Poland v England

[Bris Vegas]

I've never seen Mexico beat England.

ETA - England last lost against Mexico in 1985, 1-0 in Mexico itself. For a top team that's poor.

Well done.. When was the last time England beat Portugal, Brazil, Italy, Spain etc.?

How many times has England played Mexico since 1985? I remember one game at Wembley in 2010 when Mexico were far the better side.. Oh and of course at Pride Park around 15 years ago..

What's Englands recent record in international tournaments.. Mexico has..

Winner Gold Medal Olympics

Gold Cup (2003 beating Brazil twice, 2009 5-0 vs US, 2011 4-2 vs US)

Runner-Up Copa America (2001 knocking out Brazil, Chile and Uruguay)

3rd place Copa America (2007 beating Brazil and Uruguay)

Semi Final Confederations Cup (knocked out Brazil, lost on penatlies vs Argentina and 4-3 vs Germany for 3rd place)

2002 WC reached last 16 (group they had Italy, Croatia and Ecuador)

2006 WC reached last 16 (group had Angola, Portugal and Iran)

2010 WC reached last 16 (group had S.A, France and Uruguay)

In 2 of those 3 WCs they had groups of deaths and went on to lose to Argentina twice..

Are you saying they're not a top team when in recent history they've achieved alot more than England.. And you're trying to prove that over 2 friendlies in about 20 years?

[Bris Vegas]

England haven't been in a major final since 1966.. Mexico has been in numerous over the past decade..

Case closed

[Alph]

I think Englands quality is only part of the problem.

The fact players are conveniently injured and recover during international breaks show where their priorities lie. It's not England's Rooney, it's Man United Rooney. It's 'ok so he's won the PL and Europe he's on 200k per week is the fat United Cnut gonna do owt?' sort of approach that pushes International importance back

Same with fans. People would rather their club win a League Cup than England win a world cup.

Then there's our media. Arrogant, deluded and vile. 'The lads march on to World Cup!!!' followed by 'Overpaid flops let country down again'.

The are horrid.

Forget quality. It's loyalty, arrogance and Media that England have to overcome first.

Remember what Paul Scholes said about England tours?

I have no idea what it's like abroad. Do the Catalan players face problems when playing for Spain? But then Spain are unique because they are going through a tremendous cycle of footballers.

I dunno. I just think Englands problems are massive. From 8yr olds taught to hoof to the media building an invincible wall only to knock it down.

[blackNwhites]

England haven't been in a major final since 1966.. Mexico has been in numerous over the past decade..

Case closed

Lets re-open that case, England only compete in two tournaments. The World Cup and The European Championships. We regularly come up against some pretty good teams in Europe, at the main championships and qualifying.

England have played Mexico 4 times since 1985, winning all 4.

Argentina have only beaten us twice in their history. Brazil have a much superior record.

What was it you said about South American teams and fielding 2nd string teams sometimes, I know Brazil and Argentina do that quite regularly. I think England would have a better chance at winning the Cope America than the Euroes.

I'm not saying England are a good team though, in fact we're seriously going down hill as Alpha says.

The main thing holding England back at the minute is the foreign investment, simple. It's even got to the point that young lads aren't even bothering getting into football anymore, it's not encouraged in schools. Sad times for English football.

[Bris Vegas]

Lets re-open that case, England only compete in two tournaments. The World Cup and The European Championships. We regularly come up against some pretty good teams in Europe, at the main championships and qualifying.

England have played Mexico 4 times since 1985, winning all 4.

Argentina have only beaten us twice in their history. Brazil have a much superior record.

What was it you said about South American teams and fielding 2nd string teams sometimes, I know Brazil and Argentina do that quite regularly. I think England would have a better chance at winning the Cope America than the Euroes.

I'm not saying England are a good team though, in fact we're seriously going down hill as Alpha says.

The main thing holding England back at the minute is the foreign investment, simple. It's even got to the point that young lads aren't even bothering getting into football anymore, it's not encouraged in schools. Sad times for English football.

