public sector workers strike

[davenportram]

Striking while talks are ongoing? The talks have halted and the government offering nothing. Its not negotiations its the govenrment daring them to go on strike.

The only change the government made to offers was the bribe they tried to stop Headteachers and those teachers near the end of their careers with. Namely that those within 10 years of retirement would be unaffected. It says a lot about the value of the principles at stake when headteachers ignored this and went on strike for the first time in the 114 year history of their union.

In my previous job the management did the same to us. Offered a pay deal that wasnt accepted and basically said dare you to go on strike, When the vote came back damn near unanimous for action they crumbled and offered us a deal. Guess what the main sticking point on the pay deal was? yep pensions - they wanted to make overtime pensions non-pensionable which would cost those hard working members of staff who covered for shortages a hell of a lot of money in their retirement.

[Leeds Ram]

I am not referring just to the lack of a days education. People have to look after their kids.Parents had to take time off their own jobs (some without pay) to look after their kids.I am not suggesting that school is a babysitting service before you jump on it.

well sometimes action is necessary, of course the strikers regret the inconvenience it causes because it could turn people against the cause, however they are fighting for their futures and I believe that they deserve to do that for the brilliant job that they do.

[Leeds Ram]

Ancillary staff maybe..

no I know some nurses, healthcare assistants who went on strike as well.

[froggg]

I'm sure no low paid workers take losing a days pay lightly......especially in these harsh economic times

[james_ram]

anyone reading this who is claiming when they could work,

anyone avoiding tax (however unfair),

anyone who says we're all in this together despite obvious privilege and wealth,

anyone who can't see that the coalition are just in it for their voters, sod everyone else,

career criminals,

[size=1]Cough ....forest and they're supporters.......ahem[/size]

[size=1][size=4]These are who should be pilloried........ not hard working teachers and nurses( who didn't strike btw) etc. most nhs workers earn well under £16000 that gives them a massive max £8000 pension only if they work a full 40 years(in the nhs), 20yrs gets a whopping £4000 10yrears £2000[/size][/size] etc.... gold plated eh..... 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sad' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':(' />

Listen to the spin if you can't find the facts out for yourselves..... the nhs staff will be working at christmas while everyone else stuffs turkey down they're gobs....enjoy 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/rolleyes' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rolleyes:' />

Oh and no one needs to envy public workers, get some education and jump on the gravy train yourselves these jobs will always be there/needed 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=';)' />

I think your a bit bitter.

Firstly, the average salary in the NHS is not 16k a year, more like 22-23k a year, secondly, not all NHS staff will be working at Christmas only the ones that are SALARIED to do so, if you don't believe me, try and find a GP on Christmas Day.

You say that the coalition are only in it for voters? Aren't all politicians in for the voters? After all, that's how they get their jobs. 'http://www.dcfcfans.co.uk/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wacko' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':wacko:' />

I said it earlier on in this thread and I'll say it again, we as a nation have dined on credit for the last 15 years, we're in a mess financially, we need to reduce our deficit and get this country growing again, the government has to make tough but understandable decisions to do so as unfortunately our economy is a slave to the markets, and our banks are heavily exposed to everything that's going on in Europe. Be thankful you have a job instead of moaning about pensions all the time, most private sector workers don't even have one.

[Leeds Ram]

actually our banks compared to the rest of Europe are well capitalized and relatively safe, I am not saying they aren't at risk but certainly not as badly as french or german banks as far as I am aware. Also the plan to reduce the deficit is flawed, the problem with Osbournes credit card analogy is that a country is far more complex than a household. His cuts have caused us to go backwards and borrow more therefore increasing the deficit, therefore cutting harshly can be more expensive than more mild cutting and mild spending. The country won't grow properly for a while, even the OBR predictions in 2013-2015 are reliant upon the eurozone being fine and dandy which in reality won't happen.

[Leeds Ram]

the argument that private sector pensions are even worse than public ones is true, but that doesn't mean you should settle for a crap pension and bring public sector workers down with you.

[froggg]

I'm not bitter pal just deal in the fact's.......if your ill on xmas day someone probably on less than a tenner an hour will be sorting you out..

[james_ram]

actually our banks compared to the rest of Europe are well capitalized and relatively safe, I am not saying they aren't at risk but certainly not as badly as french or german banks as far as I am aware. Also the plan to reduce the deficit is flawed, the problem with Osbournes credit card analogy is that a country is far more complex than a household. His cuts have caused us to go backwards and borrow more therefore increasing the deficit, therefore cutting harshly can be more expensive than more mild cutting and mild spending. The country won't grow properly for a while, even the OBR predictions in 2013-2015 are reliant upon the eurozone being fine and dandy which in reality won't happen.

The banks balance sheets are poor though, hence why Mervyn King injected 70bn into them last month. Yes, we've borrowed more, but we were left in dire straits by the last government that he had too, borrowing will fall in the next few years, year on year, his plan will come to fruition eventually. And the Eurozone CAN be 'fine and dandy' as you put it, they just need to accept responsibility and make some tough decisions, the majority of them haven't yet realised what a mess they are be in, or in Greece's case they just fiddle their accounts. That's why Osborne and the other finance ministers need to put continued pressure on them.

[james_ram]

the argument that private sector pensions are even worse than public ones is true, but that doesn't mean you should settle for a crap pension and bring public sector workers down with you.

Have you ever heard of saving?

