Rooney In!

[DCFC Kicks]

4 minutes ago, TexasRam said:

They got relegated, they were in the bottom portion of the table all season, that was their level.

Hungry are a league 1 standard international side, I’ll give you Holland. If your a good player your a good player and the management shouldn’t have to get that out of you. He’s shown on numerous occasions he’s not got the intelligence to play at this level. However my response was about the whole squad, the squad isn’t good enough to be any higher than we are. Other than Bielik  and Lawrence, these players wouldn’t get into a top half teams starting 11. 

Why are people forgetting they had a 12 point deduction? Isn't that he main reason?

[Ramarena]

7 minutes ago, DCFClks said:

Even without Bielik our squad is better than Rotherham's. So why are Rotherham at the same level as us with a worse team?

Add Cov, Preston, Millwall, Luton and Birmingham all have similar or lesser standard squads. Yet are above us in the table.

[Gone]

1 minute ago, DCFClks said:

Why are people forgetting they had a 12 point deduction? Isn't that he main reason?

Good point mate, I actually did.....still got relegated though . Anyway the point was the squad isn’t good enough to be any higher than we are, imo anyway

[Gone]

Just now, Ramarena said:

Add Cov, Preston, Millwall, Luton and Birmingham all have similar or lesser standard squads. Yet are above us in the table.

Serious question which of our squad would get in their 1st teams and why? 

[jono]

3 hours ago, Jourdan said:

We’d be daft to keep Rooney in charge whatever happens.

Look at how next season in the Championship is shaping up.

Sheff Utd, WBA and Fulham to come down with strong squads for the Championship and parachute payments to boot.

At least two from Brentford, Bournemouth and Swansea will remain in this division.

Teams like Cardiff, Reading, Stoke, Boro, Millwall and QPR will all be looking to kick on.

Forest and Bristol City will be looking to recover under experienced managers and get back into the frame for 6-12th.

What hope do we have under Rooney?

Without us spending £30-50 million of Alonso’s mystery money, it will be mid-table at best.

The real issue is that with new parachute clubs plus parachute clubs that are still getting money there are between 6 and 9 clubs who have an unfair financial advantage. If you really want to talk level playing field then mid table would be an acceptable goal .. it sounds sad yet I’ll bet that 5 of the top six will be clubs that have recent temporary visits to the prem.

I sort of wonder .. what’s the point sometimes 

[Ramarena]

2 minutes ago, TexasRam said:

Serious question which of our squad would get in their 1st teams and why? 

Beilik if fit, Shinnie, Clarke, Marshall, Byrne, Knight, Bird, Sibley, Lawrence, Roberts, Joz, waghorn, Gregory could all make the match day squads of the above clubs in various guises.

 

[Ramarena]

13 minutes ago, TexasRam said:

Good point mate, I actually did.....still got relegated though . Anyway the point was the squad isn’t good enough to be any higher than we are, imo anyway

Wouldn’t they have finished 13th without the point deduction?

[RoyMac5]

28 minutes ago, Ramarena said:

Beilik if fit, Shinnie, Clarke, Marshall, Byrne, Knight, Bird, Sibley, Lawrence, Roberts, Joz, waghorn, Gregory could all make the match day squads of the above clubs in various guises.

But the point is who would those teams drop? Who are they better than to make a difference. Putting in players who aren't fit doesn't count because then we'd most certainly be higher! Edit: How long was Lawrence missing? Etc..

Edited April 17, 2021 by RoyMac5

[Gone]

26 minutes ago, Ramarena said:

Beilik if fit, Shinnie, Clarke, Marshall, Byrne, Knight, Bird, Sibley, Lawrence, Roberts, Joz, waghorn, Gregory could all make the match day squads of the above clubs in various guises.

 

I did say 1st teams. From that list Beilik, Clarke, Lawrence and maybe Shinnie that’s it, the others not a chance 

[Chris_Martin]

47 minutes ago, TexasRam said:

They got relegated, they were in the bottom portion of the table all season, that was their level.

Hungry are a league 1 standard international side, I’ll give you Holland. If your a good player your a good player and the management shouldn’t have to get that out of you. He’s shown on numerous occasions he’s not got the intelligence to play at this level. However my response was about the whole squad, the squad isn’t good enough to be any higher than we are. Other than Bielk and Lawrence, these players wouldn’t get into a top half teams starting 11. 

Hungary are a good side and were very competitive at the last Euro's. They have very good players:

GK- Gulacsi, plays for RB Leipzig, Champions League standard

CB- Orban, also RB Leipzig

CB- Szalai, Fenerbahce

ST- Sallai, Bundesliga, Freiburg

ST- Szalai, Bundesliga, Mainz

Those are a few, can't be bothered looking through the whole squad. But i think you'll find they are way above EFL league one standard. 

Agree with you that if your a good player you should be able to show it no matter the management, but unfortunately that's not how football works nowadays. 

i don't know what else to say, the squad is absolutely good enough to stay a championship side. Who is it specifically you think is not good enough at this level?

[Jimbo Ram]

48 minutes ago, Ramarena said:

Add Cov, Preston, Millwall, Luton and Birmingham all have similar or lesser standard squads. Yet are above us in the table.

On what basis are you saying our squad is better than these teams? Our results don’t back this up....

[DCFC Kicks]

14 minutes ago, TexasRam said:

Serious question which of our squad would get in their 1st teams and why? 

In terms of ability only,

I'd say Preston, Millwall and Birmingham have a similar or slightly better squad but we certainly have a better squad than Luton, Coventry and Rotherham. Most there squads are still League 1 level. Obviously we'd take any of there strikers at the moment as ours are injured, but that's only happened recently.

