Andrew3000 Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 20 minutes ago, Archied said: Not a chance , there are people diagnosed with long covid without testing positive or having a symptom before , could you imagine them diagnosing vaccine side effects to someone not vaccinated ??♂️ Well if true that's a concern. Auto immune type disorders and chronic fatigue problems have been on the rise in recent years and are poorly understood and treated. Whatever the cause, terrible suffering results. maxjam 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew3000 Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 11 hours ago, therealhantsram said: Yes, published in the Lancet. Here's the link. https://www.thelancet.com/journals/eclinm/article/PIIS2589-5370(21)00324-2/fulltext#seccesectitle0013 "People who had recovered from COVID-19, including those no longer reporting symptoms, exhibited significant cognitive deficits versus controls when controlling for age, gender, education level, income, racial-ethnic group, pre-existing medical disorders, tiredness, depression and anxiety. The deficits were of substantial effect size for people who had been hospitalised (N = 192), but also for non-hospitalised cases who had biological confirmation of COVID-19 infection (N = 326). Analysing markers of premorbid intelligence did not support these differences being present prior to infection. Finer grained analysis of performance across sub-tests supported the hypothesis that COVID-19 has a multi-domain impact on human cognition." Very concerning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew3000 Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 12 hours ago, Archied said: long covid ,,,, what’s next longer covid??♂️ Ooof. Wish you hadn't put that because its very insensitive. Also, one common way of dismissing dissenting voices has been the accusation of callousness and selfishness. I hope this was just an impulsive, ill advised joke. We cannot fall into the trap of being equally dismissive of people who disagree or have different experiences. There has been great suffering from this virus, even if I am worried that we are overall not getting the balance of risk right, not putting things into context and lots of things don't add up, the virus has been devastating for some. ariotofmyown, sheeponacid, therealhantsram and 1 other 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ketteringram Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 On 23/07/2021 at 19:07, Eddie said: If Tesco Ashby is the barometer of public opinion, people think the pandemic is over. We dropped in to do a mini-shop on our way back from holiday a couple of hours ago, and counted 20 or so adults not wearing facemasks, and none of the three people entering the store in front of us took advantage of the sanitising station. I was in my local large Tesco yesterday morning. Fairly busy, but well stocked. Very few people without masks. It looked like 90% were still using them. The lady on the till was not wearing one though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gone Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 The MSM throughout this pandemic have been awful, fuelling panic and mass hysteria. Here is a example from today Then click on the link and hey presto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 26 minutes ago, Andrew3000 said: Gboro, you couldn't resist a dismissive barb at the end there! I take your point and I freely admit it is hard to work out what is a credible source, but I can't fault Tess Lawries credentials as an external consultant to WHO and a practising medic. My main concern IS drugs being held up as a panacea precisely because of the vested interests, the power and money. My interest in Ivermectin is partly maintained by the fact it is an out of patent drug that no-one can profit from greatly, as I understand it. Anyway, whether it works or not we need more options to manage this terrible situation and protect our health. Literally not a dismissive barb. It's become a political football at least in part thanks to the ex US president who tried to win the masses over by downplaying the seriousness of covid, like a lot of the dissenters here are similarly doing. Miracle wonder drugs I'm in favour of, once they are approved. We are optimistic that the vaccine will reduce hospitalisations, which will help us to return to normal. So far it seems to be working. Other drugs have come and gone, disproved in the real world. This thread is turning hilarious as it's a small but vocal, angry group of people pushing a worldwide organised ulterior motive that they still can't explain beyond some vague power grab and accusation of profiteering. That's a power grab by the people in power, and profiteering from the immensely wealthy. ariotofmyown, May Contain Nuts and Wolfie20 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 29 minutes ago, Andrew3000 said: Ooof. Wish you hadn't put that because its very insensitive. Also, one common way of dismissing dissenting voices has been the accusation of callousness and selfishness. I hope this was just an impulsive, ill advised joke. We cannot fall into the trap of being equally dismissive of people who disagree or have different experiences. There has been great suffering from this virus, even if I am worried that we are overall not getting the balance of risk right, not putting things into context and lots of things don't add up, the virus has been devastating for some. Anything we say on any subject is insensitive to someone, nobody would be more pleased than me if we actually used proper figures and criteria to measure deaths and effects of this virus and get to a point where it can be properly understood and worked against Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 (edited) 21 minutes ago, GboroRam said: Literally not a dismissive barb. It's become a political football at least in part thanks to the ex US president who tried to win the masses over by downplaying the seriousness of covid, like a lot of the dissenters here are similarly doing. Miracle wonder drugs I'm in favour of, once they are approved. We are optimistic that the vaccine will reduce hospitalisations, which will help us to return to normal. So far it seems to be working. Other drugs have come and gone, disproved in the real world. This thread is turning hilarious as it's a small but vocal, angry group of people pushing a worldwide organised ulterior motive that they still can't explain beyond some vague power grab and accusation of profiteering. That's a power grab by the people in power, and profiteering from the immensely wealthy. Yep and nobody is overplaying COVID ,as with everything there is a balanced middle , if arguing against the massive overhype in fear and manipulation labels you as being totally dismissive of it then so be it ?