Electric Vehicles

[kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong]

2 minutes ago, TimRam said:

Careful of pedestrians in carparks. One was at my shoulder before I knew it was there. My hearing is good. Quite a shock to be honest.

They have all had sound generators fitted as standard for the past 3 years or so,the problem generally is that pedestrians and especially old people don't recognise the sound as they are tuned to conventional engine noises.

Edited May 29 by kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong

[Gaspode]

43 minutes ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said:

Smoother,quieter,quicker...there's no comparison to be honest,try and have a drive of one if you can,it will open your eyes mate.

Smoother? - 8-speed auto box - can't feel gear changes at all

Quieter? - my car has this clever stuff called sound-proofing - other than initial start-up, it's hard to hear the engine during normal driving

Quicker? - 0-60 in 7.5 seconds - loads of torque for 30-70 acceleration - and a top speed of 140pmh - that's quick enough for most folk

Additionally, I have a genuine (not hopeful as most EVs are quoted) range of 550-600 miles on a tank full - and if I need to re-fill, there are numerous petrols stations where I can get back on the road in less than 10 minutes rather than the hour or so an EV driver needs if they're lucky enough to find a suitable charging point that's not already occupied - and I don't need to spend my journey watching a gauge to see how far I have left before I have to turn off the air-con or the stereo so that I don't end up stranded at the side of the road. Plus, if I keep the car until it's 8 years old, I won't need to splash out £10K on a replacement battery....

I actually quite like the concept of an EV, but I won't be looking for one for at least 5 years due to the genuine range issues and because the infrastructure is so lacking - though hopefully by then, we'll be looking at fuel-cells or other alternative power sources and so these concerns will no longer be an issue.

You early adopter Ecovangelists can do your best to sell them to us luddites but you need to remember that the current offerings are only suitable for a certain proportion of the population and are simply not practical for the majority (and why haven't the government mandated every new parking space and every new build house to have EV charging built-in if they really want to push take-up? - maybe they're hedging their bets on something 'better' coming along?.....)

[Archied]

34 minutes ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said:

Since I retired,I've delivered new cars on a part time basis (about a 50 percent mix of petrols and electric cars,very,very rarely a diesel) and despite my initial scepticism,I've found that the British charging infrastructure is actually now very good and improving on a weekly basis.

I regularly deliver from 150 to 300 miles away with just a comfort break every couple of hours which allows a 30 minutes top up charge whilst I'm there.

The trouble is,that the media are perpetrating myths that don't stand up anymore about ev's but it's all the public have to go on

I started my journey with a plug in hybrid three years ago but having found that I use electric 90 percent of the time,we are moving to a full EV in a couple of months (polestar 2 or Hyundai ioniq 5 most probably as they are my favourite cars to deliver)

It’s the opposite with me , I find the media are far more positive on ev s than myths to stop people buying , I get a better true picture from people I know who have bought them and there are positives and negatives, at this point the negatives are too much for what I want a car for🤷🏻‍♂️

[Ram-Alf]

1 hour ago, GboroRam said:

Hyundai Kona 64Kw.

200bhp, not that I drive fast but far better pick up than my Clio GT.

Top speed 102, which sounds puny but even in Germany I won't go over a ton on the autobahn. 

Bargain. I was looking at a hateful, evil tesla but with all the extras and dealer sleight of hand, a 290 monthly payment turned out to be over 400 on PCP. I ended up with a HP of 345 per month. Happy motorist here. 

Serious question, Does the faster you go in an EV reduce the battery life on one charge...ie reduces your 300miles per charge?

[Ghost of Clough]

14 minutes ago, Ram-Alf said:

Serious question, Does the faster you go in an EV reduce the battery life on one charge...ie reduces your 300miles per charge?

I only had a Corsa, but there was a sharp drop if going above 60mph. Below that the range was fairly accurate, just like the range given on an ICE car varies slightly.

The other major factor is driving style. Accelerating/decellerating sharply is a waste of charge. If you hypermile already then you'll be fine.

Range also drops a bit if it's cold (maybe noticible when below 5degC?).

[kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong]

2 hours ago, Gaspode said:

Smoother? - 8-speed auto box - can't feel gear changes at all

Quieter? - my car has this clever stuff called sound-proofing - other than initial start-up, it's hard to hear the engine during normal driving

Quicker? - 0-60 in 7.5 seconds - loads of torque for 30-70 acceleration - and a top speed of 140pmh - that's quick enough for most folk

Additionally, I have a genuine (not hopeful as most EVs are quoted) range of 550-600 miles on a tank full - and if I need to re-fill, there are numerous petrols stations where I can get back on the road in less than 10 minutes rather than the hour or so an EV driver needs if they're lucky enough to find a suitable charging point that's not already occupied - and I don't need to spend my journey watching a gauge to see how far I have left before I have to turn off the air-con or the stereo so that I don't end up stranded at the side of the road. Plus, if I keep the car until it's 8 years old, I won't need to splash out £10K on a replacement battery....

I actually quite like the concept of an EV, but I won't be looking for one for at least 5 years due to the genuine range issues and because the infrastructure is so lacking - though hopefully by then, we'll be looking at fuel-cells or other alternative power sources and so these concerns will no longer be an issue.

You early adopter Ecovangelists can do your best to sell them to us luddites but you need to remember that the current offerings are only suitable for a certain proportion of the population and are simply not practical for the majority (and why haven't the government mandated every new parking space and every new build house to have EV charging built-in if they really want to push take-up? - maybe they're hedging their bets on something 'better' coming along?.....)

I don't think you entirely read my post....

I'm a proper petrolhead and have driven the smoothest diesels and petrols you could ever find on the road but none of them,including top end luxury performance cars match a EV in terms of smoothness,refinement and performance on a public road.

A 8 speed gearbox is great but when compared to a new EV which doesn't have gears,there's no comparison.

And,as a person who now delivers cars all around the country,I'm in a great position to actually speak from experience in respect of the charging infrastructure.

In respect of many of your other comments,you appear to be quoting directly from the daily mail and they are simply nonsense for the most part.

EVs are inherently more reliable than combustion engine vehicles,they simply have far fewer moving parts and batteries are proving to last longer than was ever expected...there are Tesla's out there on huge mileages on their original batteries.

Car batteries aren't like phone batteries,they are completely different!

As I say,whether you are a luddite or not,go and get a 24 hour test drive of a modern EV and you will be amazed.

Very,very few people ever go back to fuel burning cars after living with an EV.

[kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong]

1 hour ago, Ram-Alf said:

Serious question, Does the faster you go in an EV reduce the battery life on one charge...ie reduces your 300miles per charge?

Well,just like in a combustion engine car,the more you put your foot down,the more fuel you use.

It doesn't effect the battery life however,if that's what you mean.

The only thing that can reduce a batteries capacity over a long period of time is doing rapid charge after rapid charge,over and over again over a short period of time (rapid chargers are ones you finf on the motorway etc that charge the car in 30 minutes or so,most people charge at home or work on slower chargers which take longer)

Edited May 29 by kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong

[kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong]

2 hours ago, Archied said:

It’s the opposite with me , I find the media are far more positive on ev s than myths to stop people buying , I get a better true picture from people I know who have bought them and there are positives and negatives, at this point the negatives are too much for what I want a car for🤷🏻‍♂️

I don't where you see any positivity in the press archied,you would have more luck finding that Roy Mac had signed up to Paul warnes fan club!

Each to their own re cars,I don't think there has ever been a one size fits all vehicle out there....if you constantly do very long journeys,can't charge at home etc,I wouldn't recommend an EV to you.

[FlyBritishMidland]

10 hours ago, GboroRam said:

Hyundai Kona 64Kw.

200bhp, not that I drive fast but far better pick up than my Clio GT.

Top speed 102, which sounds puny but even in Germany I won't go over a ton on the autobahn. 

Bargain. I was looking at a hateful, evil tesla but with all the extras and dealer sleight of hand, a 290 monthly payment turned out to be over 400 on PCP. I ended up with a HP of 345 per month. Happy motorist here. 

Snap.  I’ve ordered one through the salary sacrifice scheme at work so includes insurance, tyres, etc.  I don’t get free charging but my plan is to switch to the Octopus Go tariff.  It cost about 9p/kWh overnight.  I reckon a charge will last me a week, give or take.  I’ve worked out that with fuel cost saving, no road tax, no insurance it’ll save me about £1600/yr (ish) in running costs.

[Gaspode]

On 29/05/2024 at 11:06, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said:

I don't think you entirely read my post....

