This isn't all on Cocu

[RoyMac5]

19 minutes ago, YorkshireRam said:

Which ties back into my initial point, he's bringing in the players that can execute the game plan, a bit of patience until they are up to speed is all that may be needed

That he hopes can execute the game plan. Afterall he's still having to tell Clarke what it is he's doing 'wrong'.

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

1 hour ago, Mostyn6 said:

Can somebody actually define Cocu’s vision? Does it actually exist?

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

1 hour ago, Mostyn6 said:

Can somebody actually define Cocu’s vision? Does it actually exist?

 

[Justa]

7 hours ago, Big Trav said:

Just give the man until after the international break. When he’ll actually have a full fit squad 

When does any manager have a fully fit squad ?

[Rampage]

6 minutes ago, Justa said:

When does any manager have a fully fit squad ?

Never

[Shaftesbury st]

6 hours ago, Curtains said:

What with Academy players. 

You don’t win games you get flack, these aren’t academy players they are first team players from the academy, how long you going to keep holding onto that?. 
 

I think with the quality of the whole squad they should be better, good quality ex academy players who have quite rightly played their way in. 
 

I note you are proud of never criticising Lawrence, I’m not really sure there’s much more to say on that point

[Curtains]

4 minutes ago, Shaftesbury st said:

You don’t win games you get flack, these aren’t academy players they are first team players from the academy, how long you going to keep holding onto that?. 
 

I think with the quality of the whole squad they should be better, good quality ex academy players who have quite rightly played their way in. 
 

I note you are proud of never criticising Lawrence, I’m not really sure there’s much more to say on that point

Oh go on share it. 
 

Ex Academy players .

Blimey they have proved nothing yet. 
 

Remember Callum Ball and Miles Addison 
 

[DCFC1388]

City & Guardiola have shown today that these types of results happen. Even more so when you are short of first team players, no forward, new signings & youth players.

Cocu will get the team playing how he wants once he can field the team he wants. He is building something here and this is his first proper season where he is able to start shaping the squad how he wants.

[ScamRam]

5 minutes ago, DCFC1388 said:

City & Guardiola have shown today that these types of results happen. Even more so when you are short of first team players, no forward, new signings & youth players.

Cocu will get the team playing how he wants once he can field the team he wants. He is building something here and this is his first proper season where he is able to start shaping the squad how he wants.

This. I admit I have only watched the highlights but were we as bad as people have made out? Johnson hit 2 sweet strikes, the like of which he hasnt hit since we routed Hull 5-0 a few years ago. Would Man City really have lost a game 2-5, at home, with a full stadium? Football and the world is really weird at the moment. People cannot seriously make judgements on Cocu's ability in this sterile, atmosphere-less environment. 

[DCFC1388]

3 minutes ago, ScamRam said:

This. I admit I have only watched the highlights but were we as bad as people have made out? Johnson hit 2 sweet strikes, the like of which he hasnt hit since we routed Hull 5-0 a few years ago. Would Man City really have lost a game 2-5, at home, with a full stadium? Football and the world is really weird at the moment. People cannot seriously make judgements on Cocu's ability in this sterile, atmosphere-less environment. 

Started well, had a crazy 4mins where we conceded 3 goals and the game was gone. Very open defensively but was that because we were 3 down already? 

We will however improve when players return and maybe yesterday was the kick up the backside the players needed

[S8TY]

I was at Tranmere when we got  smashed 5-1 fans calling for manager to go and fans singing to that affect ..we got promoted that season after a terrible start .but we turned it around with one player Stimac ....this team imo needs two big players one of them a striker the other a central midfield powerhouse ...that may be Beilik I’m not sure but the championship is a league where if you string a few results together you go places ...I will admit I am less convinced that Cocu has the backing of the players after looking at Rooney and a few yesterday they were not fighting for the right to play ....Cocu mentioned this ....also ...I never ( apart from new signing Byrne ) have heard any player mention Cocu at all ...they never say anything about the manager and I find that odd ...that usually means they don’t like or agree with the gameplan etc in my experience ...also and I hope I’m wrong but ...when I spent some time in Holland the coaching was very technique based not fitness based and I don’t know if this has changed but I think we look leggy compared to other sides at times ...just my opinion ...I’m still a Cocu fan because I like him and beleive in the Cocu Pep G philosophy of how to play and both are Barcelona and Cruyff influenced but....Phil  has to start turning this around with either new players or whatever it takes and looking at players yesterday I am worried it might be too late as I didn’t like the players body language ...hope I’m wrong though 

[Gee SCREAMER !!]

