Comrade 86 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 I'm not really getting the whole devil's advocate piece. We've heard the audio, we've read the transcripts and I'm genuinely perplexed by those insinuating that he's simply 'misspoken'. Had this been the case then surely he would have issued an apology by now and explained what it was he was trying to say. That has not happened and his silence is pretty damning, in my opinion at least. When this happened I suggested that an apology, if unequivocal and heartfelt, might suffice. The BBC themselves have taken time out to edit the podcast and re-release it yet they too have sat quietly behind a wall of silence. As such, I can see literally no plausible defence any longer, especially when even Derby have taken time to release a club statement. On a weekend where we've had the death of a presenter, a 13 year old telling Jayden to kill himself and now this, one might be forgiven for thinking that a rather more prompt response would have been entirely appropriate. Be assured, lawyers work weekends if paid to do so! As for the argument that disciplining the likes of Ramage somehow detracts from more overt cases of racism, I call BS. The message it conveys to anyone who cares to consider it is that if this kind of comment leads to disciplinary action, then more severe instances will most certainly do so as well. Zero tolerance policies must be precisely that so it is allowing comments like the one in question to go unchecked that causes issues, not addressing them. Had Ramage at least attempted to diffuse the situation, I may have retained some sympathy. As it is, he and the BBC are clearly considering their options and have prioritised that course of action and the required damage limitation protocols over the more obvious way forward, that being to simply admit their mistake and offer redress. The innocent parties here are Jayden and Max, not Ramage and the idiot programme editor at the BBC who first seemingly ignored the live transmission, then passed the subsequent podcast for upload. At this point I really hope we can show that us fans are unified in our stance. Anything less and we stand to drag the name of our club through the sewers yet again and that simply cannot and should not be allowed to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubbles Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 102.1FM RamsTV Radio incoming... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeedsCityRam Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 26 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: Nothing inconsistent. He mentioned young black players in an interview where he was primarily talking about young players. He was singling out young players. He was wrong to mention the colour of their skin. Let's be honest if he had named Bogle and Lowe by name we would probably still have had the same reaction. Absolutely not. Its the reference to the colour of their skin that is the aggravating factor & its pretty disingenuous to suggest naming a player to then criticise would lead to the same reaction. He may have had a legitimate comment to make about young players but he didn't reference Max Bird (despite having criticised him earlier) Why do you think he was talking about young players as a whole when he stated 'all the young black lads'? He was being specific Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukedcfc Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 I can’t wait for this season to end, we need a fresh start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaspode Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 The problem with Ramage retaining his job is that he will still have to work alongside the players and other employees of the club - whether he apologises or not, he’s probably made his position untenable as they may struggle to accept that he wasn’t showing his true colours with his crass comment. Radio Derby has to have a close relationship with the club in order to do an effective job - they can’t do that if there isn’t trust. I’m afraid Ramage has done serious damage to the relationship and it’s hard to see how he can continue in his role..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 he’ll be sacked, 100%. See Danny Baker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfie20 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 28 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: Nothing inconsistent. He mentioned young black players in an interview where he was primarily talking about young players. He was singling out young players. He was wrong to mention the colour of their skin. Let's be honest if he had named Bogle and Lowe by name we would probably still have had the same As far as his post-match comments were concerned you might be correct since he seemed to include Bird alongside Bogle and Lowe. I don't know much about what goes into producing the podcast but wouldn't that give him a bit more 'thinking time' before saying anything? Not under the same pressure compared within half an hour of the final whistle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 3 minutes ago, LeedsCityRam said: Absolutely not. Its the reference to the colour of their skin that is the aggravating factor & its pretty disingenuous to suggest naming a player to then criticise would lead to the same reaction. He may have had a legitimate comment to make about young players but he didn't reference Max Bird (despite having criticised him earlier) Why do you think he was talking about young players as a whole when he stated 'all the young black lads'? He was being specific Because the conversation didnt start with him referencing black players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ewe Ram Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 1 hour ago, rustylee said: It would be great if they sacked Ramage and Dawes left as well in solidarity dreadful combination them two. Radio Derby hasn’t been worth listening too since Ross Fletcher left. I don’t listen to them unless forced. Dawes verges on bitchy at times and it’s difficult to listen to. Instead of finding any positives they immediately jump to the negatives, it’s boring. Any fool can sling brickbats but it takes knowledge to make comment on the other parts of a game. anyway, what I was quoting you for was that Colin Bloomfield was very good and he was post Fletcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philmycock Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfie20 