ram1964 Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 If Sm is back i would suggest it shows a lack of imagination ,finances ,forward thinking and initial ambition. One could say the club is going round in circles however it appears to be more spiralling downwards .Sm was a good coach and yes did well for us in the past but we need to move forward ,Appointing Sm in my opinion makes us look clueless and a laughing stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bald Eagle's Barmy Army Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 1 minute ago, ram1964 said: If Sm is back i would suggest it shows a lack of imagination ,finances ,forward thinking and initial ambition. One could say the club is going round in circles however it appears to be more spiralling downwards .Sm was a good coach and yes did well for us in the past but we need to move forward ,Appointing Sm in my opinion makes us look clueless and a laughing stock. Or he's taking us right to the top. We've got somebody with a lot of experience who knows football and Derby inside out. I don't think it's that bad all depending on who comes in as manager. He got us playing some of the best football in the last 20 years - we'd all love that right now, starting tomorrow night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Angry Ram Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 22 hours ago, BIllyD said: How do you determine the success of the academy? Winning U23 leagues is all well and great but is not a sign of success, surely this can only be based upon the success or sale of players produced from the academy, in which case I'm not sure how you can put this under the successful category as yet ? Unless you are top 4 the only measure of success of an academy is if you sell enough of your talent to cover its costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ram1964 Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 2 minutes ago, Bald Eagle's Barmy Army said: Or he's taking us right to the top. We've got somebody with a lot of experience who knows football and Derby inside out. I don't think it's that bad all depending on who comes in as manager. He got us playing some of the best football in the last 20 years - we'd all love that right now, starting tomorrow night. Unimaginative appointment,questionable credibility,, probably earnt more in redundancy payments than employment.Hardly an inspirational appointment ,can't imagine one club kicking their heels that they didn't employ him including Wycombe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 5 hours ago, BIllyD said: We were talking, or I was, about the success as the result of spending additional amounts and moving the philosophy of promoting youth under Mel. What you have highlighted is that we were achieving the same prior to having these additional wonderful new facilities. We could field a full team of youth players who could be considered regulars in the championship, surely you agree though it's not a success if you get relegated with these players ? Something like 10 years for the those in the youngest age group to get to an age where they can start to be considered as part of the first team. Only 5 more years until we can consider whether it was money well spent I guess. Or you can look at the progress year on year. Let's look in terms of birth year for now and those who have played a professional game: 2003: Delap 2002: - 2001: Knight, Whittaker, Sibley, Buchanan, JBrown 2000: Bogle, MBird 1999: JMitchell-Lawson 1998: - 1997: Lowe, MacDonald, JBird 1996: Bennett, Guy, Zanzala, Rawson, Vernam 1995: Hughes, Hanson, KThomas 1994: Dales, Lelan 1993: - 1992: Hendrick, Connolly, Ball, O'Brien 1991: Ojamaa, Mutch, Kean, Severn 1990: GMills, Simmons It seems obvious to me that an increase in academy expenditure is resulting in more consistency in the quality of player coming through. Anyone watching the youth sides over the years will notice the overall ability is improving. These are the players grouped by age group (listed by year they became first year scholars) New scholars by season: 20/21: Roberts, Randle, Rutt, Williams, Cian-Kelly, Borkovic, Brailsford, Christie, Ibrahim 19/20: Solomon, Jinkinson, Bardell, Grewal-Pollard, Matthews, Aghatise, Rogers, Perez de Gracia, SThompson, Nto, Cybulski 18/19: Foster, Halwax, Ebosele, MacDonald, Charles, Cashin, LThompson, Sibley, Wilson, ABrown, Stretton 17/18: French, Buchanan, Minkley, JBrown, MBird, Knight, Dixon, Whittaker 16/17: Fryatt, Carter-Thompson, CThomas, Mbuti, Rashid, JMills, Bogle, JThorne, Haywood, Hitchman, Wise, Jibodu, Mitchell-Lawson, Cresswell, Davie 15/16: Bateman, Davidson-Miller, Edwards, Goode, Magno, Yates 14/15: Babos, Gordon, MacDonald, Barnes, JBird, Carvell, Cover, Mellors, Stabana, EWassall 13/14: Behrens, Lowe, Tuite, Rigby, Moulton, Dryden, Adams, Bennett, Clennett, Vernam, Guy, Zanzala 12/13: Rawson, Hanson, KThomas, Spiriak, Nash, Revan, Capitani, Carrigy, Johnson 11/12: