Millenniumram Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 3 hours ago, Srg said: Pretty amazing what you can do from the back when you don’t play 4 players who are terrible at it. Pretty amazing what happened second half when we went back to those same 4 players at the back as well. But if I speak... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 4 minutes ago, Millenniumram said: Pretty amazing what happened second half when we went back to those same 4 players at the back as well. But if I speak... So weds weren’t battering us and we lost composure before the sub ? We were doing just great after half time then we subbed and it all went wrong?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srg Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 14 minutes ago, Millenniumram said: Pretty amazing what happened second half when we went back to those same 4 players at the back as well. But if I speak... I’m banking on Cocu realising all of this, hence his recruitment of te Wierik, and at the moment he’s in a weird position of wanting to be a bit more solid whilst also realising it causes us to struggle to build out from the back. All conjecture, obviously. Maybe he thinks Davies is in fact Laporte. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 18 minutes ago, Archied said: So weds weren’t battering us and we lost composure before the sub ? We were doing just great after half time then we subbed and it all went wrong?? Not as badly as they were after the sub. If you genuinely think the sub improved things then you’re watching a very different game to me. Yes we weren’t as good even from the start of the second half, because Wednesday weren’t as bad as first half - they were hardly likely to be. But there was no need for Davies to come on - yes they were playing long, but it was to Jordan Rhodes, hardly the biggest aerial threat. They’d taken their best threat in the air off at half time in fletcher. Davies coming on meant we lost pace at the back, which contributed towards the goal they scored - there was a similar attack before the sub that Wisdom stopped because he was still a centre back and quick enough to get back. It also meant that we lost our ability to distribute from the back, and were forced long rather than playing our natural game - our poor pass success rate after the sub evidences this. If we’d have held patience with the same 11 from the first half we’d have regained control of the game second half imo. We won the game so it doesn’t matter, but I’m not sure why just because we won means that we have to think every decision the manager made was correct. Just like you don’t ignore positives when you win, you shouldn’t ignore negatives when you lose. It was a poor, negative substitution that could have been problematic if Wednesday were better/ if our lead wasn’t so strong. Sometimes bringing on a defender is the right move, I don’t think it was yesterday, simple as that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 10 minutes ago, Srg said: I’m banking on Cocu realising all of this, hence his recruitment of te Wierik, and at the moment he’s in a weird position of wanting to be a bit more solid whilst also realising it causes us to struggle to build out from the back. All conjecture, obviously. Maybe he thinks Davies is in fact Laporte. I think he does, but I also think he needs to be a bit braver. Our goal scoring record since Rooney joined is good enough to not worry so much about the defence imo for the time being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 1 minute ago, Millenniumram said: Not as badly as they were after the sub. If you genuinely think the sub improved things then you’re watching a very different game to me. Yes we weren’t as good even from the start of the second half, because Wednesday weren’t as bad as first half - they were hardly likely to be. But there was no need for Davies to come on - yes they were playing long, but it was to Jordan Rhodes, hardly the biggest aerial threat. They’d taken their best threat in the air off at half time in fletcher. Davies coming on meant we lost pace at the back, which contributed towards the goal they scored - there was a similar attack before the sub that Wisdom stopped because he was still a centre back and quick enough to get back. It also meant that we lost our ability to distribute from the back, and were forced long rather than playing our natural game - our poor pass success rate after the sub evidences this. If we’d have held patience with the same 11 from the first half we’d have regained control of the game second half imo. We won the game so it doesn’t matter, but I’m not sure why just because we won means that we have to think every decision the manager made was correct. Just like you don’t ignore positives when you win, you shouldn’t ignore negatives when you lose. It was a poor, negative substitution that could have been problematic if Wednesday were better/ if our lead wasn’t so strong. Sometimes bringing on a defender is the right move, I don’t think it was yesterday, simple as that. Was going to reply but thought better of it , will send copy of post to the club as it’s very very clear cocu is in desperate need of your help and expertise , I’m guessing he doesn’t know for certain what would the outcome be had he not made the sub unlike yourself ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 2 minutes ago, Archied said: Was going to reply but thought better of it , will send copy of post to the club as it’s very very clear cocu is in desperate need of your help and expertise , I’m guessing he doesn’t know for certain what would the outcome be had he not made the sub unlike