50 minutes ago, Curtains said:

Oh go on share it. 
 

Ex Academy players .

Blimey they have proved nothing yet. 
 

Remember Callum Ball and Miles Addison 
 

Miles Addison was a very decent player. Till Clough made him play 98 minutes away at Newcastle in his first game back from a 5 month layoff.  An i have no players push to the board. The result- a stress fracture in the foot became a broken one having hobbled round for the last twenty minutes 

MOM that day but it wrecked his career.

[IslandExile]

15 minutes ago, S8TY said:

I was at Tranmere when we got  smashed 5-1 fans calling for manager to go and fans singing to that affect ..we got promoted that season after a terrible start .but we turned it around with one player Stimac ....this team imo needs two big players one of them a striker the other a central midfield powerhouse ...that may be Beilik I’m not sure but the championship is a league where if you string a few results together you go places ...I will admit I am less convinced that Cocu has the backing of the players after looking at Rooney and a few yesterday they were not fighting for the right to play ....Cocu mentioned this ....also ...I never ( apart from new signing Byrne ) have heard any player mention Cocu at all ...they never say anything about the manager and I find that odd ...that usually means they don’t like or agree with the gameplan etc in my experience ...also and I hope I’m wrong but ...when I spent some time in Holland the coaching was very technique based not fitness based and I don’t know if this has changed but I think we look leggy compared to other sides at times ...just my opinion ...I’m still a Cocu fan because I like him and beleive in the Cocu Pep G philosophy of how to play and both are Barcelona and Cruyff influenced but....Phil  has to start turning this around with either new players or whatever it takes and looking at players yesterday I am worried it might be too late as I didn’t like the players body language ...hope I’m wrong though 

Duncan said something along the lines of the manager being a key reason he came to Derby. That and that there was a clear pathway for youngsters to get into the first team.

[RoyMac5]

4 minutes ago, IslandExile said:

Duncan said something along the lines of the manager being a key reason he came to Derby. That and that there was a clear pathway for youngsters to get into the first team.

Well yeah there's no experienced striker blocking his way! ?

[Jourdan]

43 minutes ago, DCFC1388 said:

City & Guardiola have shown today that these types of results happen. Even more so when you are short of first team players, no forward, new signings & youth players.

Cocu will get the team playing how he wants once he can field the team he wants. He is building something here and this is his first proper season where he is able to start shaping the squad how he wants.

Who cares about City and Guardiola? They can spend £50 million on a Portuguese international to try and remedy the problem. We don’t have that luxury.

Yes, freak results can happen but the lesson from that game is that poor defending will be punished and even top sides can’t afford to defend badly. Nothing more, nothing less. Exactly the same with Chelsea and United in recent games.

You can’t possibly say that it comes down to missing players. City are capable of fielding two elevens that would be comfortably better than the majority of the the PL.

The situation with City and Guardiola bears no comparison. Today’s result will be a one off. We have lost 8 of our last 11 competitive games. Big difference.

 

[Big Trav]

4 minutes ago, RoyMac5 said:

Well yeah there's no experienced striker blocking his way! ?

Apart from waghorn and marriott

[RoyMac5]

1 minute ago, Big Trav said:

Apart from waghorn and marriott

?

[Andicis]

Look at Cocu's work at Fenerbahce. They were just above the relegation zone when he was fired, and did considerably better when he went. I'm sure all of his work has solid principles behind them, but I don't think he's a man motivator. I don't think he is the guy, when the team has their backs against the wall, are going to listen to. 

I think he's guilty of over complicating things. Football is a pretty simply game really. I like the squad Cocu's building. But much like I felt with Nigel Clough, he's never going to be the man who takes the squad up. It'll be his successor that is rewarded for it. 

[DRBee]

1 hour ago, DCFC1388 said:

City & Guardiola have shown today that these types of results happen. Even more so when you are short of first team players, no forward, new signings & youth players.

Cocu will get the team playing how he wants once he can field the team he wants. He is building something here and this is his first proper season where he is able to start shaping the squad how he wants.

Commentary from the game " good teams move the ball quickly".       Under Cocu we almost never do this  preferring slow build up, back passing and getting ourselves into trouble, we don't press other teams  - its horrible.

[Tyler Durden]

1 hour ago, DCFC1388 said:

City & Guardiola have shown today that these types of results happen. Even more so when you are short of first team players, no forward, new signings & youth players.

Cocu will get the team playing how he wants once he can field the team he wants. He is building something here and this is his first proper season where he is able to start shaping the squad how he wants.

I really want to believe what you're saying, really do.