JoeDerby Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 I still think we lack an identity. How does he want us to play? He mentions fast football playing out from the back but we've probably seen 90 minutes of that this whole season. I think he's got a lot to learn but he seems to be learning fast. I do wish that sometimes we'd press higher and win the ball back further up the pitch. Taking in to account what he's had to go through whilst he's been here, he' doing pretty well. I do think he's the long term answer though, the guy clearly needs time. We need completely stablising and I think he's the guy to take us up. Derby County Championship winners 21/22 season - mark my words Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IslandExile Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 95% in. Standing by for the meltdown and recount if we lose to Brizzle ?♂️ COYR ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 9 minutes ago, IslandExile said: 95% in. Standing by for the meltdown and recount if we lose to Brizzle ?♂️ COYR ? We joke about this but this season (and others) clearly shows how fickle we can be. The odd bad result needs to be outweighed by a clutch of good results and that worries me somewhat as the unity and togetherness that I feel benefits the club top to bottom is such a fragile thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRBee Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 2 hours ago, 86 Schmokes & a Pancake said: We joke about this but this season (and others) clearly shows how fickle we can be. The odd bad result needs to be outweighed by a clutch of good results and that worries me somewhat as the unity and togetherness that I feel benefits the club top to bottom is such a fragile thing. Translate: "odd bad result" = no away win for six months . Funny how people forget history or should it be "rewrite"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archied Posted February 12, 2020 Share Posted February 12, 2020 Voted in and have voted in in all other polls , had a little wobble a while back and stated that I was beginning to have concerns he was right man for us though not enough to want him out now I’m fully on board again, it’s not just results but the performance s are growing in quality and character and I get a vibe that his calm determination ( mistaken for uninspiring) is just what this club needs long term with the direction we have chosen and need to go in regards building from our youth and smarter buying policy rather than hasty panic buys that either don’t improve us or are short term stop gap buys with no sell on chance, as for the tinkering issue I’m beginning to think he wants a squad that can be well drilled and mix and match which perhaps takes more time and work to show fruit than just a same 11 every week approach , Martin is a case in point , he is finding form and very much part of our squad but we are not dependant on him and lost when he is off it a bit or injured or even not best suited to how we want to play against certain opposition, seems waghorn and him can learn from each other and both are pushing each other to better form ,, who knows maybe even jack will catch on? im happy to give cocu and his coaching team time to shape this club and a think given that time he is starting to build ties with our club ,he could go on to be a modern day legend for us , certainly seems to have a touch of integrity about him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jourdan Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 I voted out. I just feel another manager would get more out of this squad, as it stands. The recent run of form has been very good, but it is difficult to ignore the 23 games that preceded it. A season of extremes is what we have seen from Cocu and this team. I need to see a level of consistency. Any team can play well for 9-10 games, and any team can experience a purple patch. At the end of the day, I don’t expect us to continue getting results at over 2 points per game. There is going to be another dip at some point. The results don’t matter at this point. It’s more about the performances. If we show the same quality so prevalent in this recent run, and play with the right intent and the right attitude, the results will organically come. If Cocu can tease out more and more performances of the right standard, the doubters will quickly disappear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannable Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 11 minutes ago, Jourdan said: I voted out. I just feel another manager would get more out of this squad, as it stands. Whilst I agree… I think he’s a builder rather than a coach. Buuuuuuut, there is a clear identity, build from the back, full-backs are the sole width, wingers have freedom. We just aren’t amazing at it. He won’t adapt, he’ll build to that. We’ll be rate in a year or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jourdan Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, cannable said: Whilst I agree… I think he’s a builder rather than a coach. Buuuuuuut, there is a clear identity, build from the back, full-backs are the sole width, wingers have freedom. We just aren’t amazing at it. He won’t adapt, he’ll build to that. We’ll be rate in a year or two. I think Cocu would be a great fit at a club like Brighton or Norwich. Those are jobs that appear to be a ‘builder’s project’, shall we say. I am still not convinced he is the right fit for us and where we are at the moment. It is a massive assumption to suggest so. For a club like ourselves, taking such an approach feels like an overcomplication to me. I don’t think we need a builder at this point. We need a maximiser. Building for 2-3 years in the Championship