Training Photos

[Jubbs]

7 minutes ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

only Stretton has experienced any loan time, sadly cut short by injury but even despite scoring 2 goals he only averaged 30 mins a game and only started once? That’s not to criticise him at all, he has a big future and I’m a huge fan, but that was in the Conference and at his age they only really saw him as an impact player which is understandable

Stretton scored 3 goals in 173 mins, averaging a goal every 58 mins. Over his career of games in PL2, UYL, U18PL and FYC, Stretton has scored 39 goals in 66 games (equivalent of 46.5 90's), averaging a goal every 107 mins. Stretton scores goals, it's as simple as that.

 

10 minutes ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

Watson could be argued that he was a regular on the bench and so was needed to stay here, but if he was to be dropped into league 2 right now he’d be lost without trace. Physically he’d be eaten alive and his technical attributes would be wasted as he watches the ball getting smashed around 40 feet in the air for 90 mins!

Not every technical player struggles in lower leagues? 5ft 2 Ilias Chair had an incredible season at Stevenae in 2019, some hailing him as one of the best players to ever play in League 2. 

13 minutes ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

Festy much the same (and also had injuries of course) but size wise he’d find lower leagues a struggle especially if played as a defender.

Ebosele is an incredibly strong player... Have you watched him play?

[Ravabeerbelly]

35 minutes ago, Jubbs said:

Stretton scored 3 goals in 173 mins, averaging a goal every 58 mins. Over his career of games in PL2, UYL, U18PL and FYC, Stretton has scored 39 goals in 66 games (equivalent of 46.5 90's), averaging a goal every 107 mins. Stretton scores goals, it's as simple as that.

 

Not every technical player struggles in lower leagues? 5ft 2 Ilias Chair had an incredible season at Stevenae in 2019, some hailing him as one of the best players to ever play in League 2. 

Ebosele is an incredibly strong player... Have you watched him play?

I’m not knocking Stretton at all. For me he’s the most likely of all the academy players to actually make it. He has all the attributes required. I was only observing that he was used very much as an impact / squad player and only started 1 game in 5 averaging 30ish mins a game. One ‘goal’ was very much an own goal if you saw it however that would still be an assist and his stats for his limited time were impressive. I was only demonstrating that as a young player it’s very unusual to play regularly in those lower leagues due to its physical demands and Stretton was only playing non league. 

There are always exceptions, however Chair only played 16 games for Stevenage so to hail him one of the best to ever play in league 2 is a bit extreme! He was 20 years old during that loan spell and clearly made an impact got 1300 minutes under his belt and went back to QPR where he then made an impact the following season as a 22 year old. Probably got pre season to see how he was shaping up ?

I love Festy. I love watching him play and rate him highly. I was simply saying that at 5’2” if he played as a defender in league 1/2 he’d struggle. Opposition would target him by putting their tallest forward on the left wing and hit him with long diagonals from their right back all game. Strength wouldn’t come into it. He’d lose every arial duel.

Edited July 7, 2021 by Ravabeerbelly

[Anag Ram]

6 minutes ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

I’m not knocking Stretton at all. For me he’s the most likely of all the academy players to actually make it. He has all the attributes required. I was only observing that he was used very much as an impact / squad player and only started 1 game in 5 averaging 30ish mins a game. One ‘goal’ was very much an own goal if you saw it however that would still be an assist and his stats for his limited time were impressive. I was only demonstrating that as a young player it’s very unusual to play regularly in those lower leagues due to its physical demands and Stretton was only playing non league. 
 

There are always exceptions, however Chair only played 16 games for Stevenage so to hail him one of the best to ever play in league 2 is a bit extreme! He was 20 years old during that loan spell and clearly made an impact got 1300 minutes under his belt and went back to QPR where he then made an impact the following season as a 22 year old. Probably got pre season to see how he was shaping up ?