I'm a proper petrolhead and have driven the smoothest diesels and petrols you could ever find on the road but none of them,including top end luxury performance cars match a EV in terms of smoothness,refinement and performance on a public road.

A 8 speed gearbox is great but when compared to a new EV which doesn't have gears,there's no comparison.

And,as a person who now delivers cars all around the country,I'm in a great position to actually speak from experience in respect of the charging infrastructure.

In respect of many of your other comments,you appear to be quoting directly from the daily mail and they are simply nonsense for the most part.

EVs are inherently more reliable than combustion engine vehicles,they simply have far fewer moving parts and batteries are proving to last longer than was ever expected...there are Tesla's out there on huge mileages on their original batteries.

Car batteries aren't like phone batteries,they are completely different!

As I say,whether you are a luddite or not,go and get a 24 hour test drive of a modern EV and you will be amazed.

Very,very few people ever go back to fuel burning cars after living with an EV.

As you insist on constantly moving the goalposts with your arguments then this has become a fairly pointless discussion - and patronising comments regarding the daily mail and phone batteries don't do you any credit at all....I'm out.

[TimRam]

On 29/05/2024 at 08:29, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said:

They have all had sound generators fitted as standard for the past 3 years or so,the problem generally is that pedestrians and especially old people don't recognise the sound as they are tuned to conventional engine noises.

In a relatively busy supermarket carpark that could still be an issue. I doubt the sound generator is any where near loud enough.

[TigerTedd]

Worst f****** evening ever:

so I’m racing home from work to get to a school awards ceremony for my daughter. I notice I have 72miles to go and 70 miles of charge.

And there is gridlocked traffic. The one good thing about traffic is that it conserves energy. But I won’t have time to go home first and then go with the family to this ceremony, so I’ll have to go straight to the school. 

that’s fine, I can just about conserve enough energy for that. It’s 7 miles from home, so I might even be able to go home after. Worst come to worst, I’ll find a charger within a couple of miles and get 5 mins charge. 

Ceremony ends, my daughter didn’t win either of the two awards she was nominated for, 3 hours of my life I’ll never get back. 

get in the car and it’s on tortoise mode. Not to worry, I know I’ve still got 2 to 3 miles on tortoise mode, but I’m not going to make it home without a charge. 

I navigate myself to the nearest charger the Electroverse app shows me in a Peugeot pentagon dealership in burton. It’s 2.4 miles away. I make it. 

I try to get it to work for 10 mins, before giving up and calling the 24/7 call line. They remotely reset the machine. But while doing that, they realise that it’s a private machine and can only be used by people from pentagon. 

im furious. Why was it in the app if I can’t use it! If I’d have known, there were other charges I could’ve gone to. But now I know I’m on fumes (or whatever the electric equivalent is, sparks?) the next charger is broken, of course, so the next one is 1.6 miles away.

i navigate to that, and I’m about to make it, it’s 0.5 miles away, and the f****** road is closed. The diversion adds 2 miles. 

so on my car sat nav I notice it’s showing a charger in the Aldi I’m driving past, so I pull a u turn and try to find that. Don’t care if it’s a slow charger at this point.

but I can’t find one. I try the zap map app, and that confirms that there isn’t actually one there, but shows me a different one 0.5 miles away. Down the same stupid closed road.

its 1.6 miles away in the alternative route.

all I can do is go for it and hope. I had 0.2 miles to go when the battery conked out.

the really annoying thing is that the battery actually lasted quite a long time on tortoise mode, I probably could have made it home.

now I’m waiting 2 hrs for breakdown recovery and I won’t be home til after midnight. I’m cold, and tired and hungry. And I want to burn my f****** electric car. 

[Foreveram]

38 minutes ago, TigerTedd said:

Worst f****** evening ever:

so I’m racing home from work to get to a school awards ceremony for my daughter. I notice I have 72miles to go and 70 miles of charge.

And there is gridlocked traffic. The one good thing about traffic is that it conserves energy. But I won’t have time to go home first and then go with the family to this ceremony, so I’ll have to go straight to the school. 

that’s fine, I can just about conserve enough energy for that. It’s 7 miles from home, so I might even be able to go home after. Worst come to worst, I’ll find a charger within a couple of miles and get 5 mins charge. 

Ceremony ends, my daughter didn’t win either of the two awards she was nominated for, 3 hours of my life I’ll never get back. 

get in the car and it’s on tortoise mode. Not to worry, I know I’ve still got 2 to 3 miles on tortoise mode, but I’m not going to make it home without a charge. 

