Alph

And then you've got the crown prince of Saudi Arabia pretending he cares. Research him. Nice bloke. The Saudis are dangling the carrot to Israel. The "peace corridor". Kerching! They won't mind the leverage they'd gain over Iran either. This is why there will never be peace. American allies, Iran, Saudi, Russia.... They play chess like this.

Sheeet, there's common ground there. 🤣 🤣

An Israeli lawyer. I'm good mate. Honestly. I could post UN resolutions and votes. Their appeals to ICJ. The ruling on Israel's wall by the ICJ and the objections by Israel's allies. Israel has failed to show to hearings and has ratified but not signed certain agreements. The Rome Statute for example was no longer supported by USA, Russia and Israel. This is all besides the general human decency you shouldn't be looking for loopholes in to take land that belongs to other people. Innocent people living off that land. Not Hamas. Not Israel. Just people. But we are going around in circles here. I don't want to argue with someone with such extreme views. My view isn't extreme. I don't deny Israel's existence. I don't deny it's right to defend itself. I don't deny it exists in a hostile part of the world. I don't deny it's the most democratic nation. I just despise the condition it forces on Palestinians. Not Hamas, but Palestinians.

I answered you. Calm down. But I've argued with Zionists before and this is similar. You reach a point where they can't see anything but you as antisemetic, Gaza as a terrorist breeding ground, occupied land as their rightful land by ancient text and fully support Netenyahu. These are the type of people in Netenyahu's party who say that all Palestinians are complicit and an even harder approach should be taken. I can't argue with that. That's like arguing against Hamas who want Israel wiped from the map. It's extremes. I can't continue to argue with you when you say "disputed land" and keep claiming everyone is motivated by a hatred of Jews. I just have to be like , ok. Whatever. No point trying to convince you. @Revposted a video which was pretty balanced. Showed some understanding of Israel's threats. I said before, I'm not biased because I'm Arab or Muslim. I'm biased because I see the disproportionate suffering. If somehow balanced was restored and tipped the other way then I'd be supporting Israel's right to exist under Arab threat. If I'm anti anything then I'm anti American foreign policy. They're responsible for so much destabilization. Russia too but they're obviously less successful than America at pursuing their goal. There's not much more I can say to you now. I think that covers everything and it's become like the nonsense arguments between a Muslim who denies Israel's entire existence and a Zionist Jew. Not as extreme. But you get the gist

The waving of Palestinian flags and the support of Palestine has drawn millions of eyes to the conflict. It's exposed hypocrisy. Belgium deputy PM has called for sanctions. Blinken has started back tracking. Macron has done a 180°. There's more pressure on Israel now than any of their numerous operations (all of which I named and dated) in Gaza and more importantly West Bank. That's the important part too. Your first point is utter nonsense. Israel will keep being Israel regardless of flag waving in Europe. They've never stopped. But when several countries remove embassies it sends a message. Also, Saudi Arabia, the morally bankrupt regime that Israel want to reach, have had to cool relations with Israel due to the regional pressure. But again, you're more upset over protests than what's happening. That is funny. There are protests and calls for a general election in Israel. Kind of important. They stand up for dead kids more than you do. You're just crying about protests. Your second point..... Wow. Again it takes us back to "it's not occupied land it's disputed land like any other in the world"..... I can't argue with you. It's Netenyahu levels of insanity. I could go and show you exactly what Israel and America have and more importantly haven't signed. Go Google it yourself. Some interesting omissions. Your last point. That uglier is not an option. I'm afraid it very much is. I don't support it. But history shows what happens when governments and population have strong differing views. When a powerful military faces a weaker force. It's not beyond any race or religion. I'm not advocating it. I'm telling you it's a fact. The Suffragettes used bombs and Arson. Jews bombed King David Hotel. America funds terrorists groups. We've been over this. Governments, whether foreign or domestic, very rarely surrender to the will of the people if they ask nicely. Flag waving in this case is the only peaceful way to show the government what the population think. Now, I'm not a big fan of arguing with you because you make such points that I've genuinely not encountered from Israeli Jews. Some of those don't even attempt to appear like they're neutral. And you kind of have to respect that. They just want to be safe and not face what their ancestors have. They wouldn't say disputed land. They'd say occupied land or even land that belongs to them by ancient text. They'd argue why they need to take it. They'd say Gaza is a terrorists breeding ground. Not pretend they give a toss. And they'd vote Netenyahu. However a lot of Israeli Jews are protesting. A lot of Jews in the world are calling it exactly like Pro Palestinians. But you? You haven't spoken up for Gaza once. Certainly not as much as you've claimed everyone is antisemetic or that Protesters are the major problem here. Earlier you were annoyed that I incited violence against politicians because I edited a post (then didn't reply when I told you what I edited and it can probably be verified by a mod). It seems everything bothers you more than dead people in West Bank or Gaza.

