IslandExile Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 No, no, hear me out. Whether you liked the play under Cocu or not, he's the first manager we've had for years, if not decades, that has had a long term plan. His vision was all about providing a pathway for academy players to the first team. Essentially, a great long term strategy. Mac - as we have (mostly) all acknowledged is a great coach and, arguably, better in that role than as a manager or technical director. So, let's get them both performing their strongest roles. Cocu as the overarching strategist. Mac as the first team coach. The other plus, as far as the club and FFP is concerned, is that this would be a cheap option. We pay less of a settlement to Cocu and McClaren is now on the payroll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 Won't happen. In other circumstances, i could see the merits, but really a non starter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IslandExile Posted November 30, 2020 Author Share Posted November 30, 2020 1 minute ago, RadioactiveWaste said: Won't happen. In other circumstances, i could see the merits, but really a non starter. Yeah, I know but there's been other ludicrous suggestions.... (I was about to list them but just thought better of it rather than enrage their proponents further) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramarena Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 17 minutes ago, IslandExile said: No, no, hear me out. Whether you liked the play under Cocu or not, he's the first manager we've had for years, if not decades, that has had a long term plan. His vision was all about providing a pathway for academy players to the first team. Essentially, a great long term strategy. Mac - as we have (mostly) all acknowledged is a great coach and, arguably, better in that role than as a manager or technical director. So, let's get them both performing their strongest roles. Cocu as the overarching strategist. Mac as the first team coach. The other plus, as far as the club and FFP is concerned, is that this would be a cheap option. We pay less of a settlement to Cocu and McClaren is now on the payroll. Interesting idea.......as good egg as Cocu was he wouldn't have gone for it. You could actually have made the same argument back in Clough Jnr's day. He would never have gone for it, but him going to DOF and Mac running the day to day may actually have worked quite well! Funny how things work out when you look back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BIllyD Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 I really hope this takeover sees the club enter a period of looking forward not backwards. Mac has had his chances and failed, as has Cocu. Mel thanks for your tenure, they don't need a consultant let the new owners make their own mistakes. Employ a manager that can come in or in already here that can implement their philosophy, whatever that may be, youth, spending big, both or something else. But mainly for me, let's get back to the focus being on the pitch, to long we have been a circus of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 It’s a nice idea, but I’m not convinced it would work. Cocu and McClaren differ too much in their philosophies. There’s no guarantee that Cocu would make a good DOF either, even if he theoretically seems like he should do. Same goes for McClaren of course. Whichever way up, I definitely wouldn’t want McClaren back as permanent manager. We’ve been there twice already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 44 minutes ago, IslandExile said: His [Cocu's] vision was all about providing a pathway for academy players to the first team. surely this was MM's strategy and Cocu bought into it because, well, he didn't want to be sacked ! (Whoops) Don't you think Cocu would have wanted to spend £10mio on a centre forward last summer ?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 55 minutes ago, IslandExile said: No, no, hear me out. PS aren't there admin folk out there whose job it is simply to stop any thread that starts like this ? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IslandExile Posted November 30, 2020 Author Share Posted November 30, 2020 34 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said: surely this was MM's strategy and Cocu bought into it because, well, he didn't want to be sacked ! (Whoops) Don't you think Cocu would have wanted to spend £10mio on a centre forward last summer ?! MM hired Cocu because he fitted that profile. Cocu had a record of building teams from academy players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeedsCityRam Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 1 hour ago, IslandExile said: No, no, hear me out. Whether you liked the play under Cocu or not, he's the first manager we've had for years, if not decades, that has had a long term plan. His vision was all about providing a pathway for academy players to the first team. Essentially, a great long term strategy. Mac - as we have (mostly) all acknowledged is a great coach and, arguably, better in that role than as a manager or technical director. So, let's get them both performing their strongest roles. Cocu as the overarching strategist. Mac as the first team coach. The other plus, as far as the club and FFP is concerned, is that this would be a cheap option. We pay less of a settlement to Cocu and McClaren is now on the payroll. I really like the idea. McClaren isnt a great manager but is a very good coach & at his best on the training ground. Cocu is someone who clearly relishes a long term project, is passionate about developing youth, will have a great contacts book & has the dignified air of someone who might be happier away from the training ground. Both are heavily influenced by Dutch football philosophy, both have had success in Eredivise & have been involved in coaching set ups for their national teams. Both have a connection & attachment to Derby. Both are highly experienced but currently out of work. Their characters are quite different but may dovetail nicely. Dont imagine for a second it would happen but there will be much much worse suggestions on here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jram Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 They have the same first language so communication would be no issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBG83 Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 1 hour ago, IslandExile said: No, no, hear me out. Whether you liked the play under Cocu