I'M SO ANGRY WITH CLOUGH

[Boycie]

Maybe he'll understand why there's no atmosphere at Pride Park?

[curb]

Below the average age of the average rocket scientist though.

[ilkleyram]

well I do like Nigel and I'm not angry with him.

I like anyone who so clearly has a passion for my club and wants us to do well and puts so much effort into trying to make us better. There aren't too many managers who would make their way to Barnet on a midweek evening (with all of his management team) to watch the under 18s in a cup match they were supposed to lose. And by all accounts this is what he has being doing since he came. And this is but one example of his comittment to building the club from the bottom.

Of course he makes mistakes. Which of us doesn't? Of course he would like us to be better. Which of us doesn't want that?

But he is limited in what he can do not least by circumstances and the current football world.

Today it is reported that Manure are interested in paying £29m for some unknown Argentinian. £29m! How much is your mortgage? What would the repayments be on that figure? What are the chances of our club ever being able to pay out that amount on a single player never mind the team. Even Robbie Savage's £100m wouldn't go very far. And with such figures go wages to match.

And it's no use saying that our owners are all multi-millionnaires - they may well be. Or they may not be. Whatever. They don't want to build the club that way. They want to build us slowly however frustrating that may be to us or to Nigel. That's why they hired Nigel, because that is what he did with Burton. And why they haven't sacked him on several occasions over the last couple of seasons when they have had plenty of opportunity to do so.

So we will wheel and deal; we will develop and play 15 year olds; we will try to find youngsters from lower league clubs; some will work and some will not and Nigel will make mistakes along the way. We may buy the occasional experienced player (just like Nigel wanted to earlier this season); we will take some financial risks - just like we are doing now with our wages over budget. But we won't completely overstretch the club financially.

And given the financial state of play of a number of clubs, including our own over the years; given the new financial rules coming in; given the complete and utter financial mess that Billy and Paul Jewell (yes, and by extension, the board) left us in when we were last in the Premier League, I for one am happier with a more cautious approach. And Nigel has had to sort that mess out.

I like seeing us develop our academy players and I know that eventually that some will move on, like as not; Some won't make it as big as their early promise (just like Steve Powell didn't); I like ball players like James Bailey and the effort of Bryson, the pace and enthusiasm of Jamie Ward or Theo, the effort and committment of Shackell and Barker, the skill of Brayford. I like knowing that we are in a better place than we were three and four years ago, that we are, slowly, moving forward.

As it happens i hate the Premier league, and the Champions league and players on squillions a year for kicking a ball around. I hate the lack of UK players in the PL and whole teams with no English players in them; I hate the fact that only 4 teams have won the PL and a generation are growing up believing that all the nonsense is what always happened. I hate sitting and not standing and the diminution of the FA cup. I hate the fact that my son will probably never see us win the foremost league in the country (twice) or get to the semi-final of a proper European competition (and be cheated out of the final) as I did. And I don't want him to see us in the High Court or the third division for two seasons, as I have done.

But Nigel I like. His voice might be dull on television, but that's not the worse sin in the world. Be careful about wishing him away (though he will go one day); be careful about wishing the board away (and they will go one day too). Their successors are not necessarily better. We, above all, should know that from our history.

[smiffy]

Boy thats at least two Kindle pages worth. 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':D' />

[ilkleyram]

must get shorter, Smiffy. Apologies 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':D' />

[blackNwhites]

This isn't a Clough out thread. It's the obligatory moan thread. I suppose the the thread title victimises Clough a little bit, but he is by no means the only thing to moan about with DCFC's lack of progress atm, except for the younguns.

Good read though sir. Good point well made.

[AndyB]

That's a very sensible summary of our current situation. I just wish the board would at least give us a reasonable budget to compete with, especially when we've got ourselves into decent positions as we have in the last two seasons.

[uttoxram75]

Open letter to Mr. Nigel Clough.

Dear Nige,

The next month or so will probably decide the future course that DCFC will take. I believe the majority of the core support of our club have shown patience and understanding of the financial constraints laid down by the owners and realised that there is no magic wand, no sugar daddy to buy the dream.

Fair enough, Forest are no better than us despite huge investment from Doughty over the last few years.

The problem is though, the fans are close to a tipping point. We don't expect to be challenging Manchester City or Barcelona any time soon, we are not demanding automatic promotion.

