Electric Vehicles

[therealhantsram]

23 minutes ago, ImARam2 said:

I've had a Toyota Rav4 Hybrid for 18 months and it is an excellent motor.

I've travelled to London and Suffolk several times over that time, and my get an average of 55 mpg, and my best on a short trip to the Peak District (no motorways & just small A-roads, has been 66 mpg.

Actually I will be seriously considering that for my next car. Against Honda CRV hybrid. 

I am tempted by full EV, because it's very rare I do lots of mike's nowadays, but they do seem to be so expensive. 

So maybe another few years and price of those will come down.

[oomarkwright]

12 hours ago, therealhantsram said:

Actually... 

I am tempted by full EV, because it's very rare I do lots of mike's nowadays, but they do seem to be so expensive. 

So... 

I never do a Mike. ?

[Wolfie]

My wife's CHR goes back to the lease company next month and we've just bought a Kona Hybrid to replace it. We couldn't afford or justify the cost of full electric but I'm happy with what we've got.

If anything, it seems to be in electric mode more than the CHR was (currently averaging just over 60mpg for mostly local pootling). It's not as much fun to throw at a corner but Miss Wolfie prefers it because the CHR had very resticted rear seat view due to the almost coupe shape of it & small rear windows.

[BucksRam]

Not ready for a full electric yet, nor can I afford one whilst they're still ridiculously priced, but I have recently been looking at the Skoda Enyaq IV as a replacement for my current petrol Skoda Kodiaq 2.0 TSi.  Seems to tick the boxes of everything I'd want - comfort, acceleration, space, design and looks. Just need to get round the £40k price tag plus the fact there are simply not enough charging points around at the moment to support us all going electric. 

[therealhantsram]

1 hour ago, BucksRam said:

Not ready for a full electric yet, nor can I afford one whilst they're still ridiculously priced, but I have recently been looking at the Skoda Enyaq IV as a replacement for my current petrol Skoda Kodiaq 2.0 TSi.  Seems to tick the boxes of everything I'd want - comfort, acceleration, space, design and looks. Just need to get round the £40k price tag plus the fact there are simply not enough charging points around at the moment to support us all going electric. 

Looks a real nice car. Interesting to see theyve gone rear wheel drive. I guess we will see more of that as cars switch to batteries.

[BucksRam]

1 hour ago, therealhantsram said:

Looks a real nice car. Interesting to see they've gone rear wheel drive. I guess we will see more of that as cars switch to batteries.

Yeah they are nice.  If you go top of the range and get the 80x or the VrS then you get a separate motor driving the front wheels, so badged as 4x4s.  

[therealhantsram]

Just read an article saying how Norway are way ahead in the move to electric cars. 64% of sales in July were full electric cars. Only 9% were traditional petrol or diesel cars. The balance being hybrids.

So surprising for a country in which so much of its wealth comes from oil and gas industry.

Ford Mustang and Skoda Enyiak leading the electric car sales.

[Shake n Bake]

My mate just got a Hyundai Iconiq and he's calculated that his annual electricity cost for his 10 mile commute and a few trips down south will be £89. That's if he only charges it up on his drive, which he never does as there are free charging stations at his local Tesco and workplace. It's making me seriously consider going full electric for my next car.

[kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong]

4 minutes ago, Shake n Bake said:

My mate just got a Hyundai Iconiq and he's calculated that his annual electricity cost for his 10 mile commute and a few trips down south will be £89. That's if he only charges it up on his drive, which he never does as there are free charging stations at his local Tesco and workplace. It's making me seriously consider going full electric for my next car.

Definetly..we currently tow a caravan so a full electic isn't ideal.yet but my next car will be once it's gone.

[Shake n Bake]

2 minutes ago, kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong said:

Definetly..we currently tow a caravan so a full electic isn't ideal.yet but my next car will be once it's gone.

My mate doesn't tow, but he goes down south a lot and said the amount of charging points means you can go to the more remote parts of Devon and Cornwall without having to worry. The technology is always improving too, so won't be long before you can comfortably tow a caravan all the way to Lands End on a single charge (if it's not already possible!)

[kash_a_ram_a_ding_dong]

Just now, Shake n Bake said:

My mate doesn't tow, but he goes down south a lot and said the amount of charging points means you can go to the more remote parts of Devon and Cornwall without having to worry. The technology is always improving too, so won't be long before you can comfortably tow a caravan all the way to Lands End on a single charge (if it's not already possible!)

Proably not just yet,the drag is massive.

But,once they start making charge points where you can drive in with a trailer attached it will be possible.

The Skoda enyiak,vw id4,the new Kia Ioniq plus Tesla's can already tow a caravan,it's just the charging that the problem.

It will soon be sorted tho ??

[jono]

Who wouldn’t want an electric car. Fewer moving parts, Instant response, linear max torque and power across all throttle settings and speed. Silent, smooth. It’s brilliant. I’d even suggest that on the more expensive models that range has been sorted. Anything over 250 miles is comparable to Petrol engines a generation ago. 
 

Charging points and access are one thing, yet for me the big issue is charging TIME. Unless that improves then the number of charging points doesn’t just have to be equal to the number of existing petrol pumps. It has to exceed it by an order of magnitude. 

A conventional fuel pump can probably fill one vehicle say every 5 minutes. That’s 12 per hour. A charging point, if you’re lucky will do 1 per hour .. so with technology as it stands we need 10 times more electric charging points than we currently have petroleum pumps. … It’s huge ! The 4 you see at a Motorway service station will need to be 100 plus. (Unless we can charge quicker) 

Both in scale and placement. It’s also the physical space needed and that’s before we get to supply cable laying. 
 

We live in interesting times.
Need to solve the time it takes to charge ! 

