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2 hours ago, FindernRam said:

The much worried about second wave just hasn't happened in the previously worst affected countries, Spain, Italy, France. 

Why are we expected to be so much different?

 

Cu I've just got back from a picnic at Foremark reservoir and the idiocy is off the scale.  Clans of people clearly not from the same household letting their kids swarm all over each other and around other groups of people.  Loads of Villa & Birmingham City shirts so I'm assuming they've come at least 20 miles for a walk about.  All flaunting the rules, and not giving a toss cus Boris has eased off.  Herd immunity will happen simply through our collective stupidity...

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1 hour ago, Archied said:

To be honest I really believe the most effective thing  to beat this virus is going to be ordinary people in the U.K. using a mixture of they’re common sense and wariness of the virus ,

I fully believe the government has just got further and further lost the more this goes on , of course mistakes have expectedly been made due to the nature of facing a situation totally new To us but we don’t seem to be learning from mistakes and formulating well thought out reasoned plans of action that people can see make sense and get behind and there really just seems evasiveness regards figures for deaths , testing and the stage that track and trace is actually at 

There is an interesting article in the FT written by Robert Shrimsley, which is essentially pointing to the government now taking decisions based upon politics and quietly dropping "we will be guided by the science".

Here are a couple of snippets....


The Office for National Statistics suggests there are 8,000 new infections a day, many asymptomatic. Ministers admit privately they thought the numbers would be in the low hundreds by now.

The difficulty is that, for economic activity to pick up, people — especially the middle-aged and older — must still believe the government is putting health first. Hence, his insistence that his five tests for easing have been met when in truth, the UK is barely meeting three.

These resonate with me, as my issue with this government is the shifting of message and lack of acknowledgement of doing so. This was evident in the Cummings case - it's not what he did, he was how it was described (or not).

I appreciate that there is a very difficult balance to strike. But we seem to have lost openness and maturity to be able to have that debate at a level. There is the odd comment such as Raab saying "we cannot stay in lockdown forever". But having tied themselves to some metrics for political expediency, it appears that ground is being shifted without sensible debate on the topic.

It seems clear we are taking a risk on the second wave or not - and we were always likely to have to do so. It would be helpful I think for the government to acknowledge that rather than fall back on more wartime rhetoric "beaten the virus" "flattened the curve" "saved the NHS"...

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21 hours ago, Mucker1884 said:

Most places are now starting to be allowed to re-open to the public... well, those places that can accommodate social distancing etc. 
I suspect once places like football stadiums  and cinemas have done their calculations, they won't want to bother opening up whilst keeping everyone 2m apart, as it won't be financially viable.

 

Using Google Earth as a measure, The East stand roof is c. 28m front to back.  Lets be generous, and round it up to 30m, because I like you.  I'll also ignore the fact that, on plan view, the roof extends further towards the pitch than the front row of seats do.  

So, 30m divided by 2m (social distance) means the number of people in each column (from front to back) = 15.

Now, ignoring the rounded corners, (for now... bear with me!) the straight section of The East stand is c. 117m.  Let's maintain the generosity, and call it 120m.

So, 120m divided by 2m (social distance) means each row of people from end to end = 60. 

That's 15 rows x 60 people = 900 people allowed in the main (straight section) of The East Stand.

Let's multiply that by 4, to cover the other 3 stands, and the corner.  We're now looking at 3,600 fans, for the whole stadium.

Add a few dozen for the slightly larger West Stand, but take them away again, because let's face it, I have been generous with the tape measure!

By the time Mel has paid the wages for the stewards to look after the full stadium, and the cleaners to mop up after we've all gone home again, I doubt there's be much left in the kitty from what 3,600 fans would be paying to watch the game!

 

... And don't even think about asking how long we'd need for half time, so we can all go for a wee!   

 

That’s all well and good but you have not factored in people who live together.   CAn you revisit please and let us have a more accurate estimate please?

?

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Now, the new quarantine rules - which are expected to be set out on Wednesday - will allow people subject to the 14-day restrictions to leave their place of isolation for a number of reasons, including shopping for food or to attend a funeral.

The Prime Minister's official spokesman said: "I think there will be a limited set of exemptions, just as there was during the nationwide lockdown.

"For example I would expect people only to be able to leave the property in which they are quarantining if they need urgent medical treatment, support from social services, food or medicine which they cannot get delivered or get anybody else to bring to them, an emergency in the place they are staying – such as a fire – or to attend a funeral of a close relative."

Travellers will also be able to board public transport from the port or airport to where they will quarantine, although they will be encouraged to use private vehicles instead.

The guidance "suggests that people should take private vehicles wherever possible", the spokesman said.

just carry on as normal when you get off the plane then apart from going to the park or pub for a couple of weeks. This is never going to work.

