Rev Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 44 minutes ago, kevinhectoring said: but Rev do we have the information to be able to make a judgement on this ? BZG might quite reasonably have decided to let the lawyers get that court ruling, not least to save further legal costs. They are in UAE - they don't necessarily give a monkeys about English court rulings. There's no suggestion on line that I can see that the court application was even challenged It comes down to morals, I suppose. Run up a debt to an English company, don't pay it because you're not based in the UK, let the high court settle against you, but don't pay it as you are overseas and it's not enforceable. Not exactly the kind of behaviour that makes me think these are trusted custodians of the club moving forward, I'll be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 6 minutes ago, Rev said: It comes down to morals, I suppose. Run up a debt to an English company, don't pay it because you're not based in the UK, let the high court settle against you, but don't pay it as you are overseas and it's not enforceable. Not exactly the kind of behaviour that makes me think these are trusted custodians of the club moving forward, I'll be honest. The directors of BZG might think carefully whether they want to be in a position of being potentially arrested if they ever set foot in the UK by ignoring the ruling of the UK court. Might not bother them at all but then again... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB SPORTS Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 On 10/01/2021 at 17:27, ShoreRam said: And there was a player who had all the attributes physically but never reached his potential, IMO. Injuries played a big part in that though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 1 hour ago, Rev said: It comes down to morals, I suppose. Run up a debt to an English company, don't pay it because you're not based in the UK, let the high court settle against you, but don't pay it as you are overseas and it's not enforceable. Not exactly the kind of behaviour that makes me think these are trusted custodians of the club moving forward, I'll be honest. Find out what happened and then we can have a conversation about morals. I suspect that if we both knew what has gone on then we’d be able to agree pretty quickly on whether or not they were justified in what they did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 1 hour ago, DCFC27 said: Hang on, we pay our money to be fans of the club, they have to earn our respect fella. Ok. But tens of people on this forum and hundreds on Twitter have jumped to the conclusion that these guys will not be good owners of the club. On NO evidence. We need to be patient, take the rough with the smooth and we need to understand we don’t have an entitlement to confidential information Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 1 hour ago, Van der MoodHoover said: The directors of BZG might think carefully whether they want to be in a position of being potentially arrested if they ever set foot in the UK by ignoring the ruling of the UK court. Might not bother them at all but then again... it’s a civil not a criminal order and it’s against the company not the directors. So I don’t think there’s a risk of that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chester40 Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 5 hours ago, kevinhectoring said: Ok. But tens of people on this forum and hundreds on Twitter have jumped to the conclusion that these guys will not be good owners of the club. On NO evidence. We need to be patient, take the rough with the smooth and we need to understand we don’t have an entitlement to confidential information The problem with that perspective is it a little reactionary. By the time you are sure, its too late. Lots of clubs have owners who lead them through years of turmoil...'taking the rough with the smooth' for fans of clubs like Wigan, Bury, Charlton, Coventry, Blackpool...has been pretty traumatic. I don't have an issue with fans wanting more information about an owner's intentions before they have their feet under the table and there is no way of turning back time. We know Mel has had good intentions, no reason not to ask lots of questions about the incoming investors because let's be honest we know very little. If they can't take or understand that, then are they the right people. No, we arent 'entitled' to every last detail but I would always like communication from the owners and I hope we get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamworthram Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 3 minutes ago, Chester40 said: The problem with that perspective is it a little reactionary. By the time you are sure, its too late. Lots of clubs have owners who lead them through years of turmoil...'taking the rough with the smooth' for fans of clubs like Wigan, Bury, Charlton, Coventry, Blackpool...has been pretty traumatic. I don't have an issue with fans wanting more information about an owner's intentions before they have their feet under the table and there is no way of turning back time. We know Mel has had good intentions, no reason not to ask lots of questions about the incoming investors because let's be honest we know very little. If they can't take or understand that, then are they the right people. No, we arent 'entitled' to every last detail but I would always like communication from the owners and I hope we get it. 100% agree with your final sentence. However, regarding your opening remark, too late for what? Whatever conclusions fans jump to on things like social media in the absence of any evidence, isn’t going to change the outcome. Mel isn’t