Derby_Dave Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 18 hours ago, philmycocu said: 2032 is gonna be depressing As long as I'm around to see it I'll be happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StockholmRam Posted January 6, 2020 Author Share Posted January 6, 2020 47 minutes ago, Meowduck said: He certainly scared the crap out of Billy Bremner!!! Bremner won a lot more caps than Mackay ( in the mid 60s too his Scotland caps started) and he never played league football in Scotland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxy Ram Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 1 hour ago, Meowduck said: He certainly scared the crap out of Billy Bremner!!! ❤ Yummy Terry Venables ❤ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldtimeram Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 39 minutes ago, StockholmRam said: Bremner won a lot more caps than Mackay ( in the mid 60s too his Scotland caps started) and he never played league football in Scotland. Of the two players I know who I would have preferred in our team He certainly wasn't ginger either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BathRam72 Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 3 hours ago, RamNut said: Ffs ....i'm glad i'm not you REALLY?? You have no substance in your arguments and when someone goes against you, all you do is respond as above. Very sad really. Also I would like to point out that you dont know me so how can you even comment that you are glad you are not me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 21 minutes ago, BathRam72 said: REALLY?? You have no substance in your arguments and when someone goes against you, all you do is respond as above. Very sad really. Also I would like to point out that you dont know me so how can you even comment that you are glad you are not me? I know you are someone who shows a total lack of respect and appreciation for a truly great player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pearl Ram Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 19 hours ago, Ambitious said: Dave Mackay is obviously a Derby legend and did unthinkable things in a Rams top, but it's not like he was the top international player of his time before joining Derby. He struggled to hold down a place in the Scotland team (only 22 caps) and never played for them during his time here. I guess he may have retired from the International game, not sure, but it's strange for such an iconic player. I'm far too young to remember, but just seems strange looking back. Jesse Lingard has more caps for England than Dave Mackay does for Scotland. Rooney is quite possibly the best player this country has ever seen, in terms of records and accolades it strongly indicates he may well be. I think I’m correct in saying that in the 50’s & 60’s Scots who plied their trade south of the border were known as Anglos and were overlooked in favour of players playing in Scotland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith Happens Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 2 minutes ago, Pearl Ram said: I think I’m correct in saying that in the 50’s & 60’s Scots who plied their trade south of the border were known as Anglos and were overlooked in favour of players playing in Scotland. And now if you have had iron bru once you qualify. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve How Hard? Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 11 minutes ago, Paul71 said: And now if you have had iron bru once you qualify. 22 hours ago, David said: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
europia Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 13 hours ago, ramsbottom said: I bet you're the life and soul at parties... This is a football forum and I was replying to the post. My social life has nothing to do with you actually. Regarding your comment, they do say sarcasm is the lowest form of wit.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Rams Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 23 hours ago, StockholmRam said: Scotland do have a long history of not giving as many caps as they should to super players. Davie Cooper and Alan Hanson fit that quite well and its strange because even though England can be accused of the same thing, especially 70s, its not as though Scotland had the same pool numbers to select from. Dave Mackay was regularly voted into ex pros WORLD eleven...I was lucky enough to see all his matches playing for Derby.The impact he had on us was simply unbelievable.As for Scotland caps I'm pretty sure he suffered 2 broken legs when back then it almost always ended your career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Rams Posted January 6, 2020 Share Posted January 6, 2020 12 hours ago, nogbad van 50 said: I’ve watched Derby since 1964 and Dave Mackay had a real presence about him when he joined us.At Spurs he was revered and absolutely outstanding under Bill Nicholson.He was coming to the end of his career when he joined us,similar to Rooney,but the players all looked up to him .I never forget watching midweek games at the old Baseball Ground and walking back to town with mates and having drinks with him and Willie Carlin in the Irongate Vaults,which is now the Slug and Lettuce ! Try doing that now after a game!! Great captain,hard as nails and kept every player on his toes.I read once he was voted in the top 20 players of all time,that’s how good he was. Completely agree...I was lucky enough to see all Dave's games playing for Derby.He won the double with the fantastic Spurs "push and run" team.The impact and presence he had was incredible.Ive seen him voted into ex pros all time WORLD eleven.The arrival of Mr Rooney the other night was low key by comparison.If he has a quarter of the impact he'll be doing fantastic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyPowell Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 37 minutes ago, Patrick Rams said: Completely agree...I was lucky enough to see all Dave's games playing for Derby.He won the double with the fantastic Spurs "push and run" team.The impact and presence he had was incredible.Ive seen him voted into ex pros all time WORLD eleven.The arrival of Mr Rooney the other night was low key by comparison.If he has a quarter of the impact he'll be doing fantastic. It must be remembered that Mackay walkked into a team consisting of keepers Boulton-Green defenders Daniel-McFarland-Robson midfield Durham--McGovern-Carlin forwards Hinton-Hecter-OHare-Wignall If only Rooney had been added to a squad of that quality..I am not saying that Mackay was not a great player who we watched over a period of time,but Rooney has had 2 games for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Rams Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 8 minutes ago, TommyPowell said: It must be remembered that Mackay walkked into a team consisting of keepers Boulton-Green defenders Daniel-McFarland-Robson midfield Durham--McGovern-Carlin forwards Hinton-Hecter-OHare-Wignall If only Rooney had been added to a squad of that quality..I am not saying that Mackay was not a great player who we watched over a period of time,but Rooney has had 2 games for us. But the squad of that quality only finished 5th from bottom of the second division before big Dave's arrival...They were considered run of the mill 2nd division players...that's the point.Nobody thought they were that great before Dave arrived..that's the unbelievable impact he had . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sunnyhill60 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 17 hours ago, BathRam72 said: What a ridiculous statement. If you are comparing Rooney to Mackay in a Derby shirt after 2 games then of course Mackay will come out on top. But to say Mackay was better over his career compared to Rooney is ludicrous. Take off you sheep tinted glasses and take a look through impartiality. Of course I never said that, I put in bold the bit I was responding to - the notion from the poster that Rooney was the best player the country has ever seen. In the Derby County story Rooney is so far a footnote at the bottom of a page, Mackay is a colossus, but as I posted I hope he will prove to be a massive success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyPowell Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 1 hour ago, Patrick Rams said: But the squad of that quality only finished 5th from bottom of the second division before big Dave's arrival...They were considered run of the mill 2nd division players...that's the point.Nobody thought they were that great before Dave arrived..that's the unbelievable impact he had . actually 1967/68 season we finished 18th Hector scored 24 goals in 68/69 season we won promotion into the then 1st division for the 69/70 season but Mackay had left before we won the league title,Yes as i keep saying Mackay was a very good player who made a difference to the Rams but Derby were not considered to be a great team until they won the 1ST division title after Mackay had left.Also for the final time how can you say that Rooney wont have a similar impact on the evidence of just 2 games Oh and yes i saw every game he played at the BBG season ticket holder in C stand from 1966 onwards before that i was in B stand from 1955 thanks to a generous uncle who took me every week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BathRam72 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 12 hours ago, RamNut said: I know you are someone who shows a total lack of respect and appreciation for a truly great player. No lack of respect to an excellent player at all. Mackay was truly a great player, but sometimes you have to let your sheep tinted glasses let you see reality. Rooney's career and achievements clearly outstrip Mackay's. Wake up and admit it. By the way go take a look and show me where I showed a total lack of respect to Mackay???? No???? because I didn't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RamNut Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 2 hours ago, BathRam72 said: No lack of respect to an excellent player at all. Mackay was truly a great player, but sometimes you have to let your sheep tinted glasses let you see reality. Rooney's career and achievements clearly outstrip Mackay's. Wake up and admit it. By the way go take a look and show me where I showed a total lack of respect to Mackay???? No???? because I didn't The basis of this thread was pretty simple. Someone suggested that rooney was reminiscent of mackay as he was clearly having an influence. Various people agreed with that but noted that mackay was very special at Derby (and before) and wayne would have to do an awful lot to match him. One poster asked what mackay was like and various people tried to answer. You - through your jaundiced goggles - waded in with sarcastic comments wanting the thread closed? And then made another sarky remark concerning roy mcfarlands tribute to Mackay. (You're only missing slagging off cloughy and you've got the set). I think you're missing the point, which is about the influence that he had, all of which suggests you weren't there. For those who were, its very difficult to communicate to those who weren't, just how huge a character he was. The thread was about whether rooney could have the sort of influence that dave had. Brian clough says it in the video "he was the best...to say he was the cornerstone is to under-estimate him....he was Derby County". i'm happy to concur with brian clough. Is he wearing sheep tinted goggles? Hope so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raich Carter Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 1 minute ago, RamNut said: The basis of this thread was pretty simple. Someone suggested that rooney was reminiscent of mackay he was clearly having an influence. ... etc To be fair, I don’t think Bathram was slating Mackay but the emotions it’s raising clearly illustrates how much of an impact he had. He was before my time but I love the fact so many who were there are defending him so staunchly - it says a lot about the bloke. Let’s try and be positive eh. Rooney could, just could, get this season going and bring some much-needed entertainment. It’s unlikely he, nor anyone else, would ever have as much impact as Mackay as that’s clearly a very tall order so not to Rooney’s detriment either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BathRam72 Posted January 7, 2020 Share Posted January 7, 2020 On 05/01/2020 at 21:32, RamNut said: It is a valid comparison. Not sure that wayne is quite as good as Dave ?? the young players are comparable with gems like McGovern and robson not sure we've quite got a les green, a mcfarland or a hector though. 23 minutes ago, RamNut said: The basis of this thread was pretty simple. Someone suggested that rooney was reminiscent of mackay as he was clearly having an influence. Various people agreed with that but noted that mackay was very special at Derby (and before) and wayne would have to do an awful lot to match him. One poster asked what mackay was like and various people tried to answer. You - through your jaundiced goggles - waded in with sarcastic comments wanting the thread closed? And then made another sarky remark concerning roy mcfarlands tribute to Mackay. (You're only missing slagging off cloughy and you've got the set). I think you're missing the point, which is about the influence that he had, all of which suggests you weren't there. For those who were, its very difficult to communicate to those who weren't, just how huge a character he was. The thread was about whether rooney could have the sort of influence that dave had. Brian clough says it in the video "he was the best...to say he was the cornerstone is to under-estimate him....he was Derby County". i'm happy to concur with brian clough. Is he wearing sheep tinted goggles? Hope so. Just to clarify. I was there and yes I concur in the context that Rooney will have to do magic to replicate what Mackay did at Derby. But as you see I have re-posted your first and original post on this thread which quite clearly states, (and I am now quoting). Not sure that wayne is quite as good as Dave. No where in there does it say at Derby? Ergo I was purely answering you comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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