[james_ram]

I'm not bitter pal just deal in the fact's.......if your ill on xmas day someone probably on less than a tenner an hour will be sorting you out..

You deal in the facts? Everything you said was either a fabrication of the truth or an opinion. Fact of the matter is, salaried Nurses will be working on Christmas day, as it's in their contract, as will plenty of other people both in the public AND the private sector.

[Leeds Ram]

The banks balance sheets are poor though, hence why Mervyn King injected 70bn into them last month. Yes, we've borrowed more, but we were left in dire straits by the last government that he had too, borrowing will fall in the next few years, year on year, his plan will come to fruition eventually. And the Eurozone CAN be 'fine and dandy' as you put it, they just need to accept responsibility and make some tough decisions, the majority of them haven't yet realised what a mess they are be in, or in Greece's case they just fiddle their accounts. That's why Osborne and the other finance ministers need to put continued pressure on them.

the banks balance sheets in this country are actually not that bad, the main reason why the quantitative easing was undertaken was because project merlin had fallen on it's bum and it was an attempt for banks to boost a balance sheet and lend money with more confidence, that failed as well. The borrowing went up 4 fold with the bank bailout which was essential, growth was better in the last quarter of 2009 which was a positive sign of labour taking steps to grow our way out of it. The borrowing is conditional upon the economy growing as Osbourne thinks, this won't necessarily happen by the way. He was out by almost 2% this year, next year slower growth and as the OBR says the 2013-2015 predictions which are similar to what they predicted for this year are reliant upon the eurozone being stable, there is no evidence for that. Deep austerity cuts like you suggest would plunge the eurozone into recession and damage us as well, so even your course of action would put us in trouble.

We are borrowing 156 billion more than osbourne said this year alone, even by the end of the parliament we will still be borrowing 27 billion according to Osbournes figures which frankly can be construed as wildly optimistic and unreliable just like the ones before this year. Economic forecasts 2 years into the future or more are unreliable because so much relies upon confidence, stability, monetary supply and other factors, the reports into the future are educated guesses.

[Leeds Ram]

Have you ever heard of saving?

yes strangely i have.

[Dangerous]

Striking while talks are ongoing? The talks have halted and the government offering nothing. Its not negotiations its the govenrment daring them to go on strike.

The only change the government made to offers was the bribe they tried to stop Headteachers and those teachers near the end of their careers with. Namely that those within 10 years of retirement would be unaffected. It says a lot about the value of the principles at stake when headteachers ignored this and went on strike for the first time in the 114 year history of their union.

In my previous job the management did the same to us. Offered a pay deal that wasnt accepted and basically said dare you to go on strike, When the vote came back damn near unanimous for action they crumbled and offered us a deal. Guess what the main sticking point on the pay deal was? yep pensions - they wanted to make overtime pensions non-pensionable which would cost those hard working members of staff who covered for shortages a hell of a lot of money in their retirement.

If you believe everything the union tell you then you are a fool.They lie just as much as the politicians do.Our union (CWU) are at times disgraceful in representation.

As a unit they are useless,the only reason I and a lot of my other colleagues stay in is if a personal case arises.When they try to represent the office as a whole they are invisible or as useful as clough.

[ladyram]

If you believe everything the union tell you then you are a fool.They lie just as much as the politicians do.Our union (CWU) are at times disgraceful in representation.

As a unit they are useless,the only reason I and a lot of my other colleagues stay in is if a personal case arises.When they try to represent the office as a whole they are invisible or as useful as clough.

Well seeing as though Dav is a former Union branch secretary, I'll take his word for it. He knows his onions alright and no, he doesn't lie. Could that be your own perception of them?

[Boycie]

I was in a union once. They take your money and say they'll look after you.

******.

I was layed off and thought I was due more Leau of notice. I rang the union, they said it was correct. Fact was, I found out it was wrong, and got another 2 weeks money.

I left the union. They love strikes, it justifies there own existence. Truth is, strikes never win. They are old hat, gone with the dinosaurs.

Now, strikes in France, they are proper strikes. They mean business.

Keep joggin.

[davenportram]

All I can say Boycie is you must have had a crap union rep.

I was rep for 14 people at my workplace and each and every one moaned about the job I was doing until I got them a bit of extra overtime, or a sickness wiped off their record. Some still moaned so I suggested they take over and do all the work I was doing voluntarily.

Still in your case they should have done more and I did when it happened to

my colleagues

(null)

[Boycie]

Who's (null) ffs?

[Boycie]

All I can say Boycie is you must have had a crap union rep.

I was rep for 14 people at my workplace and each and every one moaned about the job I was doing until I got them a bit of extra overtime, or a sickness wiped off their record. Some still moaned so I suggested they take over and do all the work I was doing voluntarily.

Still in your case they should have done more and I did when it happened to

my colleagues

(null)

14?

Anybody can stand up for their workmates in a small firm without having to be paid for out of subs.

Would you have gone on strike?

Would I have gone on strike at my old firm with 20 odd sparks? (I'll do the jokes). No. Why? Cause they would have just said there's no more contracts to work on, and on your way.

My dads a massive union man. So DUNNA tell him I've been dissin his old union.

Apart from that, employment tribunals help workers out a lot now days.

[Leeds Ram]

I think the criticism your leveling is fair boycie, this isn't a criticism against the idea of unions just how they work at the moment. Strikes can work, if coordinated effectively for a long enough period, sadly this does not happen.