going to read Twitter and think “hang on, people on Twitter reckon this guy is dodgy, I’d better do a bit more due diligence”. So, the fans CAN wait and arrive a slightly more informed opinion. I don’t have a problem with people voicing views on the merits or otherwise of the takeover in general and sharing cautionary tales from other clubs but, in some peoples eyes (mostly on Twitter but still some on here) this guy is the devil incarnate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mucker1884 Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 7 hours ago, DCFC27 said: Hang on, we pay our money to be fans of the club, they have to earn our respect fella. Everyone has my respect... until they "Dis-earn" it. Is that the same thing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chester40 Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 13 minutes ago, Tamworthram said: 100% agree with your final sentence. However, regarding your opening remark, too late for what? Whatever conclusions fans jump to on things like social media in the absence of any evidence, isn’t going to change the outcome. Mel isn’t going to read Twitter and think “hang on, people on Twitter reckon this guy is dodgy, I’d better do a bit more due diligence”. So, the fans CAN wait and arrive a slightly more informed opinion. I don’t have a problem with people voicing views on the merits or otherwise of the takeover in general and sharing cautionary tales from other clubs but, in some peoples eyes (mostly on Twitter but still some on here) this guy is the devil incarnate. I don't know, and totally agree we can't really know or do much about it. So I choose to sit on my hands, cross my fingers and hope. But if other people choose - respectively - to ask for more information and generally fret about what could happen, I'm just saying I totally get it and who knows they may well be right. They will be able to feel 'at least we tried'. Social media does get hysterical at times but I don't agree that we just don't ask questions for fear they don't like it either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlyBritishMidland Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 9 hours ago, DCFC1388 said: For all the people that say the new owners are dodgy etc, what evidence is there to actually support this? From what I can see the Liverpool deal was too expensive and Ashley changed the value for Newcastle. They have been in negotiations since May, what benefit would it be to waste all this time and money with lawyers etc? The time this has taken - for me this doesn't suggest they're dodgy, it shows on both sides they're taking their time to get everything right, why is that a bad thing? Having a poor website - cant believe people use this as something against the new owners. Its not stopped them making mega money and investing mega money in other projects. Not paying the 500k to the lawyers in the Newcastle deal - pretty sure that is an ongoimg dispute. But would you pay a bill you deem unfair or over priced without fighting it? So why should they? You dont get rich by just throwing away cash. The lack of payment to the players - is there actually any evidence this is Derventio's fault? They are reported to have sent the money, if they have proven that to the club then the hold up could be with the lawyers? Anyway, I could be wrong and they could end up not taking over or taking over and being like Fawaz, but for now I see no evidence of them being dodgy. So why dismiss them before they even take over. This is an excellent post. I can’t understand why people are hung up on the time it’s taking or the lack of communication. The Burnley takeover took about nine months, we’ve been in talks since May, so a similar timeframe. Maybe we adopted a slightly different approach in that Burnley went to the EPL for approval and it was completed within a week, suggesting that all the finer details, etc had been resolved. Not saying this is fact but maybe we thought we’d try to get EFL approval sooner before sorting out the details. Therefore, saving time as if we know the EFL wouldn’t approve it there’s no need to carry on. Buying a house takes 4 - 6 months on average and I imagine this is a bit more complicated. The deal and discussions will no doubt be subject to confidentiality clauses, NDA, etc so communication in the public arena would not be allowed unless agreed by both parties. From quotes by Mike Ashley it would seem like he upped the price. I think he said something along the lines of “they’ve got billions so what’s another £10M or so”. Well he kind of answered his own question - you don’t get billions if you start throwing around the millions. I think this bodes well for any transfer dealings, etc. I still think it will happen, probably towards then of the week - no fact I just think they’ll want Rooney to talk to the media at PP or Moor Farm rather than his dining table if he’s to be unveiled as manager. And I’m just trying to give a glass half full perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CBRammette Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 I dont want or expect lots of information or a high profile. I would be quite happy if our new owners quietly just get on with sorting things out behind the scenes with no big dramas, building relationships in the game and just run the club and allow the football to do the talking even if that ends up being building back up from division 1. I know this is a huge wish and not the Derby way Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 1 hour ago, Tamworthram said: 100% agree with your final sentence. However, regarding your opening remark, too late for what? Whatever conclusions fans jump to on things like