I love Festy. I love watching him play and rate him highly. I was simply saying that at 5’2” if he played as a defender in league 1/2 he’d struggle. Opposition would target him by putting their tallest forward on the left wing and hit him with long diagonals from their right back all game. Strength wouldn’t come into it. He’d lose every arial duel.

He's about 8 inches taller than that I would say. And he's a tank. 

[Ravabeerbelly]

10 minutes ago, Anag Ram said:

He's about 8 inches taller than that I would say. And he's a tank. 

Ok I exaggerated slightly to make a point. WhoScored.com have him at 5’9” which is still very small compared to the average league 1 or 2 striker…he would be targeted for that reason becomes that’s how the majority of these teams play. 

Please, I am not putting these players down…quite the opposite, i rate the majority of them very highly. Festy and Stretton in particular! I’d have Festy over McDonald and I’d definitely have Stretton over Duncan, Plange, JHI or Taylor Crossdale!

I’m trying to champion them and offer reasons why they should be given opportunity not the opposite.

Edited July 7, 2021 by Ravabeerbelly

[BaaLocks]

On 01/07/2021 at 18:51, RoyMac5 said:

We play with who we've got - I just want to see players wanting to play for the club, preferably highly skilled competitors, but you know! ? #COYR

I always used to be a 'put out Derby players in Derby shirts, not just loans to bump us up the league'. Not sure I'm so wedded to that point of view now, what I wouldn't give to see any of Lingard, Mascarell, Eustace (before or after he signed), Osman, Clarke, Butland, Tomori, Wilson or Mount in our starting line up. Jeez, I'd even take Julien De Sart and Kevin Lisbie at this point.

[Anag Ram]

1 minute ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

Ok I exaggerated slightly to make a point. WhoScored.com have him at 5’9” which is still very small compared to the average league 1 or 2 striker…he would be targeted for that reason becomes that’s how the majority of these teams play. 

Please, I am not putting these players down…quite the opposite, i rate the majority of them very highly. Festy and Stretton in particular! 
I’m trying to champion them and offer reasons why they should be given opportunity not the opposite.

Yeah, I think Ebosele will need time. He's an exceptionally quick runner with and without the ball and has a lot of power. He can be naive in defence at times and can be overambitious in possession but I think he has a great future. Certainly an able replacement should Byrne be out and possibly a wide midfield player on the right. 

Stretton impressed me. His career may have taken off if his shot had been six inches lower. 

I think he is a definite sub this year and needs to take his chances. 

We need more mobile forwards. We also need someone who can get on the end of crosses. 

Too many times it's CKR against three defenders. 

[Jimbo Ram]

7 minutes ago, BaaLocks said:

I always used to be a 'put out Derby players in Derby shirts, not just loans to bump us up the league'. Not sure I'm so wedded to that point of view now, what I wouldn't give to see any of Lingard, Mascarell, Eustace (before or after he signed), Osman, Clarke, Butland, Tomori, Wilson or Mount in our starting line up. Jeez, I'd even take Julien De Sart and Kevin Lisbie at this point.

Think I might have seen Lisbie in the training photos, think it was him…bit of experience up top maybe ?

[cheron85]

11 minutes ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

Ok I exaggerated slightly to make a point. WhoScored.com have him at 5’9” which is still very small compared to the average league 1 or 2 striker…he would be targeted for that reason becomes that’s how the majority of these teams play. 

I thought he was a fullback? Wingers at any level don't tend to be giants

Also the top 5 goalscorers in league 2 last season ranged between 5' 7" and 5'11" - Not exactly big fellas - And most being the same sort of size as the wee lad Festy

Appreciate the sentiment but you're making some assumptions which don't really pan out when investigating the facts...

[Ravabeerbelly]

2 minutes ago, cheron85 said:

I thought he was a fullback? Wingers at any level don't tend to be giants

Also the top 5 goalscorers in league 2 last season ranged between 5' 7" and 5'11" - Not exactly big fellas - And most being the same sort of size as the wee lad Festy

Appreciate the sentiment but you're making some assumptions which don't really pan out when investigating the facts...

