NottsRam77 Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 6 hours ago, BramcoteRam84 said: There is clearly a tactic as to how we want to play, but we didn’t adopt different tactics in the second half, we were just more positive in how we went about it, we passed forward, we didn’t play safe passes we got closer to Boro. The manager doesn’t control the players with a controller or a joystick (showing my age) from the touch line. Players play the game and make the decisions on the pitch. I disagree there was very clearly a tactical change Rooney was visibly moved higher up the pitch and closer to waghorn first half he was clearly playing deep holding mid, second he was alongside and to the left of waghorn there was also visibly more of a direct approach to get them turning compared to first half where we literally refused to unload it early and an insistence to try and play through boro i picked up on it, the boro fan that came on here picked up on it and the radio boro commentary team certainly picked up on it I’m pretty sure anyone else that watched the game will confirm There was a tactical change bud I can assure u Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimRam Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 Stats fans...how many points have we lost by missing our own penalties. 4 I think. How many points lost through penalties against us? Not sure about that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcfcsr92 Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 11 hours ago, Topram said: On way back Hamer 5 way to slow to get us going Lowe 6 tried getting us going Clarke 5 stupid pen solid otherwise Davies 7 solid Bogle 6 tried Rooney 6 tried didnt effect much knight 7 class bird 7 good future Holmes 7 good finish Lawrence 4 offered nothing Waghorn 4 same as Lawrence If Lawrence achually tried and chased back on the run up to the peno Clarke might not of been so rash in his tackle! Dont get me wrong he shouldn't throw himself into a tackle like that in the area but it all came from Lawrence Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mazzaram Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 9 minutes ago, Dcfcsr92 said: If Lawrence achually tried and chased back on the run up to the peno Clarke might not of been so rash in his tackle! Dont get me wrong he shouldn't throw himself into a tackle like that in the area but it all came from Lawrence Disagree with plenty here (and I was also at the match). Hamer was fine. Bogle had a poor game. Clarke was very good, and the 'penalty' was a great tackle. Incompetent ref. Cocu was fuming. Lawrence barely deserved 4. Worst display in a Derby shirt. Can't see why he is being picked. The rest of the team clearly don't like him. There is so much more commitment from the rest when he is not in the side. Waggy put in a shift yesterday. Not great, but worth at least 6. Bloke next to me in the stand was on his back from the first whistle, and for the rest of the game; he'll have a heart attack at that rate. However, Waghorn is not a lone striker. We'd have been better with Martin if we were going to play that way. Good point, terrific finish by Holmes. (Actually, it is the ratings that I really disagreed with. Sorry Dcfcsr92; thought you had done them!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 14 hours ago, DavesaRam said: Very interesting RD interviews - Holmes, when complemented on the really difficult technique to score his goal, said that he thought the ball rolled down his shin, and both he and Cocu said that Clarke got the ball, so it shouldn't have been a penalty. Cocu described it as a ridiculous decision. Sounds like a fair result, with a poor display first half, then came out and shouted "Boo!" at Middlesborough and made them jump, and were the better team for much of the second half. Well done for being able to come from behind twice. And Rams TV, eh? For you locals, there was no live stream available, but because during the winter months I tend to suffer from the odd "cough, cough" or two so, I travelled to Switzerland to watch it. But I couldn't purchase a pay-per-view subscription. So I took my laptop to Holland - it was a hell of a dash - and got the same result. And to listen to the Radio Derby commentary would cost more than to watch the live stream, so I had no option than to travel all the way back to Derby and listen on the old radio. Ho hum. I don't know what it is they've got against us foreigners! Cough cough. Ooops there's another one! 13 hours ago, RamNut said: I had a similar problem. Paid up for a single match view, all ok. Travelled to Holland with my pet bear but it wouldn’t work no matter what. It worked fine for me in the Netherlands. You may need to use a different travel agent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 Didn’t see the performance yet but it’s not a bad result away to a hugely improved Boro team. woodgate has found a solution by promoting five or six young academy graduates and building a young team. 9 players aged under 25; 6 aged 22 or less. That bodes well. we had 5 players aged under 25; 4 aged 22 or less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 Worst player on the pitch (by a fair distance) was Rooney - he seemed to be a ghost in the first half. In the