxonomy/index.html?nscl=Crime+and+Justice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Just answer the question, and I am sure you can use a decent search engine, ie not google, information is freely available if you know where to look. I'll give you a started for 10: [url=http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/taxonomy/index.html?nscl=Crime+and+Justice]http://www.ons.gov.u...ime and Justice I did answer the question it depends on many variables. But we are getting out of the discussion topic. It doesn't say how they record information which is very important when analysing statistics from having a glance at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 I did answer the question it depends on many variables. But we are getting out of the discussion topic. It doesn't say how they record information which is very important when analysing statistics from having a glance at it. We left the topic a long time ago. I'll let you figure it out for yourself, as I have concluded that you believe the law is correct in the way this case was dealt with, however I believe that you are in the minority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 We left the topic a long time ago. I'll let you figure it out for yourself, as I have concluded that you believe the law is correct in the way this case was dealt with, however I believe that you are in the minority. I do yes and just because I am in the minority doesn't mean I am wrong. In this country we have a horrible attitude towards offenders and people who were in prison and sentencing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 I do yes and just because I am in the minority doesn't mean I am wrong. In this country we have a horrible attitude towards offenders and people who were in prison and sentencing. No we have a nanny state, cotton wool, looney left, wet blanket attitude to any degree of punishment, whether it be discipline in schools or allowing drink drivers, kiddy fiddlers, murderers, rapists, corrupt bankers et al off with light weight human right infected sentances. Where are the rights of those affected? Disolved by softies that want to hug a thug and think that is the answer to society and its woes. You are wrong, because the law is wrong, it needs to change QED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 surely this is getting a bit pedantic now! IMO He made a huge mistake, has served the time that was required by law and should be allowed to ply his trade, however how he conducts himself with show if he has learnt any lessons, ie charitable ventures etc etc the 30mph and 80% of survival is true I got shown about 3 hours of video and seminars on it at a speed awareness course I had to attend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 I still think drink drivers should be hit with a ban for life, this would eradicate the problem with 6 months as soon as people started to know people that it had impacted etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 No we have a nanny state, cotton wool, looney left, wet blanket attitude to any degree of punishment, whether it be discipline in schools or allowing drink drivers, kiddy fiddlers, murderers, rapists, corrupt bankers et al off with light weight human right infected sentances. Where are the rights of those affected? Disolved by softies that want to hug a thug and think that is the answer to society and its woes. You are wrong, because the law is wrong, it needs to change QED oh yes because it must be my side which is wrong yet in Norway the re-offending rate is 20% compared to 50% here, they have better prisons, better social mobility and equality and better rehabilitation for the prisoners. They look at what kind of person you want to come out of prison, not neccesarily how long you lock people up and treat them like animals like your farcical suggestion. You started the debate by trying to claim it was premeditated murder, after you backed down from that fanciful idea you went on to manslaughter. The rights of the affected? the right is to see justice in court what else can we give them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamFan Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 oh yes because it must be my side which is wrong yet in Norway the re-offending rate is 20% compared to 50% here, they have better prisons, better social mobility and equality and better rehabilitation for the prisoners. They look at what kind of person you want to come out of prison, not neccesarily how long you lock people up and treat them like animals. The rights of the affected? the right is to see justice in court what else can we give them? Better justice - I rest my case Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 But then you can go into what justice is which is a subjective idea. I believe justice was done in this instance, you do not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 The problem is in cases like this victims parents grandparents will never feel justice has been done because two kids have died Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 The problem is in cases like this victims parents grandparents will never feel justice has been done because two kids have died Exactly they even moaned when he was working in a charity shop last year it doesn't matter what he does in the future they will never feel justice has been done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Moaned isnt the correct word to use, they have every right to hate him and dislike him that is there choice and part of there grieving process Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 30, 2012 Share Posted May 30, 2012 Moaning is the right word, I agree they have every right to hate him and it is part of the grieving process but in my view they shouldn't complain when he works in a charity shop. What else can he do? he has profusely apologized and is just trying to carry on his life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted June 2, 2012 Share Posted June 2, 2012 Whenever thinking of a crime and suitable punishment I always think would you want this criminal your defending living on your street? Would you mind this rehabilitated peado living outside your kids school? If this Cnut who took the chance drink driving had hit my daughter he'd be tied up in an abandoned shed somewhere getting a shafted by a golf club 5times a day. He took the chance. Had he not killed my child I would say he can play for Real Madrid for all I care. But he took the chance and destroyed a family. That makes him a cnut. Hope he gets cancer. 4 years. That's his lesson learned? Guess it's easier to say that if it's not your own flesh and blood your wiping of his bumper. **** his guilt and his freedom. Obey the law. Eye for an eye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alph Posted June 2, 2012 Share Posted June 2, 2012 Hitler and Saddam and Osama should of just said sorry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
observer Posted June 2, 2012 Share Posted June 2, 2012 Young Ram, I can kinda understand what you are saying, but not many people in this country are happy with punishments handed out, like I said a lifetime ban from driving and the jail sentence would of been a much greater punishment. Its easy for us to sit on a keyboard and say it should be this it should be that, but if it happened to one of your own you would feel differently. As is the case its vary easier for parents to put themselves in the shoes of the mother and say ' he should be shot' etc. I think they need to make prison more of deterrent, I sell computer games for a living and am ashamed at the amount I send to hmp I dont see why prisoners cant be made to work, in some capacity to give back to the community! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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