or not, he's the first manager we've had for years, if not decades, that has had a long term plan. His vision was all about providing a pathway for academy players to the first team. Essentially, a great long term strategy. Mac - as we have (mostly) all acknowledged is a great coach and, arguably, better in that role than as a manager or technical director. So, let's get them both performing their strongest roles. Cocu as the overarching strategist. Mac as the first team coach. The other plus, as far as the club and FFP is concerned, is that this would be a cheap option. We pay less of a settlement to Cocu and McClaren is now on the payroll. Definitely won’t happen but I said this before Cocu was sacked. Albeit Cocu as Manager and Mac head coach. To me Cocu’s main fault was getting his ideas across and instilling some energy/enthusiasm in the team. Mac could have done that and been a great buffer between players and management. Very Derby like to miss a trick and leave a load of apprentices in charge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DCFC27 Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 2 hours ago, IslandExile said: No, no, hear me out. Whether you liked the play under Cocu or not, he's the first manager we've had for years, if not decades, that has had a long term plan. His vision was all about providing a pathway for academy players to the first team. Essentially, a great long term strategy. Mac - as we have (mostly) all acknowledged is a great coach and, arguably, better in that role than as a manager or technical director. So, let's get them both performing their strongest roles. Cocu as the overarching strategist. Mac as the first team coach. The other plus, as far as the club and FFP is concerned, is that this would be a cheap option. We pay less of a settlement to Cocu and McClaren is now on the payroll. It’s not the worst idea, I said when he was first appointed he was better bringing him in as a coach along side him. Could have helped Cocu settle into English football unfortunately he brought in 3 people that had no championship coaching experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i-Ram Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 McClaren is a good coach, but he isn’t really a good manager. I acknowledge that he did give us our best time for a long long time back in 2013-15, but he was really lucky with what he inherited from Clough. Yes he tweaked it a bit, and certainly made the team play more to its true potential, but when it came to the crunch - the playoff final - he made a number of mistakes on the day (selection and tactical) which meant that Redknapp came off as the winning manager of a 10 man team. Then in the next season when injuries started to rack up he couldn’t really change our method of play, exacerbating the problem by trying to fit Ince and Bent into a 433 system. He has some further qualifications now, so let’s see what he can do as a Technical Director. I’m not expecting much, other than another push at self-promotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strawhillram Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 3 hours ago, IslandExile said: No, no, hear me out. Whether you liked the play under Cocu or not, he's the first manager we've had for years, if not decades, that has had a long term plan. His vision was all about providing a pathway for academy players to the first team. Essentially, a great long term strategy. Mac - as we have (mostly) all acknowledged is a great coach and, arguably, better in that role than as a manager or technical director. So, let's get them both performing their strongest roles. Cocu as the overarching strategist. Mac as the first team coach. The other plus, as far as the club and FFP is concerned, is that this would be a cheap option. We pay less of a settlement to Cocu and McClaren is now on the payroll. Í think Cocu brought the young players in because he had no or limited other options, rather than a master plan. The kids were already being developed when he arrived, he just threw them on to the pitch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yani P Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 Cocu was an abject failure if you look at it in terms of progression of a plan..im pretty sure we have thankfully moved on and looking forward to the next long term plan without Mel interfering with it....will be interesting if nothing else.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 3 minutes ago, StrawHillRam said: Í think Cocu brought the young players in because he had no or limited other options, rather than a master plan. The kids were already being developed when he arrived, he just threw them on to the pitch Oooh how dare you say such things. It's not like he dropped them when the crunch came? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
europia Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 3 hours ago, IslandExile said: No, no, hear me out. Whether you liked the play under Cocu or not, he's the first manager we've had for years, if not decades, that has had a long term plan. His vision was all about providing a pathway for academy players to the first team. Essentially, a great long term strategy. Mac - as we have (mostly) all acknowledged is a great coach and, arguably, better in that role than as a manager or technical director. So, let's get them both performing their strongest roles. Cocu as the overarching strategist. Mac as the first team coach. The other plus, as far as the club and FFP is concerned, is that this would be a cheap option. We pay less of a settlement to Cocu and McClaren is now on the payroll. Crazy idea. In which case, expect it to be announced just before Coventry City match..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yani P Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 Also I'm still convinced a great deal of the youngsters progress would have been down to Jodie Morris.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IslandExile Posted November 30, 2020 Author Share Posted November 30, 2020 10 minutes ago, StrawHillRam said: Í think Cocu brought the young players in because he had no or limited other options, rather than a master plan. The kids were already being developed when he arrived, he just threw them on to the pitch So you're not aware of Cocu's previous management record of developing academy players? Or the fact that MM hired him on that basis? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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