Hughes, Etheridge, Hayes, Berry, Lelan, Sharpe, Dawkins, Dales, AWassall, Wixted From 17/18 we have 4 regulars in the matchday squad, with 1 more having featured in the squad a few times. From 18/19 we have 1 regular in the squad, MacDonald and Wilson have been named on the bench, and there are calls for the inclusion of Ebosele, ABrown and Stretton. Foster's also the most promising keeper our academy has produced since Camp and Grant. All those listed have been training with the first team From 19/20, Solomon was regular during pre-season. We even had Borkovic and Ibrahim from the latest 20/21 group with the first team in pre-season. However, before 17/18, we didn't have many promising players who a lot thought would be first team regulars. Maybe one or 2 each season who had the potential to be squad players, occasionally a player who promised more, with the rest L2 or even non-league quality. With our increased expenditure, we now look to be getting at least a couple a year with PL potential, 4 Championship, and the rest at least L2 level. We need to be generating £6m worth of talent each season to breakeven - that means 1 PL quality player or 3/4 Championship level. The money being spent is proving to be money well spent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinhectoring Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 1 hour ago, ram1964 said: If Sm is back i would suggest it shows a lack of imagination ,finances ,forward thinking and initial ambition. One could say the club is going round in circles however it appears to be more spiralling downwards .Sm was a good coach and yes did well for us in the past but we need to move forward ,Appointing Sm in my opinion makes us look clueless and a laughing stock. the school governors have appointed a stand in Head in case there is squabbling between Liam and Wayne in year 11. He knows Wayne from kindergarten and they reckon he can cope with him. I think it means we have caretakers all season provided they turn it around. And it'll be next summer before we see real money spent and a permanent manager. May be driven by residual FFP concerns - the club's year end is 30 June. Perhaps the 32red contract is a factor. Looking forward to 21/22 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rab a dab doo Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 Bravo bravo I could not have done better myself. Arise Sir laurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerbyNutter Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 It'd be anytime this week right? I'm sure I read that it'd be completed by end of the month so my guess maybe by Friday? The owners still continue doing these Zoom meeting so I suggested that it is already done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angieram Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 19 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said: Something like 10 years for the those in the youngest age group to get to an age where they can start to be considered as part of the first team. Only 5 more years until we can consider whether it was money well spent I guess. Or you can look at the progress year on year. Let's look in terms of birth year for now and those who have played a professional game: 2003: Delap 2002: - 2001: Knight, Whittaker, Sibley, Buchanan, JBrown 2000: Bogle, MBird 1999: JMitchell-Lawson 1998: - 1997: Lowe, MacDonald, JBird 1996: Bennett, Guy, Zanzala, Rawson, Vernam 1995: Hughes, Hanson, KThomas 1994: Dales, Lelan 1993: - 1992: Hendrick, Connolly, Ball, O'Brien 1991: Ojamaa, Mutch, Kean, Severn 1990: GMills, Simmons It seems obvious to me that an increase in academy expenditure is resulting in more consistency in the quality of player coming through. Anyone watching the youth sides over the years will notice the overall ability is improving. These are the players grouped by age group (listed by year they became first year scholars) New scholars by season: 20/21: Roberts, Randle, Rutt, Williams, Cian-Kelly, Borkovic, Brailsford, Christie, Ibrahim 19/20: Solomon, Jinkinson, Bardell, Grewal-Pollard, Matthews, Aghatise, Rogers, Perez de Gracia, SThompson, Nto, Cybulski 18/19: Foster, Halwax, Ebosele, MacDonald, Charles, Cashin, LThompson, Sibley, Wilson, ABrown, Stretton 17/18: French, Buchanan, Minkley, JBrown, MBird, Knight, Dixon, Whittaker 16/17: Fryatt, Carter-Thompson, CThomas, Mbuti, Rashid, JMills, Bogle, JThorne, Haywood, Hitchman, Wise, Jibodu, Mitchell-Lawson, Cresswell, Davie 15/16: Bateman, Davidson-Miller, Edwards, Goode, Magno, Yates 14/15: Babos, Gordon, MacDonald, Barnes, JBird, Carvell, Cover, Mellors, Stabana, EWassall 13/14: Behrens, Lowe, Tuite, Rigby, Moulton, Dryden, Adams, Bennett, Clennett, Vernam, Guy, Zanzala 12/13: Rawson, Hanson, KThomas, Spiriak, Nash, Revan, Capitani, Carrigy, Johnson 11/12: Hughes, Etheridge, Hayes, Berry, Lelan, Sharpe, Dawkins, Dales, AWassall, Wixted From 17/18 we have 4 regulars in the matchday squad, with 1 more