You’ve missed the point. He is a full back. Opposition would target that by using their tallest forwards not their goalscorers on him. They’d ask their target man ‘type’ to pull off the shoulders of the centre backs and drift towards the full back area where they’d target long balls for him to win. Their wingers and creative players would play off that and supply their goalscorers. 

It’s a tactic or a theory not a fact. I didn’t ever project it as fact. 

[cheron85]

1 minute ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

You’ve missed the point. He is a full back. Opposition would target that by using their tallest forwards not their goalscorers on him. They’d ask their target man ‘type’ to pull off the shoulders of the centre backs and drift towards the full back area where they’d target long balls for him to win. Their wingers and creative players would play off that and supply their goalscorers. 

It’s a tactic or a theory not a fact. I didn’t ever project it as fact. 

I think you're speculating wildly about what they 'could' do rather than what teams in that league actually do - I've hardly ever seen a big target man moving off to the wings to receive the ball at any point - Because you generally want your big target man in the middle - Most of the time they have limited control of where the ball is going to come off their head and therefore need as many options as possible which is why they play the middle ie, players in all directions

And for reference - The 2 fullbacks in the league 2 team of the year were 5' 8" and 5' 10" - Neither are giants and seem to have coped quite well with the rigours of that league without being dominated by giant strikers drifting out to the wing

[Ghost of Clough]

1 hour ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

I only suggested it was odd, for a variety of different reasons.

Taylor Crossdale is nothing like JHI. He’s older than when JHI joined for a start. He’s a ‘99 born and therefore the same age as Cam Cresswell who was 23s top scorer and been here since he was 8(?) and was released at the end of last season. Taking Taylor-Crossdale on trial for the same group, who plays in the same position makes no sense. Add that to the fact he’s had recent trials at two Cat 2 academies and not been taken, using your logic for Hutchinson, means he must struggle at Cat 1? His last recorded goals were u18s three seasons ago! He’ll be 22 before xmas.

19/20 he scored 5 U23 goals in 15 apps for Fulham (Cat 1 academy). Just over a year younger than Hector-Ingram, so I wouldn't be surprised if he has 6 months with us before we decide to loan him out. We need a forward player to add depth to our small U23 squad anyway, so a short term stop-gap makes sense.

1 hour ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

Duncan, I never felt is close to first team and have stated several times he needs games and goals for the 23s this season to stake a claim. It was odd, IMO, to have included him with 1st team the first week back and then to send him back to the 23s a few days later. Not sure how that makes a player feel?

Various U23 players are involved in first team training at various times. With Lawrence and Jozwiak returning from their extended breaks, the gap in the first team training sessions probably isn't there. I'm sure he isn't the only player to have been involved with the first team for the first few days before returning to the U23s

1 hour ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

Hutchinson, whichever way you want to slice it has a lot of first team experience in the EFL for his age. He’d racked up 40 games (30 league games in league 1) while still a teenager, shortly before we took him having lost half a season through Covid and another 12 in league 2. That’s over 50 first team games in since he was 18 despite losing half a season to Covid and half a season with our 23s. Add to that another 23 as an unused sub (transfer market). Impact player or squad player, that’s a substantial amount of first team experience - even if only around the squad all week training - for a young player to have, which makes it odd to me that at 21 (same year group as Cresswell) and with a threadbare squad that we aren’t at least seeing him at training?

Im not suggesting for a second that he’s a first team player or would make match day squads but at a time when we are ‘looking at’ so many young players from the 23s it’s odd that he’s not one of them.

As for the struggling on loan, that doesn’t wash with me or tell me too much without knowing the nuances of the situation. Judging a young technically based player on his success in league 2 is, as the saying goes, akin to judging a fish on its ability to climb a tree! 

Hutchinson is a CM though. Knight, Sibley, Bird, Shinnie and Watson clearly ahead in the pecking order. Dixon was in training so presumably our current 6th choice CM. In a squad of 23 first teamers, you only have 6 CMs. The coaching staff obviously feel Dixon and Watson can offer more to the first team than Hutchinson.