yourself ? Damn, right then let’s just shut down the forum then. Evidently I’m not allowed an opinion because I’m not a football manager. Anyone else on here not a pro football manager? Afraid you’re not allowed to comment on anything anymore. There’s no possible way that you can ever be right, unlike football managers who are correct with literally every decision they make. Where on earth have I said I’m so sure of the outcome had the sub not been made? I said IN MY OPINION we’d have fared better not making the sub. No one can know for sure, but that’s my opinion which I’m entitled to having watched the game before and after the sub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 2 minutes ago, Millenniumram said: Damn, right then let’s just shut down the forum then. Evidently I’m not allowed an opinion because I’m not a football manager. Anyone else on here not a pro football manager? Afraid you’re not allowed to comment on anything anymore. There’s no possible way that you can ever be right, unlike football managers who are correct with literally every decision they make. Where on earth have I said I’m so sure of the outcome had the sub not been made? I said IN MY OPINION we’d have fared better not making the sub. No one can know for sure, but that’s my opinion which I’m entitled to having watched the game before and after the sub. Make your points all day but don’t cry when I tell you in my opinion your opinion is total rubbish , cocu sent on subs to battle and win us a game where the momentum and weds had changed up and what’s more there’s a big point nobody has picked up on ,, there was a foul committed by Shinnie in they’re half with them about to break on us at 3-1 that was exactly the point cocu made after the loss to qpr when a foul like that should have been made , shows me he’s got half a clue about what he’s watching and is telling players exactly what he wants and expects from them when he sends them on to get a job done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 19 minutes ago, Archied said: Was going to reply but thought better of it , will send copy of post to the club as it’s very very clear cocu is in desperate need of your help and expertise , I’m guessing he doesn’t know for certain what would the outcome be had he not made the sub unlike yourself ? You stated there was no need for Davies to come on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 19 minutes ago, Archied said: Make your points all day but don’t cry when I tell you in my opinion your opinion is total rubbish , cocu sent on subs to battle and win us a game where the momentum and weds had changed up and what’s more there’s a big point nobody has picked up on ,, there was a foul committed by Shinnie in they’re half with them about to break on us at 3-1 that was exactly the point cocu made after the loss to qpr when a foul like that should have been made , shows me he’s got half a clue about what he’s watching and is telling players exactly what he wants and expects from them when he sends them on to get a job done Who’s crying? Seems more like you than me? All I’ve done I said you must have been watching a different game to me, and explained my opinion to you. It’s you who’s thrown the “you’re not a football manager so who are you to have an opinion” ******** line around. I’ve got no issue if you want to tell me my opinions rubbish, but I’m still gonna defend it, because it’s what I believe based on the game that I watched. Of course Cocu sent on the subs to try and counter Wednesdays improvement, I’ve never doubted that. All I’ve said is from what I saw it didn’t work, we were under the cosh before the sub, and were still under the cosh afterwards. For me, it wasn’t necessary - I think if we’d have been more patient we’d have regained control of them game. I can’t be sure, but that’s how I saw the game. It doesn’t even matter regardless because we were so utterly brilliant in the first half that the game was wrapped up. But it leaves me slightly concerned for future games, that’s my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 16 minutes ago, Millenniumram said: Who’s crying? Seems more like you than me? All I’ve done I said you must have been watching a different game to me, and explained my opinion to you. It’s you who’s thrown the “you’re not a football manager so who are you to have an opinion” ******** line around. I’ve got no issue if you want to tell me my opinions rubbish, but I’m still gonna defend it, because it’s what I believe based on the game that I watched. Of course Cocu sent on the subs to try and counter Wednesdays improvement, I’ve never doubted that. All I’ve said is from what I saw it didn’t work, we were under the cosh before the sub, and were still under the cosh afterwards. For me, it wasn’t necessary - I think if we’d have been more patient we’d have regained control of them game. I can’t be sure, but that’s how I saw the game. Your the one that cried close the forum down when challenged, it’s wrong to point out that you actually don’t have the first clue about being a pro manager at a high level and as such I value the expertise of cocu planets beyond your opinion which having read is full of contradictions hindsight and imagined scenarios if only cocu had done things your way? , post your opinion all day every day ,if people agree with it they will tell you and if they think it’s garbage they will pull you so don’t twist it ,nobody saying you can’t post your opinions just pointing out they may in they’re opinion be rubbish and why you may not be best qualified to know better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Srg Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 