having featured in the squad a few times. From 18/19 we have 1 regular in the squad, MacDonald and Wilson have been named on the bench, and there are calls for the inclusion of Ebosele, ABrown and Stretton. Foster's also the most promising keeper our academy has produced since Camp and Grant. All those listed have been training with the first team From 19/20, Solomon was regular during pre-season. We even had Borkovic and Ibrahim from the latest 20/21 group with the first team in pre-season. However, before 17/18, we didn't have many promising players who a lot thought would be first team regulars. Maybe one or 2 each season who had the potential to be squad players, occasionally a player who promised more, with the rest L2 or even non-league quality. With our increased expenditure, we now look to be getting at least a couple a year with PL potential, 4 Championship, and the rest at least L2 level. We need to be generating £6m worth of talent each season to breakeven - that means 1 PL quality player or 3/4 Championship level. The money being spent is proving to be money well spent. Where do Kellan Gordon and Timi Max Elsnik fit into this, GOC? Neither on your list - is that because we let them go free or because they weren't in the Academy long enough? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 6 minutes ago, angieram said: Where do Kellan Gordon and Timi Max Elsnik fit into this, GOC? Neither on your list - is that because we let them go free or because they weren't in the Academy long enough? I've only listed those who were first year scholars (1st year at U18 level). I missed Gordon off the 14/15 group. Elsnik signed as an 18 year old and went straight into the U21 (now U23) squad. I would have gone further back but struggled to find information with full lists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ziggyram59 Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 Another day and what have we heard? Nothing, will it ever happen? or is Mel Morris taking us for idiots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerbyNutter Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 23 minutes ago, ziggyram59 said: Another day and what have we heard? Nothing, will it ever happen? or is Mel Morris taking us for idiots? It'll happen. Be patient Ziggy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mwram1973 Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 21 minutes ago, ziggyram59 said: Another day and what have we heard? Nothing, will it ever happen? or is Mel Morris taking us for idiots? No, only the impatient ones, Rooney has spoken to the new owners and has said so. Mac's back and will become an advisor once the new owners are in place. All this wouldn't happen if it wasn't going through. It'll get done, it's a multi million pound deal, he's not buying a 2nd hand car showroom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaspode Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 27 minutes ago, ziggyram59 said: Another day and what have we heard? Nothing, will it ever happen? or is Mel Morris taking us for idiots? just you mate.....? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ziggyram59 Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 6 minutes ago, Gaspode said: just you mate.....? Very Funny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ziggyram59 Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 11 minutes ago, DerbyNutter said: It'll happen. Be patient Ziggy. I will try my friend just seems like nothing happens every day. I get hope thinking is this the day and no and it just seems to drag on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DerbyNutter Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 4 minutes ago, ziggyram59 said: I will try my friend just seems like nothing happens every day. I get hope thinking is this the day and no and it just seems to drag on. Yes I understand that mate. They can't say when it will be announced etc. I know that you and other people would like to know what's happening so so. My guess by Friday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ziggyram59 Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 12 minutes ago, DerbyNutter said: Yes I understand that mate. They can't say when it will be announced etc. I know that you and other people would like to know what's happening so so. My guess by Friday. Hope so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
one_chop Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 It's all going to be an anticlimax anyway. Most poster's are thinking Man City, I'd expect Cork City then you won't be too disappointed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RadioactiveWaste Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 I think we'd all be more relaxed had we not had this purgatory before with investors. He happier what it's resolved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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