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Get in Big Sam

ChaddRam

By ChaddRam
in Derby County Forum

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LeedsCityRam

LeedsCityRam

Posted
Posted
2 hours ago, ChaddRam said:

If we somehow cant convince Rafa or he wont come till the end of the season, then the only option for me is Sam Allardyce, yes the football may be boring but we need results quick to get out of this mess. He would certainly get the best out of what we have and make us hard to beat. Get him till the end of the season at least and re evaluate in the close season. He certainly has experience. 

He doesnt suit our current squad at all.

Whilst he has a reputation for making teams hard to beat, he can only work with what we have. He traditionally relies on highly athletic, quick, powerful players and we have precious few of them. That would then mean a spending splurge in January & we dont have the cash.

There's also the long term to consider. Whilst folk might tolerate agricultural football in the short term to get up the table, they won't accept it when we stabilise...you only need to look at Rowett's reign for that.

There are managers out there who would improve us quickly & are much better suited to our current players & fan expectations.

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Millenniumram

Millenniumram

Posted
Posted

Duck it, I’m warming to the idea. Normally I’d absolutely hate appointing one of the old dinosaur managers, it goes against everything we’ve been building. But everything we’ve been building currently has us in serious danger of relegation to League One. The situation is dire, and it needs sorting, no matter how ugly it is. At the moment, I’ll take any style of football which gets us results and pulls us away from the relegation zone. Going down to League One would be an absolute disaster which needs avoiding at all costs.

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AndyinLiverpool

AndyinLiverpool

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Millenniumram said:

Duck it, I’m warming to the idea. Normally I’d absolutely hate appointing one of the old dinosaur managers, it goes against everything we’ve been building. But everything we’ve been building currently has us in serious danger of relegation to League One. The situation is dire, and it needs sorting, no matter how ugly it is. At the moment, I’ll take any style of football which gets us results and pulls us away from the relegation zone. Going down to League One would be an absolute disaster which needs avoiding at all costs.

Where does one draw the line with 'ugly'? As @LeedsCityRampointed out, we tolerated 'ugly' with Rowett up to the point where we started to lose more games.

Allardyce is another kind of 'ugly' though. And I'm not referring to that countenance or the football.

Still, we gave Harry Redknapp a job; a man who, let's just say, 'sailed close to the wind' under oath, so it's quite possible that the club is willing to overlook all sorts of off-field shenanigans.

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Millenniumram

Millenniumram

Posted
Posted
9 minutes ago, AndyinLiverpool said:

Where does one draw the line with 'ugly'? As @LeedsCityRampointed out, we tolerated 'ugly' with Rowett up to the point where we started to lose more games.

Allardyce is another kind of 'ugly' though. And I'm not referring to that countenance or the football.

Still, we gave Harry Redknapp a job; a man who, let's just say, 'sailed close to the wind' under oath, so it's quite possible that the club is willing to overlook all sorts of off-field shenanigans.

At this point in time, so long as we’re winning games and avoiding relegation, I honestly don’t care how painful it is to watch. It can’t be worse than losing every week without even threatening a goal.

Its a horrible thing to discuss, and I really don’t like advocating it, but I fear it’s a necessary evil right now. We’re in a right mess at the moment.

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AndyinLiverpool

AndyinLiverpool

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3 minutes ago, Millenniumram said:

At this point in time, so long as we’re winning games and avoiding relegation, I honestly don’t care how painful it is to watch. It can’t be worse than losing every week without even threatening a goal.

Its a horrible thing to discuss, and I really don’t like advocating it, but I fear it’s a necessary evil right now. We’re in a right mess at the moment.

In 'The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp', the main character starts off believing that to fight an enemy, you have to have principles - that right is might. Those around him see this as ridiculous and that to win, you have to fight fire with fire - that might is right. He continues to be a tragicomic figure until the Nazis are at his doorstep and he realises that the others were right all along. 

You have made that journey. I am still the ridiculous Colonel Blimp character standing by my principles in victory or defeat. ?

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JfR

JfR

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Posted

My issue with Allardyce or similar is that I don't see how appointing them would actually solve the issue that's been plaguing us the most this season, which is that we're not scoring goals.

Allardyce is a really good manager at shoring up an underperforming defence, but if you look at the teams that he's done a "firefighter" job at, they didn't have an issue in front of the opposition goal, they just couldn't keep them out at their end. For example, Everton had scored 17 in 14 when he took them over, which was a top half goalscoring record. Crystal Palace had scored 28 in 17, which was a goalscoring record only beaten by the 5 teams that made up the top 5 at the time. There were games when they were scoring 3 or 4 goals but the problem was they were conceding 4 or 5. Their issues were defensive.

When you look at the job that Allardyce did at these clubs, he got results by sacrificing attacking success for a greater defensive rigidity. If you take the Palace job, for example, they scored 6 goals fewer in 4 more games under Allardyce than they had done under Pardew at the start of the season, but Allardyce also got them conceding 0.4 goals fewer per game. And that's fine. The defence was identified as the problem, so they got a manager in that knew how to defend better, and that ultimately kept them up when they could have easily have gone down.

I don't think these are Derby's issues, though. I think there were clear defensive issues in the first three games of the season, where we conceded 8 in 3 games, but since then our defensive record has been good. 9 in 9 from matchday 4 onwards is the 7th best defensive record in the league over that period. The 5 goals we've scored is just not enough, though, but I'm not convinced that Allardyce's expertise is to resolve that.

I think rather than looking at an Allardyce, we need someone that can be the "Allardyce of attack," someone that can come in and drill a better attacking structure into the frontline like Allardyce can do with a defensive structure in a backline. 

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AndyinLiverpool

AndyinLiverpool

Posted
Posted
10 minutes ago, JustOneChrissyMartin said:

Would we ever see Buchanan, Knight, Sibley or Bird again?

Go all out for Eddie Howe imo.

We wouldn't need to see them. Unless they can run on to a flick by the big man up top, they're no good to Allardyce.

In fact, I would suggest that these are the very antithesis of what Allardyce likes in his midfield.

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