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44 minutes ago, Eddie said:

It is interesting - and perhaps that is because of huge advances in treatment of those who are critically ill.

Back in April, the old people's homes were dealing with a huge influx of patients with Covid-19, many of whom had been sent to them carrying the virus (for whatever reason) having been discharged from hospitals. I would think that the same mistake won't be made a second time.

While it's unfathomable, the NHS is apparently once again sending patients back to care homes without giving them Covid tests first. It is extraordinary that hospital managers are trying to do this and the care homes should refuse to take them without tests on the day. The government probably should step in and try to stop this but they cannot be responsible for every minute detail of everything happening in the country, when it is simply common sense. I know the NHS is the national religion and most people have faith it can do no wrong, but they are sadly ignoring the evidence of their own eyes.

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30 minutes ago, Carl Sagan said:

While it's unfathomable, the NHS is apparently once again sending patients back to care homes without giving them Covid tests first. It is extraordinary that hospital managers are trying to do this and the care homes should refuse to take them without tests on the day. The government probably should step in and try to stop this but they cannot be responsible for every minute detail of everything happening in the country, when it is simply common sense. I know the NHS is the national religion and most people have faith it can do no wrong, but they are sadly ignoring the evidence of their own eyes.

Scary.

Perhaps when I half-jokingly referred to a 'cull' and 'geronticide' a few months ago, I wasn't too far wide of the mark.

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8 hours ago, 1of4 said:

Do you know that Ron DeSantis the Governor of Florida had many of the virus case numbers suppressed.

He also had a government employee sacked for not following his orders. When they carried on publishing the true covid figures, he had them arrested on trumped up chargers.

I don't know from where you sourced the graph, so the nice chart you happily posted may not be showing the true numbers. Just thoughtit was interesting.

Interesting they maybe lying about numbers, surely that would be classed as  a kind of corporate manslaughter If true as they are opening things up based on falsifying information knowing people will die. That’s a very strong allegation and worrying if true.  

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10 hours ago, BIllyD said:

If there was ever a case of a graph being created to try to prove a point whilst ignoring many other factors, I think you have found it 😀

If we ignore the other states in the country and wonder why they are not on the graph, I'll try to give you some answers based upon my limited knowledge.

California is America's most populated and also diverse state. Lockdowns don't tell the story of how the virus is spreading within this state, the conditions for migrant workers are a breeding ground for COVID, then you have the conditions they live in that are very difficult to stick to the self isolating rules. Number of ICU beds is also one of the lowest per population, they are struggling with outbreaks in places like prisons and in general the population of this state has a higher number on average of people with chronic illnesses.

Yeah it’s interesting, as I stated so many variables to consider. I guess it’s like thinking following what other countries have done so successfully will work here without considering all those differences. 

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8 hours ago, Eddie said:

It is interesting - and perhaps that is because of huge advances in treatment of those who are critically ill.

Back in April, the old people's homes were dealing with a huge influx of patients with Covid-19, many of whom had been sent to them carrying the virus (for whatever reason) having been discharged from hospitals. I would think that the same mistake won't be made a second time.

It does of course mean only 60% of deaths are happening in hospitals, where are the other 40% happening?

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Pre-departure Covid-19 testing will now be required for everyone travelling to England from 04:00 GMT on Monday.

The rules had been due to come into force on Friday, but the government said people needed time "to prepare".

People need time to prepare? So why were parents given roughly 12 hours notice that there kids would not be at school the following day?

Travellers into the UK have had approximately 10 months to prepare for the fact that they should require a test or even have their flight cancelled. 

What an absolute joke.

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1 hour ago, G STAR RAM said:

Pre-departure Covid-19 testing will now be required for everyone travelling to England from 04:00 GMT on Monday.

The rules had been due to come into force on Friday, but the government said people needed time "to prepare".

People need time to prepare? So why were parents given roughly 12 hours notice that there kids would not be at school the following day?

Travellers into the UK have had approximately 10 months to prepare for the fact that they should require a test or even have their flight cancelled. 

What an absolute joke.

Indeed - the messaging around the timing of rule changes has been all over the place from the start. Remember the one that came in on the Monday but was announced on the previous Thursday with the caveat "please don't use this weekend as a last hurrah" - cue the whole country spending the weekend in the pub

The Covid testing for all incoming travellers though - why are we only doing this now? It was being suggested at least 6 months ago as an effective strategy for limiting inbound cases, but we kept being told it was impractical because of the amount of tourist traffic we get.

This suggests that it was possible all along -and yet more questionable decision making

 

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2 hours ago, G STAR RAM said:

Pre-departure Covid-19 testing will now be required for everyone travelling to England from 04:00 GMT on Monday.

The rules had been due to come into force on Friday, but the government said people needed time "to prepare".