I navigate myself to the nearest charger the Electroverse app shows me in a Peugeot pentagon dealership in burton. It’s 2.4 miles away. I make it. 

I try to get it to work for 10 mins, before giving up and calling the 24/7 call line. They remotely reset the machine. But while doing that, they realise that it’s a private machine and can only be used by people from pentagon. 

im furious. Why was it in the app if I can’t use it! If I’d have known, there were other charges I could’ve gone to. But now I know I’m on fumes (or whatever the electric equivalent is, sparks?) the next charger is broken, of course, so the next one is 1.6 miles away.

i navigate to that, and I’m about to make it, it’s 0.5 miles away, and the f****** road is closed. The diversion adds 2 miles. 

so on my car sat nav I notice it’s showing a charger in the Aldi I’m driving past, so I pull a u turn and try to find that. Don’t care if it’s a slow charger at this point.

but I can’t find one. I try the zap map app, and that confirms that there isn’t actually one there, but shows me a different one 0.5 miles away. Down the same stupid closed road.

its 1.6 miles away in the alternative route.

all I can do is go for it and hope. I had 0.2 miles to go when the battery conked out.

the really annoying thing is that the battery actually lasted quite a long time on tortoise mode, I probably could have made it home.

now I’m waiting 2 hrs for breakdown recovery and I won’t be home til after midnight. I’m cold, and tired and hungry. And I want to burn my f****** electric car. 

Just read this and then it’s ad appeared 😂

[Carl Sagan]

On 29/05/2024 at 07:45, GboroRam said:

Hyundai Kona 64Kw.

200bhp, not that I drive fast but far better pick up than my Clio GT.

Top speed 102, which sounds puny but even in Germany I won't go over a ton on the autobahn. 

Bargain. I was looking at a hateful, evil tesla but with all the extras and dealer sleight of hand, a 290 monthly payment turned out to be over 400 on PCP. I ended up with a HP of 345 per month. Happy motorist here. 

Is that a joke re Tesla? Of course without them there would be no EVs because the villains, the traditional automakers like Hyundai, only wanted to make and sell gas-guzzling polluting vehicles, for the sake of short-term profits, even if they destroyed the planet in the longer term. 

[GboroRam]

5 hours ago, Carl Sagan said:

Is that a joke re Tesla? Of course without them there would be no EVs because the villains, the traditional automakers like Hyundai, only wanted to make and sell gas-guzzling polluting vehicles, for the sake of short-term profits, even if they destroyed the planet in the longer term. 

No, I seriously was considering one. The prices are relatively affordable, but there's enough sneaky dealer tricks that you end up paying extras and it just didn't work out as good a deal as first suggested. 

The trouble with living ethically with everything you buy is, eventually you run out of ethical companies and you starve to death. 

The main reason I went in an alternative direction ultimately was my wife thought doing everything through a central console was too confusing. Unfortunately one of the major disadvantages of tesla is they insist on fixing things that aren't broken. Nobody has a problem with indicator stalks, we're all comfortable with using a stick next to the wheel to tell people which way we're going. So to move it to somewhere unintuitive is a bad engineering decision. I've seen one person add sticky buttons so he can feel them without taking his eyes off the road. When users have to fix your improvements by DIY, you know you've made a mistake. 

[Stive Pesley]

9 hours ago, TigerTedd said:

Worst f****** evening ever:

so I’m racing home from work to get to a school awards ceremony for my daughter. I notice I have 72miles to go and 70 miles of charge.

And there is gridlocked traffic. The one good thing about traffic is that it conserves energy. But I won’t have time to go home first and then go with the family to this ceremony, so I’ll have to go straight to the school. 

that’s fine, I can just about conserve enough energy for that. It’s 7 miles from home, so I might even be able to go home after. Worst come to worst, I’ll find a charger within a couple of miles and get 5 mins charge. 

Ceremony ends, my daughter didn’t win either of the two awards she was nominated for, 3 hours of my life I’ll never get back. 

get in the car and it’s on tortoise mode. Not to worry, I know I’ve still got 2 to 3 miles on tortoise mode, but I’m not going to make it home without a charge. 

I navigate myself to the nearest charger the Electroverse app shows me in a Peugeot pentagon dealership in burton. It’s 2.4 miles away. I make it. 