1 hour ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

We have a number of young players currently training with the first team, none of which have had a loan spell or experienced adults football other than the Chorely game which highlighted just how difficult that can be and they were two leagues below league 2!

Ideally, every player will go from U18s, to U23s, to loans out, before playing for the first team. However, you often get players making the leap up without getting that experience. Hendrick, Hughes, Bogle, Knight... the list can go on just for our club. Looking at the England squad there are many who made their debuts in the PL without going out on loan: Saka, Chillwell, Shaw, Rashford, Rice, Grealish, Foden, Sterling.

1 hour ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

Of McDonald, Ebosele, Watson, JBrown and Stretton, only Stretton has experienced any loan time, sadly cut short by injury but even despite scoring 2 goals he only averaged 30 mins a game and only started once? That’s not to criticise him at all, he has a big future and I’m a huge fan, but that was in the Conference and at his age they only really saw him as an impact player which is understandable, by the same age Hutchinson had made 30 league 1 appearances. 

I'm not sure of your point here. Footballers are only good enough for the first team if they've had loans? There are plenty of examples that loans aren't an absolute must as you seem to suggest.

1 hour ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

Of the others, there’s a number of reasons why the others haven’t been on loan….Watson could be argued that he was a regular on the bench and so was needed to stay here, but if he was to be dropped into league 2 right now he’d be lost without trace. Physically he’d be eaten alive and his technical attributes would be wasted as he watches the ball getting smashed around 40 feet in the air for 90 mins!

So you actually think that these youngsters would be better off in the Championship where the football isn't played in the air as much then. Good to know.

1 hour ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

Festy much the same (and also had injuries of course) but size wise he’d find lower leagues a struggle especially if played as a defender.

You clearly haven't watched these youngsters play if that's what you've concluded. He's built like a tank and has a fantastic leap and certainly wouldn't be targeted. As it happens, he'll be playing in the Championship anyway.

1 hour ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

I really like Jordan Brown but he’s 20 and not played any real adults football. He should probably experience a loan this season. The problem I’d imagine will be finding a club that could assure reasonable game time for an untried academy player. 

Of the others, Solomon, Cashin, Bardell, Williams, Dixon, Wilson, Duncan and Plange all of them currently training with the first team (except Duncan now), I don’t see any of them being capable of going into league 1 or 2 and being able to get many minutes, let alone establish themselves with regular football. It’s brutal! 

You seem to be getting confused by the role these players will be playing. Of of the players you listed will be looking at 2 games max over a season, with the other half unlikely to even be on the bench. It's unreasonable to expect someone to play such as role in the Championship to be regulars in a L2 side.

Using Man Utd as an example. They gave James Wilson 64 minutes in the league in 13/14 and 348 in 14/15. He was still only good enough to be a Championship squad player the following season. In 15/16 they gave Donald Love 53 minutes who is only a L1 player now. Those small roles are filled by players such as JBrown, Wilson, Cashin, etc...

1 hour ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

 Like I say, I just find those three players current situation odd. That’s not me saying they should or any of them should be a first team player at all.

Sorry to waffle….I hope that’s not seen as argumentative….I enjoy your posts and knowledge of the 23s and 18s is fantastic and insightful, I’m just saying what I see given the current situation and player shortage….I’d be taking a look at as many options as possible. 

Hutchinson - plays in a position where we've got the most depth
Duncan - hasn't proven himself even at U23 level
Taylor-Crossdale - surprising that it's him, but not surprising the U23s are looking at a forward.