Cuckoo

Yeah that's what I'm getting at. A peaceful City that never started a war just so happened to become a great empire overthrowing another empire but always justified it with peace and self defence. Even the first Punic War. They saw it as a defence. Coming to the aid of the Mamertines (pretty sickening) because they were concerned about Carthaginian expansion into Sicily and Southern Italy. It's 2023 and we still have nations reaching across the world to find reasons to "defend". One nation in particular frequently finds reasons to go to war or fund conflicts that are "just". Sometimes even fabricating entire events to enter conflict. Hitler, Putin.... Has any villain ever started a war that wasn't based on "defence" or "national security". I guess it's just our nature. But I wish America had been called out more. And didn't have nations like Britain that will support them even when they're lying and destabilizing regions to suit their imperial goals.

This made me laugh. I've not watched it but I can only imagine that they answer is freedom of speech, freedom of religion and freedom of expression? I wish somebody would tell Stephen, sorry, Tommy I mean, that his country isn't under attack. What does "England Til I Die" even mean? What's England to him? I know there has to be a balance to everything and we live in times where there is always a justice crusade. But I don't even know what point he's trying to make. Their message is "ceasefire" and "free Palestine".... yours is what, Tommy?

Then I thought you'd be supportive or tolerant of the vast majority of protesters calling for a ceasefire and a solution. It seems to me that it's mostly people who refuse to ask Israel to stop such as Suella Braverman are the only ones that are focusing on the thugs that tag along. How else do you influence the government's to stop supporting what Israel are doing? There is another way to force governments to negotiate. But it's even uglier. If there's silence from the public then nothing will change. I mean, it won't change anyway and when we do suddenly manage to force a ceasefire on Israel it will be conveniently too late. And Hamas will STILL exist. Israel had a huge opportunity on the 7th to make the most of the sympathy. Despite their role in a much longer wider conflict it would have been difficult to paint them a villain to your average Joe. But Netenyahu and is mob are no better than Hamas. They ARE Hamas. But they only have to press buttons to kill Palestinians.

I know right. Rome was such peaceful state because it was against their religion to take part in any war unless in self preservation. Obviously that extended to allies. Allies often offered little benefit to Rome and only reluctantly dragged them into wars with the Carthaginian Empire. 2 wars later and the Carthaginians were in a treaty that left them in ruin. They lost their colonies, their military was restricted and they had to pay tribute to Rome. Pretty similar to where Germany found itself when Hitler became so influential, think? Some Roman alliances were not only of no benefit but Rome would have to pay them! Support them! And then defend them in disputes with neighbours. But Rome was a democracy. And allowed many provinces local autonomy. Infact the earliest photograph we have is of such a provincial governor. Tonius Blairius

I wish they'd just focus on putting pressure on leaders to demand a ceasefire. It's the right thing to do. What number does Sunak have in his head that's the limit of Palestinian losses? What point are Hamas defeated? Do we need the leader of Hamas to "surrender"?

I do love the parallels between the Roman Republic and American foreign policy. Starting wars was forbidden in Rome. It had to be a "just war".

That's one you could start. But right now I think a lot people believe that what's happening in Gaza is a war crime and the work of an Apartheid Zionist regime carrying out Ethnic cleansing. There's thousands of people in the dark trying to pick people out of rubble. People with injuries that can't be treated. People that have no food, water and are unable to flee. People that are critically ill. I think widespread calls for a ceasefire are a good thing. Even if idiots that don't know what they're talking about are jumping on a trend, I would say that it's still pretty ok to be against the indiscriminate bombing of a fenced in area the size of Glasgow where the average age is 18. I hope the protests continue to be carried out peacefully (I know we've had some exceptions but on the whole hundreds of thousands including Jews have marched peacefully) The fact the protests are now more of a talking point than what's going on in Gaza and the very rarely mentioned West Bank (where 180 people have also been killed) is pretty sad.

There is no light at the end of the tunnel for Palestinians. They're very much in the way. And Iran etc quite like that. While there's angry Palestinians then there will always be a resistance for Iran to tap into. And there will always be angry Palestinians because of Israel. So for those people there will never be a happy ending. It's always interesting though when people are more angry about a protest for a ceasefire than they are about the conditions in the region that are suffering.

Is your first name Tony?