social media in the absence of any evidence, isn’t going to change the outcome. Mel isn’t going to read Twitter and think “hang on, people on Twitter reckon this guy is dodgy, I’d better do a bit more due diligence”. So, the fans CAN wait and arrive a slightly more informed opinion. I don’t have a problem with people voicing views on the merits or otherwise of the takeover in general and sharing cautionary tales from other clubs but, in some peoples eyes (mostly on Twitter but still some on here) this guy is the devil incarnate. I'd say two failed club takeovers on their CV and the fact the people involved are tied up in a high court legal battle is evidence. They might well be fine and turn out to be wonderful owners, but I totally understand why a lot of Derby fans are sceptical and concerned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YouRams Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 Are we rich yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NottsRammy Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 28 minutes ago, FlyBritishMidland said: This is an excellent post. I can’t understand why people are hung up on the time it’s taking or the lack of communication. The Burnley takeover took about nine months, we’ve been in talks since May, so a similar timeframe. Maybe we adopted a slightly different approach in that Burnley went to the EPL for approval and it was completed within a week, suggesting that all the finer details, etc had been resolved. Not saying this is fact but maybe we thought we’d try to get EFL approval sooner before sorting out the details. Therefore, saving time as if we know the EFL wouldn’t approve it there’s no need to carry on. Buying a house takes 4 - 6 months on average and I imagine this is a bit more complicated. The deal and discussions will no doubt be subject to confidentiality clauses, NDA, etc so communication in the public arena would not be allowed unless agreed by both parties. From quotes by Mike Ashley it would seem like he upped the price. I think he said something along the lines of “they’ve got billions so what’s another £10M or so”. Well he kind of answered his own question - you don’t get billions if you start throwing around the millions. I think this bodes well for any transfer dealings, etc. I still think it will happen, probably towards then of the week - no fact I just think they’ll want Rooney to talk to the media at PP or Moor Farm rather than his dining table if he’s to be unveiled as manager. And I’m just trying to give a glass half full perspective. I think the problem is the lack of clarity towards fans is not helping things at all , well i know thats how i feel . You would think with 2 previous attempts failed and the tiny info being fed to the fans thats it imminent and never happens you cant blame fans for getting worried/angry . We are now in the transfer period and are wasting time and its still imminent , surely if new owners really want the club all the dots and i's would and should have been crossed ready to go into the transfer window . I feel personally there is a happy clappy brigade on here who do nothing but look for posts that are of a complaining sort to try and have an argument or make people feel small for getting angry when its perfectly understandable now . Queue the chill out posts and its only football and get a life posts in reply to this . For me if these lot takeover i think we will rue the day but i will love to be proven wrong . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AutoWindscreens Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 9 hours ago, kevinhectoring said: but Rev do we have the information to be able to make a judgement on this ? BZG might quite reasonably have decided to let the lawyers get that court ruling, not least to save further legal costs. They are in UAE - they don't necessarily give a monkeys about English court rulings. There's no suggestion on line that I can see that the court application was even challenged Do you want owners who don't give a monkeys about English court rulings? What happens when the English court orders that the judgment creditor can enforce against their English assets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jubbs Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 https://www.binzayedinternational.com/ Why are people continuing to use their old website? This is their new one, 100x better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JuanFloEvraTheCocu'sNesta Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 "Profitability is the ultimate measure of our efficiency" they say as they look to complete the takeover of a football club making massive losses ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 10 minutes ago, Jubbs said: https://www.binzayedinternational.com/ Why are people continuing to use their old website? This is their new one, 100x better. or because: Quote Other Bin Zayed websites may contain terms and conditions which are different from these terms and conditions. On your journey around the Bin Zayed websites please check the terms and conditions of each web site which you visit and do not assume that these terms and conditions apply to all Bin Zayed websites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyMac5 Posted January 12, 2021 Share Posted January 12, 2021 31 minutes ago, AutoWindscreens said: Do you want owners who don't give a monkeys about English court rulings? What happens when the English court orders that the judgment creditor can enforce against their English assets? Presume that's why they set up a new company in Derventio? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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