What we want Nige, is a spark, a flash of excitement, we want to go to Pride Park and feel, well, pride. We understand it must be hellishly difficult to try and build a squad capable of challenging for promotion without actually spending any money and slashing the wage bill at the same time.

The injuries have been absolutely unbelievable, we've not always had the rub of the green, but that's life, that's football.

What we want is a mindset that says, "WE ARE DERBY, COME TO PRIDE PARK AND WE WILL ATTACK YOU FOR 90 MINUTES, WHOEVER YOU ARE".

Play without fear, accept that we may not be the best team in the League but lay down a marker that Derby County will try their very best to entertain their fans from kick off to the final whistle.

Make us different Nige, throw away the accepted norms of playing percentages and go for it. If we lose, we lose, but by fook make the other team work for it!

If we can't put a team together to get promoted then lets at least play like we think we can.

You'll lose the fans if we carry on like this mate. Like I say, we accept the board are not gonna finance silly signings or stupid wages, so give us summat else. Give us a team that will "go for it", home and away, without fear. If we lose 4-3, so what. You will soon find that the "12th man" will roar us on to victory when its close.

We need some ooomph from you and the team Nige. We need a reason to believe. The owners aren't gonna do it, so its down to you I'm afraid.

Respect from a life long Ram.

[blackNwhites]

2 strong points well made!

[rammieib]

That and the fact we are run by a board whose only invested interest in us in being the forefront of their own company, whilst the owners are thousands of miles away never even attending games, and once again that they are doing a good job.

And I'm fairly sure that everytime one of those invested in the club does come over, I bet Derby are paying a Business/First Class Air fare for them!

To Ilklyram - Sensible post but reading it, I just can't help but feel you are another one of the fans who just seems happy with mid-table football. That was the impression I got reading it.

I don't see any improvement since when Clough started. I see nothing on the pitch, in the coaching and improvement of players or off the field which warrants me supporting Clough or GSE. I will support the players on a Saturday but I will also boo as its one of the only limited legal ways to vent my frustration at Clough/GSE.

I don't want to be an average club playing in a poor league when I feel we should be a Premier League Club playing in the best league in the world.

Fianlly - I do believe that a number of managers would work their socks off for our club and would travel the length and breadth of the country to watch under 18's, reserve games and 1st team games. No dsirespect but apart from their own personal time, it nots like they are paying for it themselves - oh and I bet Clough is taking home £4k a week minimum!

[drgoodspeak]

He talks about "not losing" too much. He seems to care more about "not losing" than "winning".

I think you're spot on. Just been looking at the latest response to a match and Clough is outraged at a decision that cost us a point. There just does not seem to be any winning drive. He constantly comes across as head down, let's make the best of it etc. Is his interview performance any different from his management or coaching style? If not, this could be a deep, deep problem that only a change of management staff can resolve.

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

The most depressing thing for me is that fans have become happy that we are competing for a MID table finish and that we should expect no more.

That and the fact we are run by a board whose only invested interest in us in being the forefront of their own company, whilst the owners are thousands of miles away never even attending games, and once again that they are doing a good job.

I don't know if you mean me Leeds or not but I don't think any Derby fans are happy that we are competing for a mid table finish. We all want improvement it's just a matter of the route to achieve that success. Yesterday I saw Portsmouth vs Southampton on telly. Now THAT was a load of rubbish. We are no worse than the top team. The only thing we don't have is someone scoring like Ricky Lambert. Is Tyson going to do it for us? .............I hope so.

I understand those who say his goal scoring record at Forest was rubbish but by all accounts we intend to play him down the middle. He is a big fast lad who, if he comes good, could improve our goal threat no end. Personally I still get a buzz from anticipating success. It must be a miserable world when the glass is always only half full.

[ramesses]

If I post in this thread does it mean I want Clough out? Because I don't. Just want him to change a few things. It's a safe place yeah?

Some players get 2 or 3 appearances to prove they're not rubbish. Others get 20. Like Daveo says. The "naughty step" is ridiculous.

He talks about "not losing" too much. He seems to care more about "not losing" than "winning".

Derby are surely the shortest, least aggressive team in the second tier. This is England. Not Italy or Spain. there's contact. Just.

That's it really. All can be sorted.

+1

By the way, it’s never really safe on here. As the moment, daveo’s being held hostage in the protected zone and the mods are fighting behind the scenes for control of the Big Button. It’s brutal.