[Ravabeerbelly]

9 minutes ago, cheron85 said:

I think you're speculating wildly about what they 'could' do rather than what teams in that league actually do - I've hardly ever seen a big target man moving off to the wings to receive the ball at any point - Because you generally want your big target man in the middle - Most of the time they have limited control of where the ball is going to come off their head and therefore need as many options as possible which is why they play the middle ie, players in all directions

And for reference - The 2 fullbacks in the league 2 team of the year were 5' 8" and 5' 10" - Neither are giants and seem to have coped quite well with the rigours of that league without being dominated by giant strikers drifting out to the wing

I’ll try again.

Defending is primarily about decision making and positioning. That’s the reason most good defenders who are physically not giants tend to see their best football as they get older. I do t know who the 2 full backs you’re referring to are but my bet is they are 25+? 

Festy at 18 would struggle with both of those areas at the moment in among league footballers as a full back. It’s not a problem. As he ages he’ll learn how and where to position himself to avoid getting caught under the ball and losing out to more experienced players. 

It’s not really an opinion more a matter of fact that teams tactically will identify areas of weakness to exploit. An 18 year old full back who is 5’9” in most leagues will be exploited for his arial ability (or weakness of) I’m not saying the target man will play left wing but he will drift into areas to be hit by longer balls where he has most chance of winning them. Just as someone who’s quick will aim to play off the slowest centre back! I’m not saying he won’t be in the box at all. Think of it this way….an alternative would be to use your right winger and instruct him to aim crosses to the far post for the target man not the near post so that the smallest defender is caught having to defend that area against your tallest player!

Rochdale last season scored goals for fun, but they were relegated because they couldn’t defend. They took Haydon Roberts from Brighton on loan who is the same age as Festy and similar size. Haydon is an England age group international abs played for BHA first team….He played 26 times for Rochdale and they conceded 49 goals in those games, at one point averaging 3/4/5 a game. I’m not saying it was all Haydons fault but he was targeted due to his size and lack of experience. 
 

I rate Festy! This isn’t an attack on him at all. He’s going to be some player. However defensively at the moment he’d get torn apart on that basis and is maybe why he was used in a more attacking role when he was used?

[Leeds Ram]

3 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Hutchinson - Struggled to get in Forest Green's side in L2, so it's not too surprising that he isn't part of our first team. I imagine he'll be out on loan again this season
Duncan - Hasn't proven himself in the U23s yet and will be 4th choice CF at best by the time the new season actually starts
Taylor-Crossdale - If it is him, then it's likely similar to the Hector-Ingram signing. A bit of a cheap punt on someone who at some point showed great promise (20 goals in 21 U18 games in 16/17 and 6 in 8 U23 games in 17/18)

 

Leeds Ram just doesn't rate any of our academy players 

That's just not true... I just don't think players like Stretton who has been good at conference level and in the under 23's but nowhere else should be a part of the first team squad. I'm personally looking forward to hopefully Sibley getting plenty of minutes to regain some of the form that he seemed to have lost. 

[Leeds Ram]

3 hours ago, kevinhectoring said:

Find this an odd comment.

If they are complemented by the right incoming players some of them - and Watson - will be important. Want to see them developing more than they did last season 

It's not really odd- some of those players have had a good run a couple of seasons ago but last season didn't really offer much apart from arguably Buchanan who had periods of good form. It still remains to be seen if they can compete at a good championship level in the near future regularly or if they're not really up to it. Last season was probably the worst we've had quality wise this century apart from Phil Brown's tenure here so question marks have to be applied to the players who were a part of it. 

[Ravabeerbelly]

15 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

19/20 he scored 5 U23 goals in 15 apps for Fulham (Cat 1 academy). Just over a year younger than Hector-Ingram, so I wouldn't be surprised if he has 6 months with us before we decide to loan him out. We need a forward player to add depth to our small U23 squad anyway, so a short term stop-gap makes sense.

My point was he isn’t right now, younger than JHI was when he was signed. JHI was arguably worth more of a punt coming from west ham into Derby as a first year pro. MTC is already nearly 22 and been a pro for 4 years, I’m not sure that the 23s needed players of that age unless of course they are your typical ‘late developers’. MTC is certainly not that and if anything was probably an early developer which is why his career looked so promising and has tailed off. Very unconvincing spells in the 23s at Colchester and QPR demonstrate that given his record at U18s level at Chelsea. Bottom line is he’s the same age as Cresswell so surely it would’ve made more sense to have extended him by a year?