Of those 4 times how many were competitive matches? Erm 0..

I didn't ask how many times Argentina have beaten England, I asked how many times England have beaten Argentina.. In my lifetime it's 1-1.. Funny how you fail to mention the others..

England only compete in two tournaments.. Mexico in 3..

Of the Gold Cup the past 2 tournaments have been a breeze for Mexico as only Costa Rica, Hondouras and The US pose only problems..

But before that Brazil, Columbia and Uruguay have all entered.. Mexico beat a Brazilian side that featured Adriano, Kaka, Maicon, Robinho, Julio Baptista, Alex, Diego, Luisao twice in the same tournament before lifting the 2003 Gold Cup.. Their record against Brazil in comnpetitive matches is fantastic.. Only a top top team can have a record as good as that..

England have a better chance of winning the Copa America than The Euros? Is that a joke? Given that Spain in 2010 is the only European team to win a WC outside of Europe and Englands finest players have miserably failed when playing majors in South America you honestly believe they'd have a better chance.. England couldn't even win the Euros oin home soil when The Czech Republic made the final not to mention Greece winning possibly the poorest Euros in history in 2004.. Where was England then?

I know you're not saying England are a good team, we both know they're not.. But don't rubbish Mexicos achievements which are clearly far better than Englands over the past 20 years..

If England were to play Mexico now at the Azteca I'd stick a lot of money on a Mexican victory.. England only do well in friendlies at Wembley.. Another problem we have.. When was the last time England actually prepared for a WC and do some travelling to better climatise.. The likes of Brazil, Uruguay, Mexico, Argentina regularly play friendlies in South America, Asia and Europe..

[blackNwhites]

Of those 4 times how many were competitive matches? Erm 0..

I didn't ask how many times Argentina have beaten England, I asked how many times England have beaten Argentina.. In my lifetime it's 1-1.. Funny how you fail to mention the others..

England only compete in two tournaments.. Mexico in 3..

Of the Gold Cup the past 2 tournaments have been a breeze for Mexico as only Costa Rica, Hondouras and The US pose only problems..

But before that Brazil, Columbia and Uruguay have all entered.. Mexico beat a Brazilian side that featured Adriano, Kaka, Maicon, Robinho, Julio Baptista, Alex, Diego, Luisao twice in the same tournament before lifting the 2003 Gold Cup.. Their record against Brazil in comnpetitive matches is fantastic.. Only a top top team can have a record as good as that..

England have a better chance of winning the Copa America than The Euros? Is that a joke? Given that Spain in 2010 is the only European team to win a WC outside of Europe and Englands finest players have miserably failed when playing majors in South America you honestly believe they'd have a better chance.. England couldn't even win the Euros oin home soil when The Czech Republic made the final not to mention Greece winning possibly the poorest Euros in history in 2004.. Where was England then?

I know you're not saying England are a good team, we both know they're not.. But don't rubbish Mexicos achievements which are clearly far better than Englands over the past 20 years..

If England were to play Mexico now at the Azteca I'd stick a lot of money on a Mexican victory.. England only do well in friendlies at Wembley.. Another problem we have.. When was the last time England actually prepared for a WC and do some travelling to better climatise.. The likes of Brazil, Uruguay, Mexico, Argentina regularly play friendlies in South America, Asia and Europe..

England V Argentina record.

Won - 6

Drawn - 6

Lost - 2

England have beaten them in their last two meetings.

I'm not belittling Mexico's achievements, you're inflating them. I'd like to find a middle ground with you one day Bris, I feel we'll get there anyway.

I wouldn't mind England following a similar model to that of Mexico and Belgium, not neccessarily the same strategy of football but from the grass roots up. Less foreign investment would be nice aswell, give football back to the community. Just out of interest, how many foreigners play in Mexican football? Which Mexican players are fairing well in foreign leagues?

You're right about England as poor travelers, deffo, I don't know why they won't travel. Oh yeah, I do, the money! That's why (the money), one day, I'll happily say Mexico are a better footballing nation than England.

[DCFCfranco]

Mexico are ****