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8 hours ago, Eddie said:

We didn't lock down with the same vigour and thoroughness - and when we did take action, we were a couple of weeks late and when we relaxed said lockdown we were a couple of weeks too early? Our government are now suggesting that 2 metres is double what is required for effective social distancing, and some are saying that the proposed quarantine for visitors to these shores should not take place.

Perhaps you are right. Perhaps it will burn itself out - someone on here has already predicted that will be the case, citing an Italian clinician (Alberto Zangrillo - a man whose credentials include the fact that he used to be the personal physician of Silvio Berlusconi) who claimed that those being infected now do not show 'as much' viable virus as before, although the WHO say that his conclusions are not supported by science.

I don't know. I'll hope for the best but prepare for the worst.

 

Yeah but as long as you stay alert you’ll be ok.

its a pity the damned virus is too small to see.

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23 hours ago, Mucker1884 said:

Most places are now starting to be allowed to re-open to the public... well, those places that can accommodate social distancing etc. 
I suspect once places like football stadiums  and cinemas have done their calculations, they won't want to bother opening up whilst keeping everyone 2m apart, as it won't be financially viable.

 

Using Google Earth as a measure, The East stand roof is c. 28m front to back.  Lets be generous, and round it up to 30m, because I like you.  I'll also ignore the fact that, on plan view, the roof extends further towards the pitch than the front row of seats do.  

So, 30m divided by 2m (social distance) means the number of people in each column (from front to back) = 15.

Now, ignoring the rounded corners, (for now... bear with me!) the straight section of The East stand is c. 117m.  Let's maintain the generosity, and call it 120m.

So, 120m divided by 2m (social distance) means each row of people from end to end = 60. 

That's 15 rows x 60 people = 900 people allowed in the main (straight section) of The East Stand.

Let's multiply that by 4, to cover the other 3 stands, and the corner.  We're now looking at 3,600 fans, for the whole stadium.

Add a few dozen for the slightly larger West Stand, but take them away again, because let's face it, I have been generous with the tape measure!

By the time Mel has paid the wages for the stewards to look after the full stadium, and the cleaners to mop up after we've all gone home again, I doubt there's be much left in the kitty from what 3,600 fans would be paying to watch the game!

 

... And don't even think about asking how long we'd need for half time, so we can all go for a wee!   

 

And no-one can pass each other on a row. 
 

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2 hours ago, Angry Ram said:

That’s all well and good but you have not factored in people who live together.   CAn you revisit please and let us have a more accurate estimate please?

?

Whilst you are correct, and I did indeed unintentionally forget to include groups from the same household and/or Siamese Twins (Do they do Siamese Triplets, I wonder?), you hardly need me to recalculate the actual figure for you. 
Just take my initial calculation, multiply it by the cosine of the hypotenuse of the East Stand Roof pitch (in degrees...Celsius), then divide by pi (3.14159265359, obvs).  That will give you the square root, so just multiply that by itself, and hey presto, you have the new improved definitive answer... It's hardly rocket science!

"Estimate"... You ask me for an estimate?  How very dare you!   

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44 minutes ago, Mucker1884 said:

Whilst you are correct, and I did indeed unintentionally forget to include groups from the same household and/or Siamese Twins (Do they do Siamese Triplets, I wonder?), you hardly need me to recalculate the actual figure for you. 
Just take my initial calculation, multiply it by the cosine of the hypotenuse of the East Stand Roof pitch (in degrees...Celsius), then divide by pi (3.14159265359, obvs).  That will give you the square root, so just multiply that by itself, and hey presto, you have the new improved definitive answer... It's hardly rocket science!

"Estimate"... You ask me for an estimate?  How very dare you!   

Indeed there is such a thing as Siamese Triplets. Apparently Derby is the epicentre globally, So indeed we need rail seating installed ASAP.  Mel will be rubbing his hands together. 

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49 minutes ago, FindernRam said:

Ahh! BUT the T&T says close contact for 15 mins.

 

48 minutes ago, FindernRam said:

And with so few people-- What traffic

 

The traffic comment was a joke, based entirely on the small numbers in attendance, hence my laughing emoji.  Obviously failed!

You got me on the 15 minutes though... Although some of the old guys on my row always seem to take about 15 mins to eff off out the way, whilst the game's still on!   ?   

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On 01/06/2020 at 19:29, SchtivePesley said:

But at least you might finally be able to have a wee without some beered-up fat bloke next to you splashing back on you with his turbo lager-propelled stream of urine on aluminium

I made the mistake of going for a wee at half time when we had the record 41,238 crowd in the old Baseball Ground. It's a wonder nobody floated away.

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