7 minutes ago, Archied said: Your the one that cried close the forum down when challenged, it’s wrong to point out that you actually don’t have the first clue about being a pro manager at a high level and as such I value the expertise of cocu planets beyond your opinion which having read is full of contradictions hindsight and imagined scenarios if only cocu had done things your way? , post your opinion all day every day ,if people agree with it they will tell you and if they think it’s garbage they will pull you so don’t twist it ,nobody saying you can’t post your opinions just pointing out they may in they’re opinion be rubbish and why you may not be best qualified to know better Don’t think you’re making a lot of sense with this argument here, pal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chadlad Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 17 minutes ago, Archied said: Your the one that cried close the forum down when challenged, it’s wrong to point out that you actually don’t have the first clue about being a pro manager at a high level and as such I value the expertise of cocu planets beyond your opinion which having read is full of contradictions hindsight and imagined scenarios if only cocu had done things your way? , post your opinion all day every day ,if people agree with it they will tell you and if they think it’s garbage they will pull you so don’t twist it ,nobody saying you can’t post your opinions just pointing out they may in they’re opinion be rubbish and why you may not be best qualified to know better No need for all of this. Just accept that different people often have different opinions. You shouldn't be on the forum if you have a problem with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millenniumram Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 43 minutes ago, Archied said: Your the one that cried close the forum down when challenged, it’s wrong to point out that you actually don’t have the first clue about being a pro manager at a high level and as such I value the expertise of cocu planets beyond your opinion which having read is full of contradictions hindsight and imagined scenarios if only cocu had done things your way? , post your opinion all day every day ,if people agree with it they will tell you and if they think it’s garbage they will pull you so don’t twist it ,nobody saying you can’t post your opinions just pointing out they may in they’re opinion be rubbish and why you may not be best qualified to know better I said close the forum down because of your post crying that I couldn’t have an opinion because I’m not a football manager?. Jesus wept man, this place sometimes honestly?. I don’t expect you to value my opinion more than Cocus, where have I Said that? There’s a reason why he’s a pro football manager and I’m not - because he’ll get far more decisions right than I would in his place. That’s fact and I don’t dispute it. That doesn’t mean he’s ALWAYS right though and us fans are ALWAYS wrong. FWIW I know quite a number of people involved in football at the highest level, both managers and otherwise. I’ve had some very interesting conversations about what it’s like making the big decisions both on and off the pitch, so believe me I understand how difficult it is sometimes, and I don’t for a second think Cocu has it easy. I don’t expect you or anyone to agree with my opinion, I’ve literally never said that. Disagree all you want, but don’t expect me to not respond and defend my opinion when you do. You literally just insinuated a couple of posts back that I can’t have an opinion because I’m not Cocu? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Can't believe there's an argument on here that I'm not involved in. What's the world coming to? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Van der MoodHoover Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Curtains incoming.....3....2.....1 Are you saying Cloughie never hooked Roymac or Todd or Nish....? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramarena Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 15 minutes ago, Van der MoodHoover said: Curtains incoming.....3....2.....1 Are you saying Cloughie never hooked Roymac or Todd or Nish....? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ossieram Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 We won 3-1 yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Durden Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 2 hours ago, Archied said: Your the one that cried close the forum down when challenged, it’s wrong to point out that you actually don’t have the first clue about being a pro manager at a high level and as such I value the expertise of cocu planets beyond your opinion which having read is full of contradictions hindsight and imagined scenarios if only cocu had done things your way? , post your opinion all day every day ,if people agree with it they will tell you and if they think it’s garbage they will pull you so don’t twist it ,nobody saying you can’t post your opinions just pointing out they may in they’re opinion be rubbish and why you may not be best qualified to know better If any post is worthy of a laughing emoji...or imogi...then this has to be it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clough08 Posted March 1, 2020 Share Posted March 1, 2020 Thought the subs were sensible response to Wickham and Windass coming on and Wednesday putting more crosses in. Sure we sacrificed a bit of fluidity at the back but were in danger of getting overpowered by high balls. All good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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