People need time to prepare? So why were parents given roughly 12 hours notice that there kids would not be at school the following day?

Travellers into the UK have had approximately 10 months to prepare for the fact that they should require a test or even have their flight cancelled. 

What an absolute joke.

I guess Boris's dad is out of the country and due back on Sunday then.

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24 minutes ago, maxjam said:

Some alarming stats of the cost of the 'hidden pandemic' caused by Covid policies;

 

Reading the "about" section of that website made me feel a bit better about the "shock horror" messaging of the tweet. It's clearly a broad church movement that recognises it has to be about balance, and more accountability for the way govt are handling things. But I do worry that it's just going to get hijacked by the anti-lockdown brigade who will use any weapon they can to try and justify their refusal to comply

 

 

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16 minutes ago, Stive Pesley said:

Reading the "about" section of that website made me feel a bit better about the "shock horror" messaging of the tweet. It's clearly a broad church movement that recognises it has to be about balance, and more accountability for the way govt are handling things. But I do worry that it's just going to get hijacked by the anti-lockdown brigade who will use any weapon they can to try and justify their refusal to comply

 

 

Its run by mates of Farage. Jon Dobinson is a Director. He's also a Director of World4Brexit, a company started by Farage and his backers.

Totally agree with the need for more accountability from Govt, I also believe we should have total transparency from lobby groups, campaigns etc.....

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8 minutes ago, maxjam said:

Almost 1/2m people vaccinated in the Midlands 🙂

 

 

It does seem quite patchy, locally, though.

Purely anecdotally from people I've spoken to, it sounds like around Bakewell they've been well ahead of other areas. My folks live near Chesterfield & they've hardly done any around them. Also same where I live - Newark on Trent.

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Another vaccine - which is being trialled as a one-shot vaccine and needs no special logistics - is finalising data from preliminary trials for submission by the 21st of January.

The CEO seems very confident and "expects to be applying for Emergency Use Authorisation in February."

The UK has 30 million doses of this vaccine on order with an option of 22 million more (bear in mind that this is a one-shot per person vaccine, as well)

https://www.fiercepharma.com/pharma/jpm-j-j-hopes-to-share-phase-3-coronavirus-vaccine-data-very-soon-ceo-says

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2 hours ago, maxjam said:

Some alarming stats of the cost of the 'hidden pandemic' caused by Covid policies;

 

From that article: "The other is the hidden pandemic caused by Covid policies, which has taken place in the home and shows no variation with the seasons. Excess deaths in the home have been consistently above average every week from March onwards, with a small rise during the Spring lockdown."

 

From the ONS:

image.png.56021eb79b4a76c0876c1271cdd9f0b7.png

Excess non-covid deaths mostly occurred at the start of lockdown, and tracked the 5 year average quite well thoughout the rest of the year. I would have expected deaths as a result of mental health and untreated diseases to have occurred later on. The more plausible explanation for the excess non-covid deaths would actually be unaccounted covid deaths. I'm sure we'll see a bit of a surge as a result of unemployment coming up though

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1 hour ago, uttoxram75 said:

Its run by mates of Farage. Jon Dobinson is a Director. He's also a Director of World4Brexit, a company started by Farage and his backers.

Totally agree with the need for more accountability from Govt, I also believe we should have total transparency from lobby groups, campaigns etc.....

I didn't look into who owned it, so thanks for that. Sounds like my suspicions about it being hijacked for the wrong reasons might not be too far off .The  Donate Now button should have been a clue

 

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2 hours ago, uttoxram75 said:

Its run by mates of Farage. Jon Dobinson is a Director. He's also a Director of World4Brexit, a company started by Farage and his backers.

Totally agree with the need for more accountability from Govt, I also believe we should have total transparency from lobby groups, campaigns etc.....

 

46 minutes ago, Stive Pesley said:

I didn't look into who owned it, so thanks for that. Sounds like my suspicions about it being hijacked for the wrong reasons might not be too far off .The  Donate Now button should have been a clue

I don't really care who owns it tbh - the obviously aren't lockdown cultists, but neither are they rabid anti-vaxxers. 

IMO they have a list of '5 reasonable demands', highlight 'unseen' deaths lockdowns are causing and seek greater transparency and debate - which imo are all commendable.

Not sure what clue the donate button should or shouldn't have given you?  Both the Tories and Labour have one in plain sight on their websites - and the Recovery Campaign website states clearly what donations will be spent on.

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3 hours ago, Wolfie said:

It does seem quite patchy, locally, though.

Purely anecdotally from people I've spoken to, it sounds like around Bakewell they've been well ahead of other areas. My folks live near Chesterfield & they've hardly done any around them. Also same where I live - Newark on Trent.

My sister in law lives in Clay Cross and had a first jab on Saturday less than a five minute walk from her house. She has an appointment in place for her second on 3rd April. 

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