Louie Sibley

[duncanjwitham]

I'm not starting sharpening my pitchfork purely on the word of a random person on the internet (no offence intended to anyone)...

But *if* we sell Sibley now for basically nothing, it's probably the most stupid decision we've made as a club since the last time we decided to sell our best young midfielder for a fraction of what he was worth, because an idiot manager decided he didn't want to play him.

[nottingram]

I know we are in Covid times but if Sibley was up for sale, surely better teams than Sheffield Wednesday and Reading would be in for him? 

I know we are a fundamentally stupid football club but lots aren’t and so wouldn’t pass up on a player like Sibley who would appear to be available for less than a million (guesswork based on the clubs apparently in for him).

I have hope he has worked himself back in to the plans, 40 minutes v Huddersfield and 90 v Salford would have him as one of our most used players so far.

Edit: also if we were to sell him for the sort of fee Reading or Sheffield Wednesday could afford it would be the most damning indictment of our manager possible. Probably a reduction in value of about 15000% under him.

Edited August 13, 2021 by nottingram

[RoyMac5]

14 minutes ago, nottingram said:

Edit: also if we were to sell him for the sort of fee Reading or Sheffield Wednesday could afford it would be the most damning indictment of our manager possible. Probably a reduction in value of about 15000% under him.

A bit like the Liverpool bids for Hughes, did they ever exist anywhere bar the media?

[Sidd10]

I mean he's alright, would rather keep him, but he isn't the world class player some have you believe on here. He's a red card waiting to happen most games, gives stupid free kicks away in the defensive third constantly - which we can't defend and puts us under pressure. 

I can see why a manager would get frustrated with him 

[Sparkle]

He’s got fire in his belly and he needs to be kept and used - he runs at defenders and shoots and because of that he will score goals ( something we are not blessed with) he will also be targeted by the opposition which means he will win free kicks etc and he will stand up for himself which is what I like to see 

[Mostyn6]

If Rooney doesn’t trust Sibley but is happy to make Forsyth captain, he needs his head wobbling! 

[sage]

21 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said:

If Rooney doesn’t trust Sibley but is happy to make Forsyth captain, he needs his head wobbling! 

Who would you gave made captain out of that line up?

[nottingram]

35 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

A bit like the Liverpool bids for Hughes, did they ever exist anywhere bar the media?

Bids for Sibley may not have existed (neither of us knows) but would you agree that at the end of 2019/20, he would have been worth 8 figures, or very close to? Clearly that is no longer the case and the manager has to take some responsibility for that especially when the mantra is and has been for a while, development of young players. I’ve been mildly impressed by Rooney’s approach so far this season but I’m afraid his blind spot with Sibley is a huge oversight. Like I said though, hopefully his use of him so far this season shows that that is changing.

[RoyMac5]

Just now, nottingram said:

Bids for Sibley may not have existed (neither of us knows) but would you agree that at the end of 2019/20, he would have been worth 8 figures, or very close to? 

No. And that is the point. We all knew Hughes would go for a massive fee when we sold him.

Maybe some of the clubs supposedly interested look a bit deeper at the player than the fans do?

[Rambalin]

IWayne told him was what he needed to improve and add to his game to be in his plans going forward.

Now you can read that and say he has been told you are not in his plans if you wanted too. He said similar about Festy after the last two games...

 

 

 

[nottingram]

Just now, RoyMac5 said:

No. And that is the point. We all knew Hughes would go for a massive fee when we sold him.

Maybe some of the clubs supposedly interested look a bit deeper at the player than the fans do?

Well Hughes didn’t go for a massive fee did he? He went for an ‘okay’ fee because we hired a manager who had no idea or interest in how to use him and had no qualms in showing this to everybody who might want to buy him by never picking him, despite an oft-repeated mantra that we wanted to use academy players. In a years time maybe you’ll be able to replace two words there: Hughes to Sibley and okay to pitiful.

If you think we wouldn’t have demanded close to £10m at the very least for Sibley after his exploits at the back end of 2019-20 I would suggest that your head may be in the sand. 

[Bob The Badger]

45 minutes ago, Sidd10 said:

 He's a red card waiting to happen most games

You mean like Roy Keane and Patrick Vieira were?