is understandable if you are a club like Preston or Millwall. But for us, I think it’s dangerous because you are in a division that is very variable and opportunistic in its nature, so being so rigid in your approach and your thinking guarantees very little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ossieram Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 3 hours ago, Jourdan said: I voted out. I just feel another manager would get more out of this squad, as it stands. Who would you replace him with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abu Dhabi Ram Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 3 hours ago, Jourdan said: I think Cocu would be a great fit at a club like Brighton or Norwich. Those are jobs that appear to be a ‘builder’s project’, shall we say. I am still not convinced he is the right fit for us and where we are at the moment. It is a massive assumption to suggest so. For a club like ourselves, taking such an approach feels like an overcomplication to me. I don’t think we need a builder at this point. We need a maximiser. Building for 2-3 years in the Championship is understandable if you are a club like Preston or Millwall. But for us, I think it’s dangerous because you are in a division that is very variable and opportunistic in its nature, so being so rigid in your approach and your thinking guarantees very little. Errrrrrr, we are in massive need of building.... we have a mix of players from different managers that struggle to play together. You talk about a manager who can get 100% out of his squad, we have tried this before... you do remember what happened after Billy Davies? Paper over the cracks, promoted with players that just couldn't hack it in the pl. Frank Lampard did the same, albeit with far more style, but the end result was still failure, but nothing was built... The last time we stuck by a manager, Nigel Clough built the basis of the best side in the last 15 years. We need this again with Cocu, we just cannot keep employing different managers in the hope we stumble across a formula, it doesn't work. Furthermore, we have no money, so anyone coming in cant bring their own players. The green shoots are now clearly evident and the future looks bright. You are right about Cocu too, he would be great at those clubs in the premier league let's hope they dont try to to sign him!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S8TY Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 It takes a lot more work and effort from the coaching staff to get us playing like we did last night than just wanting a quick fix by buying players It is very commendable that Cocu in his short tenure here has a few different formations that he can call on and that players like Martin can be used when needed yet not be entirely missed when left out meaning we aren't reliant on just one formation unlike the Mac days ( good as they were ) Pep took a season to get City playing how he wanted and had bundles of cash to help him along but i saw a lot of similarities in our play last night It is evident we are progressing and yet Cocu had no new signings in Jan so it is very much down to the hard work on the training ground which is showing more now. The City style play we saw at Brizzle was excellent to watch at times with players dropping short into pockets of space and giving easy options to keep the ball with an option of an occasional long ball. Of course City can make this transition a lot easier with outlets with pace like Sterling etc but to see us play with such control was a real pleasure to watch and with a few tweaks here and there especially defensive wise i think we can look forward to some exciting times. Cocu and his team really do deserve some praise because the rotation of positions when we have the ball and the emergence of players like Bird who looks so comfortable in midfield is starting to really look good so credit where it is due If we keep playing like this and get better defensively we will win far more than we lose. Was also quite significant that Cocu mentioned that the defensive frailties are something that needs to improve so maybe expect some changes in the summer as players who cannot defend or learn from there mistakes might be replaced I would think Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BathRam72 Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, Abu Dhabi Ram said: Errrrrrr, we are in massive need of building.... we have a mix of players from different managers that struggle to play together. You talk about a manager who can get 100% out of his squad, we have tried this before... you do remember what happened after Billy Davies? Paper over the cracks, promoted with players that just couldn't hack it in the pl. Frank Lampard did the same, albeit with far more style, but the end result was still failure, but nothing was built... The last time we stuck by a manager, Nigel Clough built the basis of the best side in the last 15 years. We need this again with Cocu, we just cannot keep employing different managers in the hope we stumble across a formula, it doesn't work. Furthermore, we have no money, so anyone coming in cant bring their own players. The green shoots are now clearly evident and the future looks bright. You are right about Cocu too, he would be great at those clubs in the premier league let's hope they dont try to to sign him!!! Well said that man/woman? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Durden Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 Away form is abysmal. For the avoidance of doubt I'm not advocating Cocu out but his failure to at least progress some kind of resolution in coaching out the sloppy goals being conceded is quite rightly becoming more and more difficult to defend. To show some signs of progress I would expect to see clean sheets being generated in away league games between now and the end of the season. If Cocu isn't concerned by our away results then he seriously needs to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BathRam72 Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 2 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said: Away form is abysmal. For the avoidance of doubt I'm not advocating Cocu out but his failure to at least progress some kind of resolution in coaching out the sloppy goals being conceded is quite rightly becoming more and more difficult to defend. To show some signs of progress I would expect to see clean sheets being generated in away league games between now and the end of the season. If Cocu isn't concerned by our away results then he seriously needs to be. I am pretty sure he is concerned, that is why his main target over the January transfer was a defender. As has been said, he inherited this team and hasn't so far been given the time in both pre-season or transfer windows to improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S8TY Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 5 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said: Away form is abysmal. For the avoidance of doubt I'm not advocating Cocu out but his failure to at least progress some kind of resolution in coaching out the sloppy goals being conceded is quite rightly becoming more and more difficult to defend. To show some signs of progress I would expect to see clean sheets being generated in away league games between now and the end of the season. If Cocu isn't concerned by our away results then he seriously needs to be. We all are but last night and Swansea was a million miles away from Charlton,Brentford etc away so we are progressing....if players continue to not learn from there defensive mistakes they will be replaced i should imagine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tombo Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 Disappointing to lose last night but I noticed a lot of the play was almost carbon copied from the U19s game. The way we move the ball and the players positioning is so so similar. Cocu set out to standardise our playing style and it's starting to work. And I can see in the first team huge improvements from the start of the season. I'm starting to feel like we're starting something now and I want to see it through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyler Durden Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 6 minutes ago, S8TY said: We all are but last night and Swansea was a million miles away from Charlton,Brentford etc away so we are progressing....if players continue to not learn from there defensive mistakes they will be replaced i should imagine. Probably a semi rhetorical question but how long do we give these players. This has been a constant from August and now we are halfway through February with no visible signs of progress. If Cocu knows he is constrained by the timings of the transfer windows then ultimately he must accept that he needs to manage the situation himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S8TY Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 2 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said: Probably a semi rhetorical question but how long do we give these players. This has been a constant from August and now we are halfway through February with no visible signs of progress. If Cocu knows he is constrained by the timings of the transfer windows then ultimately he must accept that he needs to manage the situation himself. You can only play the players he has at his disposal and if they aren't learning and getting better then he will no doubt get rid or replace in the summer....if his hands aren't tied by our recruitment team or finances. Back 4 cost us last night and a better keeper will help....one who can command the six yard box from crosses for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo jones Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 33 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said: Away form is abysmal. For the avoidance of doubt I'm not advocating Cocu out but his failure to at least progress some kind of resolution in coaching out the sloppy goals being conceded is quite rightly becoming more and more difficult to defend. To show some signs of progress I would expect to see clean sheets being generated in away league games between now and the end of the season. If Cocu isn't concerned by our away results then he seriously needs to be. 14 minutes ago, Tyler Durden said: Probably a semi rhetorical question but how long do we give these players. This has been a constant from August and now we are halfway through February with no visible signs of progress. If Cocu knows he is constrained by the timings of the transfer windows then ultimately he must accept that he needs to manage the situation himself. Our abysmal defending of crosses has been going on a lot longer than Cocu and August. Even with Davies & Clarke in their we look vulnerable, mostly because our full backs, like most modern full backs, are basically wingers who defend a bit. But as we are so narrow further forward, we rely on them to be the attacking outlet. Improvement from Bogle & Lowe at stopping the crosses coming in is the major improvement we need to see. we should also avoid giving away corners at all cost ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abu Dhabi Ram Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 I think a commanding goal keeper is a must, probably the most important signing we need to make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.