second he was moved further forward, managed to get on the ball a bit more, but to little effect. Lawrence also had a shocking first half, seemingly being asked to play as the furthest man forward most of the time. He had no space to play in and unsurprisingly won nothing in the air (dominated by their CBs). Second half he showed more hunger and desire eventually winning the ball back in the corner before passing to Knight for the goal. His link up play also improved in the second half. Holmes was another who looked lost in the first half. When moved to his best position at half time we saw a massive improvement in his and the rest of the team’s performances. When Holmes plays well, the team plays well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 7 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said: Worst player on the pitch (by a fair distance) was Rooney - he seemed to be a ghost in the first half. In the second he was moved further forward, managed to get on the ball a bit more, but to little effect. Ooh dear.....get ready for @BathRam72 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NottsRam77 Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 14 minutes ago, Ghost of Clough said: Worst player on the pitch (by a fair distance) was Rooney - he seemed to be a ghost in the first half. In the second he was moved further forward, managed to get on the ball a bit more, but to little effect. Lawrence also had a shocking first half, seemingly being asked to play as the furthest man forward most of the time. He had no space to play in and unsurprisingly won nothing in the air (dominated by their CBs). Second half he showed more hunger and desire eventually winning the ball back in the corner before passing to Knight for the goal. His link up play also improved in the second half. Holmes was another who looked lost in the first half. When moved to his best position at half time we saw a massive improvement in his and the rest of the team’s performances. When Holmes plays well, the team plays well. So just to clarify tactical changes ... sorry just in dispute with someone who claims it was desire and hunger that improved us second half not the tactical changes that were made there were very evident tactical changes at half time not only in players positionally but the speed and directness at which unloaded the ball youve helped validate my point Thankyou Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mucker1884 Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 15 hours ago, hintonsboots said: At last some fight away from home. Well done lads. That was a home performance, to be fair. The away team just backed off! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dimmu Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 Just now, Ghost of Clough said: Worst player on the pitch (by a fair distance) was Rooney - he seemed to be a ghost in the first half. In the second he was moved further forward, managed to get on the ball a bit more, but to little effect. Lawrence also had a shocking first half, seemingly being asked to play as the furthest man forward most of the time. He had no space to play in and unsurprisingly won nothing in the air (dominated by their CBs). Second half he showed more hunger and desire eventually winning the ball back in the corner before passing to Knight for the goal. His link up play also improved in the second half. Holmes was another who looked lost in the first half. When moved to his best position at half time we saw a massive improvement in his and the rest of the team’s performances. When Holmes plays well, the team plays well. Rooney was poor but poorer than Lawrence? Or is Tom even counted as he pretty always is? If Lawrence is not included then I agree. If he is, then by fair distance is not correct. Both of them had shockers and the problem is you expect more from Rooney. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DRBee Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 Cocu and his management team have to take some responsibility for the difference between our home performances and those away . To have gone so long without an away win is without recent precedent and can't just be put on the players. Given we could easily have lost again yesterday, there is no immediate sign of getting a win though the two recent away draws are an improvement on the regular 3-0 defeats Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Brolly Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 9 hours ago, Derby blood said: Do not agree the starting 11 was fine, and we got a good point away to the inform team, so what would you have done differently, have you got your badges or do you manage a under 11 team, Cocu will get us in great shape, this time next year we will be top 6 or better. He's allowed to comment weather he's got any coaching qualifications or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NottsRam77 Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 My ratings fwiw hamer .. 