[Gary Teale]

I don't know if you mean me Leeds or not but I don't think any Derby fans are happy that we are competing for a mid table finish. We all want improvement it's just a matter of the route to achieve that success. Yesterday I saw Portsmouth vs Southampton on telly. Now THAT was a load of rubbish. We are no worse than the top team. The only thing we don't have is someone scoring like Ricky Lambert. Is Tyson going to do it for us? .............I hope so.

I understand those who say his goal scoring record at Forest was rubbish but by all accounts we intend to play him down the middle. He is a big fast lad who, if he comes good, could improve our goal threat no end. Personally I still get a buzz from anticipating success. It must be a miserable world when the glass is always only half full.

At least your not judging Southampton on one match.

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

At least your not judging Southampton on one match.

No I'm not. These days I live down south and have seen/heard quite a bit of them.

[The Scarlet Pimpernel]

Manure who are they? Show some respect its either United or Manchester United, it diminishes the impact of the rest of your post when you include childish names for other clubs (even Forest).

I understand the main points in the post but the club is not building slowly it is declining slowly. Despite the cost-cutting money is still been lost and we are nowhere near the best placed club as regards this FFP as many are led to believe on here. Leeds for example are already in profit.

Not necessarily Ianm. Just to remind everyone, we are just 7 points from Leeds in 6th place. We have had a terrible run and struggled yet again with some key injuries. If we go on another run similar to earlier in the season we could easily find ourselves in and around the top 6. I am optimistic we can turn a corner. Obviously some on here don't think we can. It's all about opinion I guess. 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/huh' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':huh:' />

[SillyBilly]

Great post by Uttox.

We're all moaning about the atmosphere but PP can get going when the football is there. We've lost a hell of a lot in the last 3 or 4 years so I don't see the problem in going hell for leather and picking up losses in an entertaining fashion. Any worse than our record over the last 12 months would be relegation so we haven't got too much to live up to. If we're only winning around 30% of matches then clearly either the squad is naff (I think its better than that win percentage) or our approach to the game is costing us. Forget the BS and the fact its been covered to death but I'm very worried about being half a season down and yet to score inside the last 15, it isn't bad luck or coincidence at this stage, we simply haven't wanted it enough.

[inglorious02]

I'm starting to find that I care for the club less as each week goes by, and I've been a season ticket holder since the early 90's. This season is once again starting to follow a similar pattern to previous seasons. I just wish someone at the club would turn around and say "we played **** today. We know we've been **** for months now and we know we have to get better". All we get is Nigel saying that we played well today; even when we haven't, and Mr Glick wittering on about some long term plan that nobody seems to know the details of apart from him.

I can't see how I'm going to be motivated to bung them another £400+ for a season ticket next year.

[ianm]

Not necessarily Ianm. Just to remind everyone, we are just 7 points from Leeds in 6th place. We have had a terrible run and struggled yet again with some key injuries. If we go on another run similar to earlier in the season we could easily find ourselves in and around the top 6. I am optimistic we can turn a corner. Obviously some on here don't think we can. It's all about opinion I guess. 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/huh' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':huh:' />

I wasn't particularly meaning the playing side I expect and have always expected a mid-table finish this year. It would be a surprise to me if we flirt with relegation this year.

I was more talking about income and general interest in the club, especially from younger people. It is a big concern to me at the Junior matches at weekend how many kids these days are wearing clothing of other clubs, this if I am not mistaken is on the increase. This shows to me the club is losing its appeal and all the noises are that there is no money to spend in January.

The fans need a new hero to get behind somebody to reverse the apathy that is building, go in the West Stand on a matchday and you can see how many Season Tickets in the East Stand are not turning up it was Thousands at the Brighton match.

[ANGERMAN1]

Most negative manager ever. Defending draws and 1-0 leads with 20mins to go in the game. Belittling players for making one mistake rather than insisting they will learn from it or it just wasn't quite working for them (Although he says that about a few select players who suck him off). Tactics deployed and way he speaks about the team.

However, Clough than has more optimism than anyone by saying we play well when we are average. His clouded judgement is the theme tune to his career.

His comments the other day contained the quote [size=3]"Somewhere along the line we will play poorly on the road and get our reward" [/size][size=3]He can claim frustration because of how debatable their goal was, but childish comments like this can easily be misconstrued and are unprofessional. Our young, naive team will probably be thinking that they will never get rewarded for good performances or putting in the effort. And have the thought process' of 'Everything is against us'[/size]

[size=3]Clough is a joke...........Please leave.[/size]