15 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Various U23 players are involved in first team training at various times. With Lawrence and Jozwiak returning from their extended breaks, the gap in the first team training sessions probably isn't there. I'm sure he isn't the only player to have been involved with the first team for the first few days before returning to the U23s

Agreed. Solomon is also in that photo having been with first team last week. I’m sore more will follow him back.

16 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Hutchinson is a CM though. Knight, Sibley, Bird, Shinnie and Watson clearly ahead in the pecking order. Dixon was in training so presumably our current 6th choice CM. In a squad of 23 first teamers, you only have 6 CMs. The coaching staff obviously feel Dixon and Watson can offer more to the first team than Hutchinson.

Of course, I can’t disagree with that. I wasn’t suggesting him to be a starter or even a squad player just yet, only that surely with his level of first team experience, seeing him among those players in training pre season would make sense. 

Personally in the 23s games I saw I’d have had him marginally ahead of Watson much of the time, particularly in the games I saw against Chelsea, Arsenal and Tottenham…the Chelsea game in particular. Although Watson was outstanding v Brighton later on.

Dixon is a very different type of player and much more a ball winner type but I’m not sure he has the technical ability to deal with the ball at that level. 

16 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Ideally, every player will go from U18s, to U23s, to loans out, before playing for the first team. However, you often get players making the leap up without getting that experience. Hendrick, Hughes, Bogle, Knight... the list can go on just for our club. Looking at the England squad there are many who made their debuts in the PL without going out on loan: Saka, Chillwell, Shaw, Rashford, Rice, Grealish, Foden, Sterling.

I definitely agree. I’m not saying players must go on loan at all. Just that sometimes judging what they do on loan isn’t always accurate or fair without knowing the nuances involved. Going on loan is one of the toughest things a player will do and it’s not always about how they play it’s very much about what they learn.

There are many more examples in the England squad of players that have gone out on loan to lower leagues and benefitted from it and in Harry Kanes case not actually always that successfully either. Lucky Tottenham didn’t think his failure to shine at Norwich in the Championship didn’t mean he wasn’t capable of playing in the Prem…

17 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

I'm not sure of your point here. Footballers are only good enough for the first team if they've had loans? There are plenty of examples that loans aren't an absolute must as you seem to suggest.

No not at all. I haven’t suggested that at all. I was simply saying that there are several players we have who haven’t been on loan but who in my opinion would’ve found it very hard to get regular minutes or even find clubs willing to take them. That doesn’t or wouldn’t mean they aren’t good enough for us at all just that it’s a very tough environment to go into and sometimes how well you play at that level doesn’t always reflect on your ability to play higher….or even just better!

17 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

So you actually think that these youngsters would be better off in the Championship where the football isn't played in the air as much then. Good to know.

Actually yes I do! The lower leagues are beneficial to some and not always suited to others. In the main the benefits of a loan aren’t always limited to gaining minutes played and is often about what you learn as a pro among a first team environment….what it means, what it takes, how they train every day, the intensity, the importance of winning, the ruthless nature of team selection based on performance not just in games but at training, crowd expectation…..etc etc. Many young players are too used to development football where minutes are assured based on development not performance particular Monday to Friday on the training field.

17 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

You clearly haven't watched these youngsters play if that's what you've concluded. He's built like a tank and has a fantastic leap and certainly wouldn't be targeted. As it happens, he'll be playing in the Championship anyway.

I’ve covered this earlier. I love Festy and he will be fine. But on loan in league 2 teams would target him and his height and / or inexperience. It would be the epitome of a learning curve for him and probably why he’s not been used as a defender last season when points were at a premium.

