Is Marriott overrated.

[Ted McMinn Football Genius]

Jack Marriott is only as good as the service he receives. Once he’s had a run of matches with Rooney and Martin  in the same starting 11 watch the net burst regularly. 
He needs a good run in the team, he IMHO is the best striker we have (ignoring Rooney, obviously). 

[cannable]

3 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

Who was ours when we were winning the top league 

who is Sheffield United’s this season? 

Not a clue, Dad was in Nanna’s womb and then two when we were winning leagues 

Norwood

[duncanjwitham]

37 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

Rather disingenuous to a lot of our players there

Obviously I was exaggerating a bit for emphasis.  But if you put any of the current holding midfielders in a straight midfield 2, you're going to struggle as they're not mobile enough.  And likewise, if you play people like Holmes or Sibley in a 2, you're restricting their ability to do what they're good at (getting on the ball driving at people, making overlapping runs etc).  And honestly, we don't have *any* wingers who are good enough as proper wingers in a 442 (not inside forwards/number 10s/whatever).  To put it simply, if you want to switch a proper flat 442, you're going to require major surgery to the squad, as well as writing off a load of current academy players.  So there had better be a damn good reason for doing it, and on what we've seen from Marriott so far, I'm not sure it's a good enough reason.

That's not to say we shouldn't try to find another way of using him, but committing wholesale to a flat 442 isn't it IMO.

[Curtains]

21 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

Who was ours when we were winning the top league 

who is Sheffield United’s this season? 

Henry Newton and to some extent Bruce Rioch 

With Todd and McFarland we could get away with Archie and McGovern 

[Steve How Hard?]

For me it's a similar situation to the one with Vydra. Once he gets a sustained run in the side in a position that plays to his strengths then he'll score for fun. It pains me to give Snakey any credit but he did get the best out of Vyds until he decided against using him when we most needed him.

[BathRam72]

1 hour ago, MackworthRamIsGod said:

Goal against Man U

Goal at Wembley

Goal against Chelsea

He scores big goals against big teams.

Well, there is the problem then. We don't play many big teams.

On another point!!!  Why are we picking on Marriott, when truth be known, NONE and I mean NONE of our strikers are exactly doing it are they?

[Millenniumram]

42 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

If he was fit enough he would be starting every game which he hasn’t been and doesn’t look likely to be and I do think that’s all down to himself and his own effort and professionalism but that’s based on what I see - if the penny drops he could do very well but if the penny dropped a long time ago in his mind ultimately he is toast and he has missed a massive opportunity 

Would he? I don’t think he should be, Martin is levels above him as a player. The fitness problems just compound the fact he isn’t going to be a success here for me.

[duncanjwitham]

7 minutes ago, Steve How Hard? said:

For me it's a similar situation to the one with Vydra. Once he gets a sustained run in the side in a position that plays to his strengths then he'll score for fun. It pains me to give Snakey any credit but he did get the best out of Vyds until he decided against using him when we most needed him.

Yeah he got Vydra playing well, but at the expense of making us very one dimensional.  Stop Vydra scoring and you stopped us wholesale.

7 minutes ago, BathRam72 said:

On another point!!!  Why are we picking on Marriott, when truth be known, NONE and I mean NONE of our strikers are exactly doing it are they?

Because the other strikers at least contribute other things to the team if they're not scoring themselves.

[cosmic]

37 minutes ago, Steve How Hard? said:

Welcome back Bris. Wasn't this thread originally called Jack Marriott's a Dud or something like that. 

Yeah stfu Curtains, or we'll have that nobber back on here giving it large thinking he's not full of twaddle.

[RIMBAUD]

not over rated - but 'under fit'

excellent finisher

[mwram1973]

2 hours ago, Ghost of Clough said:

Goal to take use to penalties vs Man Utd in the League Cup
Goal to draw 1-1 vs QPR away
Goal and assist Shef Utd home to win 2-1
Goal and assist in the 4-1 win away to West Brom
Goal in the 3-2 cup loss vs Chelsea
Goal in the 3-1 win at home to Birmingham
Goal and assist in the 2-1 away win to Sheff Weds
Goal away at Wigan to win 1-0
Goal away to Norwich  to win 4-3
Goal to draw at home to Boro 1-1
Goal to draw 2-2 with Southampton in the FA Cup
An assist in the late win vs QPR at home
2 goals to beat Leeds in the playoffs
Goal in the playoff final vs Villa
Goal in the 2-1 loss to Bristol at home
Assist in the 3-2 win vs Birmingham at home
Assist in the 1-1 draw vs Sheff Weds at home
Assist in the 1-1 draw at Wigan
Goal in the 2-1 win vs Barnsely at home

Yeah, but what has Marriott ever done for us !