Good find mate. I was dubious with it being Australian as their coverage seems like the work of Suella Braverman. Can't say I "enjoyed" it but you know what I mean. It was pretty fair.

A European country has slipped it's leash. Belgium deputy PM wants sanctions on Israel and to ban products from occupied territories. Nothing about banning them from Eurovision. It's not that bad. Will America stand for this? They'll be no chocolate in Washington this Christmas. Tell her how it works John

Yeah I know you're going to get idiots all over the place coming out. That's why I'm not sure why we're talking about them. They're a minority. Feck em

When I posted Israel was a disgusting Apartheid regime I never actually thought all Israelis were evil. *Logic*

I'm guessing we'll go down the "temporary" settlements for Palestinians somewhere out of the way while Israel work on stabilizing the region? Definitely definitely not occupy. That's where it will go. Just need as much carnage so that the Palestinians don't come back. But they're now dying to starvation and are fighting each other for food. So the "temporary" camps might not be very big

I think Blinken and Biden are absolutely full of s***. They probably didn't expect the world to react as it has thinking everyone would swallow the narrative. But unfortunately for them it comes so close to Ukraine/Russia that there's some blatant hypocrisy. I think it's just lip service. Eventually they'll talk Israel into ceasefire but unfortunately Palestinians will have to go live in Sinai or internment camps while the region undergoes a rebuild. That will be the official line. But the camps will be permanent. Israel will definitely drag their feet. And wait for the next uprising. I don't think it matters if it's Republican or Democrat... The foreign policy always seems pretty much the same. Obama at least talked about Palestinians like they were human from what I remember. Trump of course did his best to goad them. Is Trump likely to get back in? Jeez. He'll have them levelling Lebanon!

I wonder if her telling people how desperate the situation is in Gaza will hit home more than Palestinian diplomats and Queen Rania etc. I hope so. European leaders should hear her and then go look in the mirror. Ask if this is what they truly think is right

It's a horrible thought that so many leaders in Europe are just lapdogs. Whatever your take on the entire conflict, is there anybody on this forum or anywhere that thinks Israel's attack on Gaza is justified? Why are Jews in Israel more sympathetic to Gaza than Sunak and European leaders? Why are the people calling for a ceasefire the problem here? The idea that this is destroying Hamas but nobody can explain how it destroys Hamas. We're definitely saying that the safety of Israeli's is more important than the safety of Palestinians. An Israeli life is worth more than a Palestinian one. I guess we don't know by how much yet. The people who question the integrity and motives of those demanding ceasefire, such as Nadine Dorres, come out with a straight face and say "but these numbers are released by the Gaza health ministry which is controlled by Hamas." Ok Nadine. Let's roll with that. Let's say the numbers have been doubled. Does 2,000 dead children make it right? What about 1,000? 100? Let's say 100 children have died. 100 children have died for how many Hamas militants? The Dunblane Massacre? Remember that? If it had served a more noble goal then would we be ok with that? I suppose if these kids are faces on the other side of the world that you don't have to look at then it's easy to say "collateral damage". The real thugs are the ones calling for a ceasefire. She's crying more about "From the River To the Sea" than dead kids.

BlackRock and Vanguard. I've seen somebody on here talk about them before. Might have been you but also I think maybe @Srg. If my memory serves I mean it just takes us back to what we know anyway. This isn't about destroying Hamas. Any idiot can see that this wouldn't destroy Hamas. But nobody who defends Israel at every turn wants consider what else it's about. American Imperialism. Always. The war mongering, arms trading, empire building world police. They admit it. Biden admitted it in 1986. Netenyahu... Props up Hamas, talks about "Peace Corridors" and "nuclear threat to (oil rich) Iran. Israel. The American key to the middle east. @uttoxram75has posted 3 times in this thread the goldmine Palestinians are blocking. Which is why if Hamas surrendered tomorrow there would still be Israeli provocation. Another enemy to provoke America would appear. Even if they have to make one up. Again. Because America needs an 'in'. I mean they're not the only player of course. Usually there's Russian influence to oppose them. We're all fighting in these b******* ever lasting chess game. They've got to control everything.

Last I saw of James Schneider was when he wasn't even allowed to speak when Nadine something or other just wanted spout off on a nonsense rant which was one of the most ignorant piece of coverage you'll see on this conflict. He took it like a champ but he clearly was only there to be beat up by arse lickers. I only see GB News when I visit my uncle so it's the same show every week. And it's usually something like "Are our borders open to terrorists" and "Housing crisis cripples hard working British people". And then you get people who look like they've never been outside ranting about the collapse of Britain.