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 31 minutes ago, Owd miner said: I dunt agree wi wor he said but two players broke law , could ha killed innocent people early in season..but they kept their jobs and played next match... nah I dunt care too much fer spamage but really? Lose his job cause of a comment .. nah he ain't sharpest tool but come on .... smacks a bit of double standards from DCFC.. just mi opinion mi owds Ramage doesn't work for DCFC so where are the double standards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GB SPORTS Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 6 minutes ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said: I'm not really getting the whole devil's advocate piece. We've heard the audio, we've read the transcripts and I'm genuinely perplexed by those insinuating that he's simply 'misspoken'. Had this been the case then surely he would have issued an apology by now and explained what it was he was trying to say. That has not happened and his silence is pretty damning, in my opinion at least. When this happened I suggested that an apology, if unequivocal and heartfelt, might suffice. The BBC themselves have taken time out to edit the podcast and re-release it yet they too have sat quietly behind a wall of silence. As such, I can see literally no plausible defence any longer, especially when even Derby have taken time to release a club statement. On a weekend where we've had the death of a presenter, a 13 year old telling Jayden to kill himself and now this, one might be forgiven for thinking that a rather more prompt response would have been entirely appropriate. Be assured, lawyers work weekends if paid to do so! As for the argument that disciplining the likes of Ramage somehow detracts from more overt cases of racism, I call BS. The message it conveys to anyone who cares to consider it is that if this kind of comment leads to disciplinary action, then more severe instances will most certainly do so as well. Zero tolerance policies must be precisely that so it is allowing comments like the one in question to go unchecked that causes issues, not addressing them. Had Ramage at least attempted to diffuse the situation, I may have retained some sympathy. As it is, he and the BBC are clearly considering their options and have prioritised that course of action and the required damage limitation protocols over the more obvious way forward, that being to simply admit their mistake and offer redress. The innocent parties here are Jayden and Max, not Ramage and the idiot programme editor at the BBC who first seemingly ignored the live transmission, then passed the subsequent podcast for upload. At this point I really hope we can show that us fans are unified in our stance. Anything less and we stand to drag the name of our club through the sewers yet again and that simply cannot and should not be allowed to happen. Exactly this, agree with every letter. Ramage is now making his position untenable. If he had come out with an apology and a promise to self enrol on diversity training he might have got through, but now? I think the club maybe giving the BBC time to get it's own house in order, but if the BBC don't come up with a suitable solution by noon tomorrow I would support Jayden, Max and any other players who were offended by the podcast and ban those involved from PP immediately. What the BBC and RD do after that is their problem DCFC have a duty of care to it's own employees and that must be the paramount consideration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 34 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: Let's be honest if he had named Bogle and Lowe by name we would probably still have had the same reaction. Absolute garbage. We have a whole thread where Max and Jayden have been singled out for criticism (and praise) right here on this forum and not a single accusation of racism has been made. Your comment is utterly ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexxxxx Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 18 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: I dont think I'm a member of any of the groups but I very much doubt there is anyone defending it. Probably some saying it's being blown out of proportion and being misconstrued but would be surprised if there are any defending the comments. Obviously apologies if I am wrong. I'm not gonna post screen grabs but one guy literally said 'well said ramage' and a lot claiming it wasn't racist comment for various reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 2 hours ago, G STAR RAM said: And here we go. Jason Robert's comments incoming in 3-2-1... He wasnt blaming things on our young players of colour. I hope Michael Johnson issues an apology for making things up and fanning the flames.... Denying Ramage's comments were racist in in 3-2-1... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 1 minute ago, alexxxxx said: I'm not gonna post screen grabs but one guy literally said 'well said ramage' and a lot claiming it wasn't racist comment for various reasons. Ok fair enough, in which case I apologise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G STAR RAM Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 1 minute ago, sage said: Denying Ramage's comments were racist in in 3-2-1... Nope comments that definitely meet the definition of racism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbadbob Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 33 minutes ago, Paul71 said: Ok i apologise. I do feel that there was no need for the subsequent post but anyway. I may get over sensitive sometimes having been in the end of one poster directing an attempt to intimidate and bully me recently via a pm. So sorry again. Who was it?what did they say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sage Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 7 minutes ago, G STAR RAM said: Nope comments that definitely meet the definition of racism. So you are denying that Ramage's comments were racist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duracell Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 Disappointed, but not surprised, to see comments on the lines of “can’t you say ANYTHING thee days?” in reference to racist comments. And, for the record, you have never been able to say anything - freedom of speech is not freedom from consequence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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