I try to get it to work for 10 mins, before giving up and calling the 24/7 call line. They remotely reset the machine. But while doing that, they realise that it’s a private machine and can only be used by people from pentagon. 

im furious. Why was it in the app if I can’t use it! If I’d have known, there were other charges I could’ve gone to. But now I know I’m on fumes (or whatever the electric equivalent is, sparks?) the next charger is broken, of course, so the next one is 1.6 miles away.

i navigate to that, and I’m about to make it, it’s 0.5 miles away, and the f****** road is closed. The diversion adds 2 miles. 

so on my car sat nav I notice it’s showing a charger in the Aldi I’m driving past, so I pull a u turn and try to find that. Don’t care if it’s a slow charger at this point.

but I can’t find one. I try the zap map app, and that confirms that there isn’t actually one there, but shows me a different one 0.5 miles away. Down the same stupid closed road.

its 1.6 miles away in the alternative route.

all I can do is go for it and hope. I had 0.2 miles to go when the battery conked out.

the really annoying thing is that the battery actually lasted quite a long time on tortoise mode, I probably could have made it home.

now I’m waiting 2 hrs for breakdown recovery and I won’t be home til after midnight. I’m cold, and tired and hungry. And I want to burn my f****** electric car. 

Maybe twice in my life I've been in this situation in a petrol car and it's horrible. Thankfully the only time I have conked out, I was about 300 yards from the petrol station so could push it there myself.  I guess pushing EVs is a different matter

Coincidentally I saw an abandoned Tesla yesterday in Derby, and the only people I know with EVs have all experienced exactly what you describe

I guess this will eventually become the new normal until the lord god our saviour Elon uses his massive engineering genius to come up with a solution 😋

 

[TigerTedd]

24 minutes ago, Stive Pesley said:

Maybe twice in my life I've been in this situation in a petrol car and it's horrible. Thankfully the only time I have conked out, I was about 300 yards from the petrol station so could push it there myself.  I guess pushing EVs is a different matter

Coincidentally I saw an abandoned Tesla yesterday in Derby, and the only people I know with EVs have all experienced exactly what you describe

I guess this will eventually become the new normal until the lord god our saviour Elon uses his massive engineering genius to come up with a solution 😋

 

I conked out once on my 125 motorbike and had to push it a mile and a half. Turns out it had ran out of oil though, not petrol, and I didn’t realise. so the whole thing exploded after I filled it up with petrol anyway.

i ran out of battery in my EV once before when service station one was broken, 2 was broken, then you’re starting to get a bit desperate and panicky, I got to service station 3, and the chargers were literally 2ms away, but around a one way system, which I stupidly started to follow and then conked out. Had to push it round the whole car park.

im not sure how we managed it though, cos you can’t get it into neutral. It’s a real faff for the breakdown guy, he had to take the two front wheels off and put some sort of special bearing in just to be able to tow it 200m to the charging point.

i finally got home at 2:30am, ready for a 6:30am start to teach first aid.

[Ram-Alf]

1 hour ago, Stive Pesley said:

I guess this will eventually become the new normal until the lord god our saviour Elon uses his massive engineering genius to come up with a solution 😋

[Gaspode]

"Range Anxiety" (as experienced first-hand by @TigerTedd) very much at the forefront of people choosing not to go for EVs or going back to Hybrid or combustion engines - hope Milliband undertands this as a major problem in his determination to force through Net Zero....infrastucture/technology has to be better before we get to mass takeup of EVs....

[Archied]

Won’t go near one until they are proper 500 mile range and charging points ( that work all the time ) are  bloody everywhere even then the time to charge v filling up your petrol tank is a slight put off , I reckon they are part of the solution but not THE solution ,

climate change is a problem , it’s not the end of the world 🤷🏻‍♂️, would be good if the issue was approached in the manner of being innovative and moving forward rather than backwards , greens are in a pickle , don’t want oil and gas but also don’t want solar panels in fields , windmills and pylons all over the country , so back to living in caves with a massive drop in life expectancy it is then 😂
as I’ve said before , the whole issue has been captured by the money makers on forced consumerism kick when green years ago meant something , made sense and was becoming a bit of a threat to the growth growth growth take make throw away madness , too many real issues with our planet totally forgotten and placed out of sight , good people being exploited and our young full of anxiety,

but hey that’s just me🤷🏻‍♂️

Edited July 12 by Archied