6 did ok, maybe could of done a little more with the goal did everything else fine, ultimately He’s not our biggest problem bogle 5. Really really poor today, decision making was terrible, over ran it constantly turned over possession a lot, not overloaded with options at times but was poor by his standards, wisdom will rightly feel a bit pieved after watching that lowe 6 .. some v good, some bad and some downright ugly, not sure what was going through his mind with seconds to play and all the time in the world where he tried a cross field switch that turned over possession and led to them having a final headed chance at goal. like bogle decision making was poor, if they both improve on that then we’ve got some real assets, still way ahead of Malone davies..7 pretty dam solid, won his headers and tackles. clarke 6 like davies won his duels but invited that penalty by going to ground having just had the boro fan’s baying for a pen minutes earlier, I thought he got some of the ball but clearly the ref didn’t bird 7 had some lovely little moments of play, like the rest of the team struggled first half but didn’t hide and most of our good spells were with him as the catalyst second half ... going from strength to strength 7 knight big future, bryson esq energy in spades. Just needs to settle himself down a bit when in possession, let the ball run under his foot a couple of time’s and didn’t get it under when he needed to but gave the midfield mobility and energy in buckets Holmes 6.5 much better second half, clearly lost/wasted deep in midfield but comes alive higher up the pitch. Lovely strike get him high up instead of Lawrence rooney 6 disappointing, was just on the periphery of the game, again better second half and higher up but starved of any sort of possession for long periods combination of us not passing it well enough or early enough and boro giving him little room to operate Lawrence 4 sorry Tom lad but wtf his best moment was winning the ball back to roll back to knight which he had previously Mis controlled. I don’t know what we do with him, he’s currently the most counter productive anti cocu player out there. Cocu wants to play possession based football and Lawrence currently turns possession over like it’s going out of fashion, his work rate is fine and never in question but I think h really needs a spell out for him and the team, Holmes or Rooney can easily play that role much more effectively and I think as has been shown we look a more fluid team without him waghorn 5 terrible,couldn’t make anything stick, lost count the number of times the ball bounced off him, worked hard as per but his ability to make things stick is shocking, but then that’s not his game ... one for the manager that one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Clough Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 13 minutes ago, Dimmu said: Rooney was poor but poorer than Lawrence? Or is Tom even counted as he pretty always is? If Lawrence is not included then I agree. If he is, then by fair distance is not correct. Both of them had shockers and the problem is you expect more from Rooney. I was probably a bit harsh to say “by a fair distance“. The only major differences being Rooney getting caught on the ball in fairly dangerous positions a couple of times in the first half... and Lawrence grafted to get our first goal in the second half. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Comrade 86 Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 10 hours ago, Justa said: I’m not a Cocu out but I don’t agree with you - he still has a lot to prove in my opinion. Poor tactics and selection today even though he couldn’t admit it. Ok so first off, if, by your own assertion, you're not a member of the 'Cocu out' club then clearly you do agree with me, in part at least, as I'm not either, so there's that. Next up, can you clarify which part of my post is the assessment of Cocu with which you disagree? I'm a tad confused as I thought I was just taking the piss out of the borderline bipolar section of our fanbase. Since you've decided to speak for me, allow me to retort. Since mid October, only two sides have gone to Boro and not been beaten and we're one of them. Why then should Cocu roll out the sackcloth and ashes routine, do you think he owes you that? And your clear inference that today's result is symptomatic of a manager who is less tactically astute than you are and knows less about the players at his disposal than you do, is frankly absurd. You do know it is possible to voice an opinion on the game without rubbishing the manager, don't you? Today's was a very good and hard earned point against a team who have troubled much deeper squads than ours. Boro sit top of the form table for the last 10 games, a run of fixtures that included away games at Leeds, Forest, Swansea, West Brom and Preston. Brentford, Fulham, West Brom and Leeds fill the next 4 spaces behind them. In their last three games they've beaten Preston and West Brom away without conceding a single goal and held Spurs to a draw at the Riverside. In the same 10 game period they've lost only twice, away to Leeds and Swansea and they've not lost at home since mid-October but yeah, you know, our tactics, performance and team selection today were really poor, weren't they? To be brutally honest, fans like you who only credit the players when we win and rubbish only the manager when we don't, absolutely boil my piss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IlsonDerby Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 