Coventry - I'd only take Hamer and Ostigard

Luton - Bradley and maybe Tom Ince

Rotherham - maybe an attacking mid like Wing

people are slating the player's for underperforming, which they have, but they've not underperformed because of lack of ability as Rooney has said himself many times. People are constantly saying how terrible the players are on here, but I can guarantee most clubs would love to have some players with the quality of some of ours in there team. Clarke would get into most teams at the top of the division. Sibley and Knight have been linked with Prem teams. Jozwiak and Lawrence are international players with undoubted ability, I don't think Lawrence has ever been used correctly since he's been at Derby. Even a player like Waghorn, who's been bad all season, has proven he can play at this level.

 

[Gone]

4 minutes ago, Chris_Martin said:

Hungary are a good side and were very competitive at the last Euro's. They have very good players:

GK- Gulacsi, plays for RB Leipzig, Champions League standard

CB- Orban, also RB Leipzig

CB- Szalai, Fenerbahce

ST- Sallai, Bundesliga, Freiburg

ST- Szalai, Bundesliga, Mainz

Those are a few, can't be bothered looking through the whole squad. But i think you'll find they are way above EFL league one standard. 

Agree with you that if your a good player you should be able to show it no matter the management, but unfortunately that's not how football works nowadays. 

i don't know what else to say, the squad is absolutely good enough to stay a championship side. Who is it specifically you think is not good enough at this level?

It’s easier say who is good enough at this level, Lawrence, Clarke, Byrne, Bielik, Fozzy and at a huge push Waghorn. However to play a consistent level in the top half of the table, Clarke and Bielik. 

[Chris_Martin]

4 minutes ago, Jimbo Ram said:

On what basis are you saying our squad is better than these teams? Our results don’t back this up....

but if your comparing 2 players for a position why do results matter?

[Gone]

6 minutes ago, DCFClks said:

In terms of ability only,

I'd say Preston, Millwall and Birmingham have a similar or slightly better squad but we certainly have a better squad than Luton, Coventry and Rotherham. Most there squads are still League 1 level. Obviously we'd take any of there strikers at the moment as ours are injured, but that's only happened recently.

Coventry - I'd only take Hamer and Ostigard

Luton - Bradley and maybe Tom Ince

Rotherham - maybe an attacking mid like Wing

people are slating the player's for underperforming, which they have, but they've not underperformed because of lack of ability as Rooney has said himself many times. People are constantly saying how terrible the players are on here, but I can guarantee most clubs would love to have some players with the quality of some of ours in there team. Clarke would get into most teams at the top of the division. Sibley and Knight have been linked with Prem teams. Jozwiak and Lawrence are international players with undoubted ability, I don't think Lawrence has ever been used correctly since he's been at Derby. Even a player like Waghorn, who's been bad all season, has proven he can play at this level.

 

It’s all perceived ability, until they show it that’s all it is. They might be good footballers, but results and more importantly performances over the past 2 seasons say they are not good footballers. 

[DCFC Kicks]

1 minute ago, TexasRam said:

It’s all perceived ability, until they show it that’s all it is. They might be good footballers, but results and more importantly performances over the past 2 seasons say they are not good footballers. 

I'd argue that they've not been good the last 2 seasons because the managers have been rubbish.

It's not perceived ability, they've proven they can perform steadily at the top end of the table. Lawrence got 9 goals, 11 assists for Ipswich. Waghorn got 16 goals 13 assists also for Ipswich.

I honestly think if you put Lawrence in Brentford's team he'd be one of the best players in the league.

[GboroRam]

2 hours ago, jono said:

You know what, that’s about right. A handful of games where we have played convincingly and either lost or drawn because the roll of the dice didn’t go for us .. let’s pretend it’s 6 games .. 3 where we “lost” 2 points and 3 where we “lost” a point. I am not being specific about the games but for me it’s the right figure .. so add 9 points to our current total. Maybe we have had a couple of “undeserved” points .. so let’s call it 7 points .. which puts us safe with 4 games to play. 

That argument doesn't hold water for me. 

Let's say we finish 21st and Rotherham finish 22nd. Do you think Rotherham fans won't have their own list of games where they "deserved" to get something? 

Over 46 matches you end up where you should. I can understand a complaint about a decision in a playoff or a cup final. But if you are down at the bottom of the league, it's because you haven't performed across the season. 

[Jimbo Ram]

18 minutes ago, Chris_Martin said:

but if your comparing 2 players for a position why do results matter?

Eh? Don’t results have anything to do with indicating how good your players and squad are then?

[DCFC Kicks]

Just now, Jimbo Ram said:

Eh? Don’t results have anything to do with indicating how good your players and squad are then?

Only partly, If you put me as manager of Real Madrid I'd probably get terrible results and get them relegated, but you'd still say there players were good. 

[Ramarena]

7 minutes ago, TexasRam said:

I did say 1st teams. From that list Beilik, Clarke, Lawrence and maybe Shinnie that’s it, the others not a chance 

1st team isn’t really a good comparison as it’s a squad game these days. Look how often we’ve chopped and changed our lineups.

All the players I’ve mentioned would get into the others teams squads in varying guises, they couldn’t all be plonked into one team. Most would make the starting lineups.
 

Who’d have thought Mason Bennett, George Evans and Scott Malone would be key players at a top 10 side yet not good enough for us?

Waghorn was Ipswich’s leading scorer with 16 goals, Bird, Knight and Sibley have all attracted the attention of Prem clubs, Joz looks good on the international stage, Byrne is a very solid Champ RB, Marshall a solid Champ keeper, Lawrence can be one of the better players in the division when his heads right.

At different clubs with different managers these players could thrive.