[therealhantsram]

24 minutes ago, jono said:

Who wouldn’t want an electric car. Fewer moving parts, Instant response, linear max torque and power across all throttle settings and speed. Silent, smooth. It’s brilliant. I’d even suggest that on the more expensive models that range has been sorted. Anything over 250 miles is comparable to Petrol engines a generation ago. 
 

Charging points and access are one thing, yet for me the big issue is charging TIME. Unless that improves then the number of charging points doesn’t just have to be equal to the number of existing petrol pumps. It has to exceed it by an order of magnitude. 

A conventional fuel pump can probably fill one vehicle say every 5 minutes. That’s 12 per hour. A charging point, if you’re lucky will do 1 per hour .. so with technology as it stands we need 10 times more electric charging points than we currently have petroleum pumps. … It’s huge ! The 4 you see at a Motorway service station will need to be 100 plus. (Unless we can charge quicker) 

Both in scale and placement. It’s also the physical space needed and that’s before we get to supply cable laying. 
 

We live in interesting times.
Need to solve the time it takes to charge ! 

You make a lot of great points. The one thing I think won't be an issue though is space. We have space, just different spaces will be used vs. Filling stations. We will get used to charging in supermarket carparks, at work, in shopping centre car parks, at the cinema and so on. Any business that has a physical location where they want you to stop a while will be putting this infrastructure in over the next few years.

[Gaspode]

33 minutes ago, jono said:

Who wouldn’t want an electric car. Fewer moving parts, Instant response, linear max torque and power across all throttle settings and speed. Silent, smooth. It’s brilliant. I’d even suggest that on the more expensive models that range has been sorted. Anything over 250 miles is comparable to Petrol engines a generation ago. 
 

Charging points and access are one thing, yet for me the big issue is charging TIME. Unless that improves then the number of charging points doesn’t just have to be equal to the number of existing petrol pumps. It has to exceed it by an order of magnitude. 

A conventional fuel pump can probably fill one vehicle say every 5 minutes. That’s 12 per hour. A charging point, if you’re lucky will do 1 per hour .. so with technology as it stands we need 10 times more electric charging points than we currently have petroleum pumps. … It’s huge ! The 4 you see at a Motorway service station will need to be 100 plus. (Unless we can charge quicker) 

Both in scale and placement. It’s also the physical space needed and that’s before we get to supply cable laying. 
 

We live in interesting times.
Need to solve the time it takes to charge ! 

A good post, however the reason I can't change to electric is a combination of both range and charging - if I have to go away from home for work, I can be away for several days - as I often work on customer sites and don't know the availability of charging at the customer site or any hotel I stay at, I need at least a (genuine) 400 mile range - not a problem with my 'horrible' (environmentally, relatively friendly Euro Cat6) diesel but a none starter for electric. Additionally, don't ignore the costs of replacing babtteries on older electric vehicles - somehting that's likely to have a major impact on re-sale values in a few years time.....

[jono]

56 minutes ago, therealhantsram said:

You make a lot of great points. The one thing I think won't be an issue though is space. We have space, just different spaces will be used vs. Filling stations. We will get used to charging in supermarket carparks, at work, in shopping centre car parks, at the cinema and so on. Any business that has a physical location where they want you to stop a while will be putting this infrastructure in over the next few years.

Great point ! You can see a world where it’s “come to our shopping centre and get free vehicle charging with your car park fee”  or Pay £5 pounds for parking and get an 8Kwh of charge”  or however it gets dressed up to attract customers and generate revenue. 
 

in terms of replacing fuel duty you could well see taxation on electricity dispensed through public and private charging systems taken by HMG at the point of payment, cheap and easy to administrate as is fuel duty and why it’s so attractive
 

it’s a huge infrastructure project that is going to take 10 + years to put in place. The thing that strikes me as most difficult is not so much the generating capacity (a big job to do in a green way ) but the cabling and equipment for all that high voltage supply.

[jono]

The other thing I’d very much like to see from EV producers is a minimum range figure. Flat out, cold weather, in the dark with the A/C on full wack. 
 

Years ago I had a certain 1500 cc hot hatch with twin carbs. Driven lightly while I ran it in, I got 40 MPG … Driven hard and heavy footed opening both chokes, enjoying it … went down to low 20’s … huge variation. No different, often worse, with batteries but so little data is published. 
 

I know there are standard tests and cycles that go in the advertising blurb but they are the barest of indications at best,  and at worst misleading. 

[sage]

On 17/08/2021 at 12:25, therealhantsram said:

Just read an article saying how Norway are way ahead in the move to electric cars. 64% of sales in July were full electric cars. Only 9% were traditional petrol or diesel cars. The balance being hybrids.

So surprising for a country in which so much of its wealth comes from oil and gas industry.

Ford Mustang and Skoda Enyiak leading the electric car sales.

Because they invested their Oil Revenue money,  we gave ours away to rich people. 

[jono]

14 hours ago, sage said:

Because they invested their Oil Revenue money,  we gave ours away to rich people. 

Not quite .. they had more revenue and 10 x fewer people to spread it amongst. 
 

A Norwegian I know thinks it is a disgrace how wealthy they are but how poor their social care sector provisions are. 

[Ghost of Clough]

Every owner of an electric car for the past week...

[TigerTedd]

The infrastructure question is an interesting one. But one I hadn’t considered til I spoke to my sister recently (who’s a civil engineer), is how people charge at home if they don’t have their own driveway, without having a 50m long cable that you poke out you’re front window and take down the street, tripping everyone up as you go? Answers on a post card. 

Her colleague bought a Tesla, but he lives in a flat with a designated parking space. No option to charge at home, so he charges at work, but it’s a risky business.