Ratings (from watching it on ramsplayer). Hamer 5 - is the pitch not wide enough for him to keep the ball on it?! Bogle 5 - Is not the same player he was last year, did not play as well as Wisdom did in the previous 2 league games. Lowe 7 - Solid Clarke - 6 Solid but gave away a penalty Davies 7 - Don't remember him doing anything wrong? Bird - 6/7 Maybe harsh but probably needed to be snapping at Wing anytime he was around the 18 yard box Rooney 5/6 - First half was poor, lost possession a lot. Second half much improved. Knight 7 - Grew into the game after a very quiet start Lawrence - 6 should have taken his chance first time rather than trying to cut inside. Was frustrating but wasn't the worst yesterday. Holmes - 7/8 Did the sorts of things we expect from him. Love watching him play. Capped off with a brilliant Shinola. Waghorn - 6 Works like a dog but simply doesn't have that strikers instinct. His attempt when through one on one was so feeble. Takeaway: Hamer, Wisdom Davies Clarke Lowe, Bielek Bird, Holmes Rooney Knight, Marriott would be my team moving forwards when Bielek isn't suspended and Marriott is fit. Hamer, Wisdom Davies Clarke Lowe, Bird Rooney, Holmes Knight Lawrence, Martin would be my team based on who is currently available. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellafella Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 34 minutes ago, NottsRam77 said: My ratings fwiw hamer .. 6 did ok, maybe could of done a little more with the goal did everything else fine, ultimately He’s not our biggest problem bogle 5. Really really poor today, decision making was terrible, over ran it constantly turned over possession a lot, not overloaded with options at times but was poor by his standards, wisdom will rightly feel a bit pieved after watching that lowe 6 .. some v good, some bad and some downright ugly, not sure what was going through his mind with seconds to play and all the time in the world where he tried a cross field switch that turned over possession and led to them having a final headed chance at goal. like bogle decision making was poor, if they both improve on that then we’ve got some real assets, still way ahead of Malone davies..7 pretty dam solid, won his headers and tackles. clarke 6 like davies won his duels but invited that penalty by going to ground having just had the boro fan’s baying for a pen minutes earlier, I thought he got some of the ball but clearly the ref didn’t bird 7 had some lovely little moments of play, like the rest of the team struggled first half but didn’t hide and most of our good spells were with him as the catalyst second half ... going from strength to strength 7 knight big future, bryson esq energy in spades. Just needs to settle himself down a bit when in possession, let the ball run under his foot a couple of time’s and didn’t get it under when he needed to but gave the midfield mobility and energy in buckets Holmes 6.5 much better second half, clearly lost/wasted deep in midfield but comes alive higher up the pitch. Lovely strike get him high up instead of Lawrence rooney 6 disappointing, was just on the periphery of the game, again better second half and higher up but starved of any sort of possession for long periods combination of us not passing it well enough or early enough and boro giving him little room to operate Lawrence 4 sorry Tom lad but wtf his best moment was winning the ball back to roll back to knight which he had previously Mis controlled. I don’t know what we do with him, he’s currently the most counter productive anti cocu player out there. Cocu wants to play possession based football and Lawrence currently turns possession over like it’s going out of fashion, his work rate is fine and never in question but I think h really needs a spell out for him and the team, Holmes or Rooney can easily play that role much more effectively and I think as has been shown we look a more fluid team without him waghorn 5 terrible,couldn’t make anything stick, lost count the number of times the ball bounced off him, worked hard as per but his ability to make things stick is shocking, but then that’s not his game ... one for the manager that one Just satin’ @NottsRam77 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 2 hours ago, Dcfcsr92 said: If Lawrence achually tried and chased back on the run up to the peno Clarke might not of been so rash in his tackle! Dont get me wrong he shouldn't throw himself into a tackle like that in the area but it all came from Lawrence Not forgetting he fought to keep the ball in in the corner and gave the ball to knight who scored. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NottsRam77 Posted January 12, 2020 Share Posted January 12, 2020 23 minutes ago, Ellafella said: Just satin’ @NottsRam77 U think higher ? I was torn between a 4 and 5 I won’t ever question his work rate and it was that which got us that 1st goal.... after he had mid controlled the initial ball to him I hasten to add but his play yesterday was truly shocking, I now resign myself to us losing the ball when he gets it Which is sad but true Iv said previously he’s got premiership quality but a Sunday league brain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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