Rooney judged harshly vs Nigel Clough

[RoyMac5]

7 hours ago, San Fran Van Rams said:

FWIW I don't think Cocu was given a fair crack of the whip either. But let's not get into that!

No he probably wasn't from transfers point of view. ?

[IslandExile]

1 minute ago, RoyMac5 said:

No he probably wasn't from transfers point of view. ?

Or having coaches imposed on him.....or the celebrity star player with public ambitions of taking over the manager's role.

[RoyMac5]

Just now, IslandExile said:

Or having coaches imposed on him.....or the celebrity star player with public ambitions of taking over the manager's role.

That's not my point of view. ?

[IslandExile]

2 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

That's not my point of view. ?

You think Cocu, not Mel, was behind the appointment of Rosenior and the acquisition of Rooney?

[RoyMac5]

Just now, IslandExile said:

You think Cocu, not Mel, was behind the appointment of Rosenior and the acquisition of Rooney?

I think he could have said no to Rosenior - he'd his own coaches - but thought it would be useful to have 'insider knowledge' of the Championship. And without doubt thought Rooney would be a great acquisition for midfield, and he was.

[Mostyn6]

9 minutes ago, IslandExile said:

Or having coaches imposed on him.....or the celebrity star player with public ambitions of taking over the manager's role.

 

8 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

That's not my point of view. ?

Whilst correct, this is a model widely used on the continent. We are used to managers, the continent used to Head Coaches. 
 

Ive always said that a good coach/manager should be getting 7/10 out of his players. You can tell whether a player in underperforming even if he’s not that talented. 
 

I’m very concerned that Rooney may not be able to do this. I criticised Clough and Jewell for not being able to do it enough. But Billy, Rowett, Lampard and SMc could get 7/10 performances quite often. 

[IslandExile]

2 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

And without doubt thought Rooney would be a great acquisition for midfield, and he was.

....initially.

Until lockdown, then came back unfit, overweight and with a poor attitude.

It appeared Cocu was still obliged to select him and stories, from whom?, appeared in the media that Rooney would be the next manager.

That totally undermined Cocu.

And returning to his transfer, what else could Cocu say? Cocu came from a European culture where signings are "given" to a coach, so he accepted it. The signing was initiated by Mel.

Anyway, I thought we had settled on a truce re: Cocu.

Like others, I am puzzled as to why you are inconsistent in your treatment of Rooney compared to Cocu, but I appreciate that you have said that you will not bother to explain that. So, we will have to move on and just accept it.

[mwram1973]

3 minutes ago, Mostyn6 said:

 

Whilst correct, this is a model widely used on the continent. We are used to managers, the continent used to Head Coaches. 
 

Ive always said that a good coach/manager should be getting 7/10 out of his players. You can tell whether a player in underperforming even if he’s not that talented. 
 

I’m very concerned that Rooney may not be able to do this. I criticised Clough and Jewell for not being able to do it enough. But Billy, Rowett, Lampard and SMc could get 7/10 performances quite often. 

Billy was amazing in getting that squad he had to play at the level they did imo.

[RoyMac5]

19 minutes ago, IslandExile said:

It appeared Cocu was still obliged to select him and stories, from whom?, appeared in the media that Rooney would be the next manager.

That totally undermined Cocu.

I could have made the 'Rooney rumours' up when Cocu was struggling. That's what journos do - or are you telling me all the Daily Fail articles recently are true?! ? 

What undermined Cocu was his 'complicated training' and his limited squad.