18 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

You seem to be getting confused by the role these players will be playing. Of of the players you listed will be looking at 2 games max over a season, with the other half unlikely to even be on the bench. It's unreasonable to expect someone to play such as role in the Championship to be regulars in a L2 side.

Using Man Utd as an example. They gave James Wilson 64 minutes in the league in 13/14 and 348 in 14/15. He was still only good enough to be a Championship squad player the following season. In 15/16 they gave Donald Love 53 minutes who is only a L1 player now. Those small roles are filled by players such as JBrown, Wilson, Cashin, etc...

I’m not confused at all. I agree with you. I would expect Hutchinson to fulfill a similar role which is why it surprised me to see he isn’t even in the pre season group being looked at…even for a week or so. As you say these groups change and players move between them so I agree it’s early days.

18 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Hutchinson - plays in a position where we've got the most depth
Duncan - hasn't proven himself even at U23 level
Taylor-Crossdale - surprising that it's him, but not surprising the U23s are looking at a forward.

Agree with all of that. Although looking at transfer market again it seems Hutchinson often plays wide and that’s an area we don’t have many options in.

[Sparkle]

1 hour ago, Ravabeerbelly said:

I’ll try again.

Defending is primarily about decision making and positioning. That’s the reason most good defenders who are physically not giants tend to see their best football as they get older. I do t know who the 2 full backs you’re referring to are but my bet is they are 25+? 

Festy at 18 would struggle with both of those areas at the moment in among league footballers as a full back. It’s not a problem. As he ages he’ll learn how and where to position himself to avoid getting caught under the ball and losing out to more experienced players. 

It’s not really an opinion more a matter of fact that teams tactically will identify areas of weakness to exploit. An 18 year old full back who is 5’9” in most leagues will be exploited for his arial ability (or weakness of) I’m not saying the target man will play left wing but he will drift into areas to be hit by longer balls where he has most chance of winning them. Just as someone who’s quick will aim to play off the slowest centre back! I’m not saying he won’t be in the box at all. Think of it this way….an alternative would be to use your right winger and instruct him to aim crosses to the far post for the target man not the near post so that the smallest defender is caught having to defend that area against your tallest player!

Rochdale last season scored goals for fun, but they were relegated because they couldn’t defend. They took Haydon Roberts from Brighton on loan who is the same age as Festy and similar size. Haydon is an England age group international abs played for BHA first team….He played 26 times for Rochdale and they conceded 49 goals in those games, at one point averaging 3/4/5 a game. I’m not saying it was all Haydons fault but he was targeted due to his size and lack of experience. 
 

I rate Festy! This isn’t an attack on him at all. He’s going to be some player. However defensively at the moment he’d get torn apart on that basis and is maybe why he was used in a more attacking role when he was used?

We don’t know who will struggle and who will excel that’s football and one of the most exciting things to look forward to next season 

[Dethorn]

3 hours ago, Duracell said:

I remember when I was 15, I convinced my mate from Market Harborough to get the train up with me from Kettering to watch Nigel Clough's Derby train at Loughborough.

Took me 90 mins to get there. Watched the squad run around for a bout 10 mins, then Robbie Savage gave me a look which said "wtf are you doing here?" and in that moment, I thought "I genuinely don't know what I'm doing with my life" and I went home.

From that moment on, I vowed never to spend my pocket money on watching Conor Doyle and Saul Deeney run around a university campus ever again.

That could be a lot worse though - you could be the mate who got talked into it...

[Duracell]

2 minutes ago, Dethorn said:

That could be a lot worse though - you could be the mate who got talked into it...

Very true. Mind you, in early 2010s rural Northamptonshire, it’s not like my mate had a long list of better offers...

[Dethorn]

5 minutes ago, Duracell said:

Very true. Mind you, in early 2010s rural Northamptonshire, it’s not like my mate had a long list of better offers...

Please tell me he wasn't a Derby Fan lol

[Rammy03]

Anyone know if the internationals Marshall, Jozwiak and Lawrence are back in training tomorrow?