[BathRam72]

6 minutes ago, duncanjwitham said:

Yeah he got Vydra playing well, but at the expense of making us very one dimensional.  Stop Vydra scoring and you stopped us wholesale.

Because the other strikers at least contribute other things to the team if they're not scoring themselves.

Very true, I hadn't looked at it like that.

Let's keep them in because they run around a lot. Scoring doesn't matter obviously. 

[Curtains]

11 minutes ago, mwram1973 said:

Yeah, but what has Marriott ever done for us !

He is a striker 

[Duracell]

1 hour ago, RoyMac5 said:

Ask why the manager hasn't tried them, it's not up to me. Same as not playing 2 up top.

Genuine question here, how many times have they both been fit and not played together?

[RoyMac5]

1 minute ago, Duracell said:

Genuine question here, how many times have they both been fit and not played together?

Marriott and who? Doesn't matter who. Marriott is our best goal-scorer and he appears never to be fit, but if he was playing him up front on his own wouldn't work.

[Key clubber]

1 hour ago, Millenniumram said:

I’ve said it before, he definitely is. Just like players who make a mistake in a big game (Keogh, Roos) end up being over-criticised for the rest of their time here as a result of the mistake, players who have a special moment in a big game (Bryson, Marriott) tend to be Overrated for the rest of their time here as a result. They seem to be able to get away with far more poor performances and still be bizarrely seen as the saviour. Marriott for me is a pretty poor player at this level. Don’t get me wrong, he’s not awful, and he does certainly have positives in terms of his ability as a poacher when he’s on the end of through balls. But it’s not enough for me. His general play isn’t good enough - he can’t hold a ball up, he doesn’t get involved enough in general play dropping deep, and his finishing is actually quite poor when you look up the stats. 

For me he isn’t good enough. He’s a low end championship quality player, and not good enough for a team gunning for promotion. We need better, and I actually think the plan was to get better this window. I’m certain we wanted Billy Sharp before the investment fell through, and gut feeling tells me we wanted to shift Marriott and replace him with Sharp. With the investment delay I don’t think we now have the funds to do so this window, as we have to focus on the bigger priorities.

I’ll be honest, you lost me at “Marriott is a pretty poor player at this level” . How do we know he never plays more than 3 consecutive games ?

[ram1964]

3 hours ago, duncanjwitham said:

So we get rid of Bielik, Evans, Huddlestone and Bird.  If you're playing a flat 442, then you need proper wingers, so Lawrence, Josefzoon and Bennett can go too.  You're going to struggle to get really attacking midfielders into a flat 442, so Rooney, Holmes and Sibley can go too.  The entire academy are playing some variant of 3 in the middle, playing out from the back, so most of the midfielders can go from there too.  And we need to probably sign at least 8 new players (4 central midfielders, 4 wingers).  So once we've done all of that, we can finally get a striker that's scored less than 1 in 5 in his Derby career into the team?  Sounds like a great plan.

Well it's a plan?,something we've accussed other managers as not having. I personally think he's a good player but as stated can't play up front by himself and doesn't get the game time to perform at his best when selected

[Sparkle]

2 hours ago, duncanjwitham said:

Obviously I was exaggerating a bit for emphasis.  But if you put any of the current holding midfielders in a straight midfield 2, you're going to struggle as they're not mobile enough.  And likewise, if you play people like Holmes or Sibley in a 2, you're restricting their ability to do what they're good at (getting on the ball driving at people, making overlapping runs etc).  And honestly, we don't have *any* wingers who are good enough as proper wingers in a 442 (not inside forwards/number 10s/whatever).  To put it simply, if you want to switch a proper flat 442, you're going to require major surgery to the squad, as well as writing off a load of current academy players.  So there had better be a damn good reason for doing it, and on what we've seen from Marriott so far, I'm not sure it's a good enough reason.

That's not to say we shouldn't try to find another way of using him, but committing wholesale to a flat 442 isn't it IMO.

The question was how to get the best out of Marriott  - actually I think we would be better suited to 352 with the players we have ( but we can’t fit Lawrence into that!) 

2 hours ago, Millenniumram said:

Would he? I don’t think he should be, Martin is levels above him as a player. The fitness problems just compound the fact he isn’t going to be a success here for me.

I would have him starting with Martin if both fit 

[ramsbottom]

8 minutes ago, Sparkle said:

The question was how to get the best out of Marriott  - actually I think we would be better suited to 352 with the players we have ( but we can’t fit Lawrence into that!) 

[sage]

yes