♂️ Edited July 25, 2021 by Archied Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 20 minutes ago, GboroRam said: This thread is turning hilarious as it's a small but vocal, angry group of people pushing a worldwide organised ulterior motive that they still can't explain beyond some vague power grab and accusation of profiteering. That's a power grab by the people in power, and profiteering from the immensely wealthy. I assume you're referring to me? At least in part. If you leave conspiracy theories out of things - which I am more than happy to do btw. The policies that Govts have introduced have taken our wealth and freedoms away. The rich and powerful have every reason to prolong the agony the rest of us suffer simply because they are profiting from it. I don't believe that a worldwide cabal got together to engineer the situation but as a 'happy' consequence there has been a massive transfer of wealth to the rich throughout the pandemic. The article was from last year, the figure is probably significantly larger now; https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/oct/07/covid-19-crisis-boosts-the-fortunes-of-worlds-billionaires And 'Freedom Day' turned out to be a massive joke. As the Telegraph (usually Tory supporting) pointed out in an article I posted a few days ago the Govt may not intend to subject us to a Chinese style dictatorship but through mismanagement and incompentence we could end up there anyway. Maybe I'm worried about nothing and the vaccine passports won't get through Parliament - and if they do they will be relaxed after a period of time and not be expanded upon with flu shots, your drinking habits, sugar intake and excercise data etc, all for your benefit of course... Although I can't help but recall all the times on this forum reading how evil and useless the Tories are, so I'd prefer to try and stop them in their tracks now rather than fight to get back something we've lost later. You should be happy, I've been called a right-winger, nazi and facist at various points on here over the years, I'm now on your side! Power to the People n all that ? Archied and Norman 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 MD in private eye has been very balanced, if anyone is interested. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://www.bradqual.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2020/12/Eye-1537-MDs-Nine-Lessons-2020-12-18.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwifxfWD3P3xAhUHAcAKHUNuB2QQFjAEegQIExAC&usg=AOvVaw3PqKc54xHEJkGuSzYMxqcL Rev and Miggins 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therealhantsram Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 Four days of declining infections. Seemingly not being widely promoted or celebrated, as no one is sure what is going on. Why have infections peaked then dropped so quickly?. Everyone was expecting a higher and broader peak. One theory comes from the ONS antibody survey which suggests antibodies, either from vaccination or infection, are now at around 95% in most age groups. This animation shows it well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 On 24/07/2021 at 09:42, ketteringram said: Yes, I can see that, and how it leads to lower figures. I don't understand how at the same time, cases per 100,000 seem to be climbing fast. Area that borders where I work is now at close to 1,000. It was 800 last week, and less than 600 the week before. Where I live is 486, and it was about 250 ten days ago. Statistics for covid reporting have been a mess from the beginning. Archied 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 5 minutes ago, GboroRam said: Statistics for covid reporting have been a mess from the beginning. Of course they are under reported. And its typical that bad news always follows good news ? If they aren't accurate stats then what exactly is the point of them? I could make some numbers up - in fact I won't, I'll use a real one, which apparently is more than the Govt do, and my number is 0. That is the amount of family/friends that I personally know that have caught covid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GboroRam Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 1 minute ago, maxjam said: Of course they are under reported. And its typical that bad news always follows good news ? If they aren't accurate stats then what exactly is the point of them? I could make some numbers up - in fact I won't, I'll use a real one, which apparently is more than the Govt do, and my number is 0. That is the amount of family/friends that I personally know that have caught covid. My number is 2. Colleagues died with covid. RoyMac5 and ariotofmyown 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
therealhantsram Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 6 minutes ago, GboroRam said: My number is 2. Colleagues died with covid. My number is 8 friends and family infected. 2 dead. One of them just 21 years old. So very sad. RoyMac5, Pearl Ram and ariotofmyown 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, GboroRam said: My number is 2. Colleagues died with covid. The point being we're both trusting the other is telling the truth and there is no context. Do I have 100 family and friends or do I have 10. Do you have 100 colleagues or do you have 10. It seems to me that when covid numbers are increasing the Govt and Media are quick to preach doom and gloom and whenever things start to look a little better we're always given some other upcoming doomsday scenario. Unless the daily figures are accurate what is the actual point of them? Infections mean very little now-a-days anyway as the hospitalization/death rate have shown us recently as most people are now double jabbed which mitigates the worst covid can throw at you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxjam Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 Also the first reply to that Peston tweet is this - it appears that he is trying to make a mountain out of a molehill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gone Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 36 minutes ago, GboroRam said: Statistics for covid reporting have been a mess from the beginning. I don’t believe a word anyone in the media writes or says. They have lied and lied throughout all of this, just look at the BBC headlines today and look at the story behind it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramit Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 It happened. i am lost for words, all i can manage is hahahahahahaha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 1 hour ago, maxjam said: Of course they are under reported. And its typical that bad news always follows good news ? If they aren't accurate stats then what exactly is the point of them? I could make some numbers up - in fact I won't, I'll use a real one, which apparently is more than the Govt do, and my number is 0. That is the amount of family/friends that I personally know that have caught covid. My number is many in terms of people catching it , zero in terms of death or serious illness , now a handful of people I know on their second time of catching it and strangely or predictably or even medically they are all pretty much no symptoms first time but they know they have got it second time , is it a problem with testing or is it worse second time ? Have lots been falsely positive the first time? from day one my problem with all this has been the numbers , the criteria used to come to those numbers and how those numbers are used on the public , the same is happening with long covid , I have as much dislike for extreme conspiracy stuff as I do for the extreme stuff we have been subjected to , neither serves anybody well??♂️ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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