Edited August 13, 2021 by Bob The Badger

[RoyMac5]

1 minute ago, nottingram said:

If you think we wouldn’t have demanded close to £10m at the very least for Sibley after his exploits at the back end of 2019-20 I would suggest that your head may be in the sand. 

We can demand what we like - how much the selling club gets is the point you are constantly ignoring.

I imagine we wanted more for Hughes, but like any auction it needs more than one bidder. Why wasn't there lots of bids when it was clear we were selling? 

[nottingram]

46 minutes ago, Sidd10 said:

I mean he's alright, would rather keep him, but he isn't the world class player some have you believe on here. He's a red card waiting to happen most games, gives stupid free kicks away in the defensive third constantly - which we can't defend and puts us under pressure. 

I can see why a manager would get frustrated with him 

That explains his 0 red cards in 41 appearances I suppose.

[duncanjwitham]

2 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

No. And that is the point. We all knew Hughes would go for a massive fee when we sold him.

Maybe some of the clubs supposedly interested look a bit deeper at the player than the fans do?

The thing with Hughes was, we sold him at the lowest point his value could have been.  He'd just had a season out injured, had barely played himself back to fitness and had been told by a manager he wasn't wanted.  If he'd stayed and had a similar season here to the one he had at Watford, where he'd had a slow start but established himself in the team and was playing very well by the end (and that was in the prem as well, don't forget), we'd have potentially got far more than we sold him for.

The same is happening with Sibley (if it's actually happening...).  If we'd sold him off the back of his breakthrough season we'd have got far more for him than we'd get for him now off the back of a tough season where he's allegedly not wanted by the manager.

[nottingram]

1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said:

We can demand what we like - how much the selling club gets is the point you are constantly ignoring.

I imagine we wanted more for Hughes, but like any auction it needs more than one bidder. Why wasn't there lots of bids when it was clear we were selling? 

?

I’ll reframe the question then. If, at the end of 2019/20, we made it clear Sibley was available for, for arguments sake, £2m - what level of interest do you think there’d have been at that price, for a player who was scoring at a clip of 1 in 2, from midfield, at the age of 17/18? 

The point is it is quite obvious that his value has fallen under our current manager. Given the emphasis on youth that is a big issue and is at least in part, the managers responsibility. 

I’ll say again as you appear to have not seen it once you saw even a slight criticism of Mr. Rooney, I’m hopeful that his use of him this season shows a slightly different approach that we all know is needed.

[EraniosSocks]

3 minutes ago, nottingram said:

?

I’ll reframe the question then. If, at the end of 2019/20, we made it clear Sibley was available for, for arguments sake, £2m - what level of interest do you think there’d have been at that price, for a player who was scoring at a clip of 1 in 2, from midfield, at the age of 17/18? 

The point is it is quite obvious that his value has fallen under our current manager. Given the emphasis on youth that is a big issue and is at least in part, the managers responsibility. 

I’ll say again as you appear to have not seen it once you saw even a slight criticism of Mr. Rooney, I’m hopeful that his use of him this season shows a slightly different approach that we all know is needed.

I know for certain that Wolves made a bid of 2 million plus add ins, around 2017 for Sibley and the club directly told them no 

[RoyMac5]

1 minute ago, nottingram said:

I’ll say again as you appear to have not seen it once you saw even a slight criticism of Mr. Rooney, I’m hopeful that his use of him this season shows a slightly different approach that we all know is needed.

You blame Rooney for the way Sibley is playing. I suggested that he's not yet as good as some spectacular goal-scoring made him look. Young players are inconsistent and not all turn into Ronaldo or Messi even when the fans think they are. Again I refer you to Hughes who I think is vastly under-rated, but apparently I'm in a small group. And perhaps I'm slightly biased by the lovely football we saw from him here, him being 'one of our own'. 

[Sidd10]

21 minutes ago, nottingram said:

That explains his 0 red cards in 41 appearances I suppose.

He's started 19 games for us and has 10 yellows. He got booked in a friendly, he got booked inside 40 mins on Saturday. 

[nottingram]

2 minutes ago, Sidd10 said:

He's started 19 games for us and has 10 yellows. He got booked in a friendly, he got booked inside 40 mins on Saturday. 

I can think of another attacking midfielder we have (who incidentally, I like) who could boast a similar disciplinary record with some red cards included for good measure, who’s just been made club captain. Doesn’t wash I’m afraid.